iOS � As a custom multitimbral alternative to hardware

[drawback]

For those of us who have been on this learning curve lately, Ive been thinking about starting an iOS player thread, based on my own recent experiences. Through a lot of trial & error, bits of money adding up... Ive had some breakthroughs I've wanted to share. I hope others looking to building a custom keyboard setup using iOS as your sound module & interface will contribute.

 

You know I'm not any kind of an engineer so excuse me if any conclusions are scientifically inaccurate (reminds me of the old joke about how far a scientist can tell a frog to jump on 4, 3, 2, 1 legs, and then at 0 he can't get the frog to jump and concludes the frog is deaf) and I've been around here long enough to know that those of you who know better, will correct me with kindness. Sven notwithstanding.

 

Im using Ravenscroft iOS, Neo-Soul Keys, iFretless Bass (2 instances), Synth One, and Soft Drummer right now, and have been looking for a host app.

 

The best I've found is [url:https://kymatica.com/apps/aum]Kymatica AUM[/url] the last host I tried when I was at the end of my iOS rope and it's the only one thats worked properly and intuitively with everything Ive thrown at it. Eureka!

 

Other host-type apps such as Camelot Pro, iMidiPatchBay, Audiobus/Midiflow Splitter, have problems loading all these instruments/AUv3s at once. The most disconcerting is crashing, appearing to be caused by [url:https://micropyramid.com/blog/understanding-audio-quality-bit-rate-sample-rate/]sample rate[/url] mismatches. Every source you're accessing needs to stream at the same rate, either 44.1KHz or 48, but they all have to be consistent or chaos ensues.

 

Research on various iOS forums and my own trials has led to Ravenscroft as the big dog that just wont play with the others. It seems that whatever else is running, Ravenscroft likes to force its own preferred though inconsisent sample rate on the others, resulting in these mismatches overloading CPU (clearly seen in Camelot), a cacophony of transposed, distorted notes, hangups and crashes. UVI has even implied that in the latest Support Ticket round that Ravenscroft iOS was more or less designed as a standalone, so I should just be happy with what theyve handed to me from the mountaintop, and oh yeah, my iPad 2018 2GB probably isnt powerful enough to play multi-apps anyway.

 

Well, it turns out AUM will load AUv3, IAA, but also appears to state-save down to the sample rate that is the key to everything. Every time I load my setup in AUM its stable and predictable. You can turn off in-app fx, and use Kymaticas suite of add-ons in the mixer stage, streamlining the load.

 

Ive been watching a lot of the [url:https://m.youtube.com/user/thesoundtestroom/videos]Sound Test Room [/url] vids and have seen him use AUM almost exclusively. Thats a great resource - although you have to be patient with his eccentricities. Also theres a great updating list of [url:http://synthyfrog.com/technology-is-audiounit/type-is-instrument/]AUv3 Plugins[/url] at synthyfrog.

 

 

[AnotherScott]

Thanks for the report. Any chance you also compared Keystage?

[MalH]

I've never felt I had a stable enough setup using a master host such as Audiobus or IAA. My preference is just to set each app on it's own midi channel and let them all talk to the audio interface directly. This has been bombproof.

 

I can run concurrently:

Ch 1: Korg Module, receiving program changes to switch between Ivory and Scarbee.

Ch 2: Ravenscroft

Ch 3: Galileo 2

Ch 4: Auria Pro routing to a 5GB piano SFZ

Ch 5: Auria Pro routing to a 3GB Rhodes Suitcase SFZ, with Fabfilter Saturn saturation and distortion

 

Everything is set to a 128 buffer. If Auria is launched before Ravenscroft, Ravenscroft will also run at 128.

 

This all runs in the background while I use ForScore for charts.

 

[drawback]

Thanks for the report. Any chance you also compared Keystage?

 

Didn't, although it looked promising in the videos and IIRC it might have been you who has used it?

 

I've never felt I had a stable enough setup using a master host such as Audiobus or IAA. My preference is just to set each app on it's own midi channel and let them all talk to the audio interface directly. This has been bombproof.

 

I can run concurrently:

Ch 1: Korg Module, receiving program changes to switch between Ivory and Scarbee.

Ch 2: Ravenscroft

Ch 3: Galileo 2

Ch 4: Auria Pro routing to a 5GB piano SFZ

Ch 5: Auria Pro routing to a 3GB Rhodes Suitcase SFZ, with Fabfilter Saturn saturation and distortion

 

Everything is set to a 128 buffer. If Auria is launched before Ravenscroft, Ravenscroft will also run at 128.

 

This all runs in the background while I use ForScore for charts.

 

Are you using an iPad Pro?

[RandyFF]

I've never felt I had a stable enough setup using a master host such as Audiobus or IAA. My preference is just to set each app on it's own midi channel and let them all talk to the audio interface directly. This has been bombproof.

 

I can run concurrently:

Ch 1: Korg Module, receiving program changes to switch between Ivory and Scarbee.

Ch 2: Ravenscroft

Ch 3: Galileo 2

Ch 4: Auria Pro routing to a 5GB piano SFZ

Ch 5: Auria Pro routing to a 3GB Rhodes Suitcase SFZ, with Fabfilter Saturn saturation and distortion

 

Everything is set to a 128 buffer. If Auria is launched before Ravenscroft, Ravenscroft will also run at 128.

 

This all runs in the background while I use ForScore for charts.

 

@ AnotherScott, wow, Keystage looks amazing. Wonder how stable it is. Wonder if it has audio level monitoring like AUM, that's a really key feature, otherwise it's hard/impossible to set levels.

 

@ MalH, what are you using for the audio interface? Is that where you're setting the MIDI channels, and how is that done?

 

That seems to be the question, do you use a host like AUM and control everything from there like you would with Mainstage for Mac, or do you just run separate MIDI channels to each app like you've done and configure each one.

[The Real MC]

I will never rely on a laptop or mobile device for live performance.

 

I have had to reboot iOS because the factory apps were acting up, and I don't even have any 3rd party apps on my mobile!

[AnotherScott]

IMy preference is just to set each app on it's own midi channel and let them all talk to the audio interface directly. This has been bombproof.

I can see where that can be the best/simplest way to go. Maybe it's worth having a conversation as to why bother with AUM/Keyscape/whatever at all.

 

One advantage would be controller independence. With each app on its own channel, you're counting on your controller to send Program Changes as needed and to manage the splits/layers. With a master controlling app in the iPad itself, you could call up your sound combinations right on the iPad, which means they are available no matter what you use as a controller. Related, the controlling app may give you more quick/simultaneous control than you have on some controllers, i.e. if you're playing 4 sounds via different apps/channels and want quick access to the 4 volume controls. Some keyboards have knobs/sliders easily mappable for this, but others do not.

 

Another advantage could be autoload... the idea that you tap one thing and everything is ready to go, rather than having to manually launch each app (possibly in the correct order) every time you want to use your rig.

 

Also, it is useful for managing communication between apps, for additional processing/effects, or to do something like take all your sounds and put them through a single master EQ to compensate for a given amp or room acoustics. (Some boards have readily accessible master EQs for this purpose, but many do not, and even the ones that do may not give you a way apply that EQ to an externally generated sound).

 

I haven't done these things, so they are "informed suppositions." So if anyone wants to correct or expound on any of that, please go right ahead. And what other advantages are there?

 

Thanks for the report. Any chance you also compared Keystage?

Didn't, although it looked promising in the videos and IIRC it might have been you who has used it?

I've done only the most minimal experimentation with it, I haven't gotten around to really playing with it yet. But once I got past some initial confusion, it seems to be the one that might work best for me.

[AnotherScott]

I will never rely on a laptop or mobile device for live performance.

 

I have had to reboot iOS because the factory apps were acting up, and I don't even have any 3rd party apps on my mobile!

Yeah, even with an iPad, my intent would be to run it from a board that also has its own sounds.

[drawback]

Scope broadened and well-articulated as usual, AnotherScott. The idea in my case is to have the iPad available for either the Mojo or SL88 controllers in different situations. Neither have traditional controller knobs and sliders in abundance although I suppose I could spend $$ on a MixFace just seems unnecessary.

[GooG]

I've never felt I had a stable enough setup using a master host such as Audiobus or IAA. My preference is just to set each app on it's own midi channel and let them all talk to the audio interface directly. This has been bombproof.

 

I can run concurrently:

Ch 1: Korg Module, receiving program changes to switch between Ivory and Scarbee.

Ch 2: Ravenscroft

Ch 3: Galileo 2

Ch 4: Auria Pro routing to a 5GB piano SFZ

Ch 5: Auria Pro routing to a 3GB Rhodes Suitcase SFZ, with Fabfilter Saturn saturation and distortion

 

Same thing for me. But I also use Midilow app to remap my keyboards to different MIDI Channel along with Lemur app for the interface like preset buttons (sending PC numbers and MIDI channels) and volume faders for each channel.

 

This way I can use any keyboards that has MIDI out and use the interface on Lemur to route the MIDI notes to specific apps thru Midiflow. Way more convenience and less resources needed compared to routing notes to every apps.

[MalH]

@ MalH, what are you using for the audio interface? Is that where you're setting the MIDI channels, and how is that done?

 

I'm using an iConnectAudio2+. All midi channels are set within the apps themselves. The only routing that needs to be setup on the interface is that the interface's DIN MIDI input needs to patch to the iPad and the iPad audio out needs to patch to the analog outputs. It's just one set of 16 MIDI channels into the iPad and one stereo audio stream out. All apps receive from the same MIDI input and send audio to the same stereo output.

 

I'm using a 2nd gen iPad Pro. I think this has 3GB RAM, which is needed for running all the apps concurrently. I don't get any breaks in the audio.

 

I don't have a master EQ, as I dial the SSv3 to suit the room, but with the iConnect device it would be possible to route the audiostream with all the instrument sounds to another stream that is sent to an EQ app. The iCOnnect device is very powerful for internal routing and talking to the iPad. This would greatly increase complexity though.

[drawback]

Auria Pro

 

Thanks! Just checked it out

 

 

[AnotherScott]

But I also use Midiflow app to remap my keyboards to different MIDI Channel along with Lemur app for the interface like preset buttons (sending PC numbers and MIDI channels) and volume faders for each channel.

I think some if not all the control apps we're talking about (AUM, keystage, etc.) would allow you to do those two functions, but maybe a litle more simply because it's in one app vs. two and also because I think Midiflow and Lemur require more of a "programmer's mindset" offerng a lot of flexibility but with less already done for you, and with a more generic visual presentation.

[drawback]

@ MalH, what are you using for the audio interface? Is that where you're setting the MIDI channels, and how is that done?

 

I'm using an iConnectAudio2+. All midi channels are set within the apps themselves. The only routing that needs to be setup on the interface is that the interface's DIN MIDI input needs to patch to the iPad and the iPad audio out needs to patch to the analog outputs. It's just one set of 16 MIDI channels into the iPad and one stereo audio stream out. All apps receive from the same MIDI input and send audio to the same stereo output.

 

I'm using a 2nd gen iPad Pro. I think this has 3GB RAM, which is needed for running all the apps concurrently. I don't get any breaks in the audio.

 

I don't have a master EQ, as I dial the SSv3 to suit the room, but with the iConnect device it would be possible to route the audiostream with all the instrument sounds to another stream that is sent to an EQ app. The iCOnnect device is very powerful for internal routing and talking to the iPad. This would greatly increase complexity though.

 

I picked up a used iConnectAudio4+ a couple of weeks ago off Craigslist for the practice studio. It had dead output due to someone running 48v through, but its running fine now with new capacitors. I doubt Id go the multi channel approach - my iPad doesnt have the horsepower to run all full apps simultaneously (AUs are no problem). Nice to be able to have everything connected, including the Mojo.

[gd1]

I just ordered the new iPad Air (2019), the reviews state that it should run the music apps fine. I've always used hardware for live playing. We do use software for our commercial projects but everything was setup for us by the engineers. A few old touring buds want to get together and jam a few times per month. I plan on bringing the iPad and a controller for organ, ep and brass. I will have a few questions on what app is best for the Memphis Sound. I've read a few posts here about Blue3. These guys play blues, rock and soul. Any advise is greatly appreciated. My thinking is that I just do not want to tear my studio apart to haul a few kybds and racked modules. If need be I might have to pick up a Mojo 61/Legend Solo/Sk1(3c ..) and simply use the iPad for the brass.

[drawback]

I just ordered the new iPad Air (2019), the reviews state that it should run the music apps fine. I've always used hardware for live playing. We do use software for our commercial projects but everything was setup for us by the engineers. A few old touring buds want to get together and jam a few times per month. I plan on bringing the iPad and a controller for organ, ep and brass. I will have a few questions on what app is best for the Memphis Sound. I've read a few posts here about Blue3. These guys play blues, rock and soul. Any advise is greatly appreciated. My thinking is that I just do not want to tear my studio apart to haul a few kybds and racked modules. If need be I might have to pick up a Mojo 61/Legend Solo/Sk1(3c ..) and simply use the iPad for the brass.

 

Blue3 isn't available for iOS... The path of best quality and least resistance seems to be Mojo61, PlugKey to iPad running [url:https://www.crudebyte.com/heavy-brass/]Heavy Brass[/url]. Otherwise you're into a controller, iPad running Galileo (organ) Neo-Soul (EPs) Heavy Brass. Or something like Korg Module and Heavy Brass. Or you could compromise on quality for the convenience of a more all-purpose app such as SampleTank.

[AnotherScott]

I pretty much agree with drawback... if you have the budget for it, a clonewheel plus iPad will be better than a controller plus iPad here, for two reasons. One is that, while Galileo is decent, it's not as good as a hardware clone... iPad organ is still weaker than iPad EP/brass compared to hardware. Second is that organ really benefits from the ergonomics of properly shaped/sized/spaced drawbars, which you don't get on a controller.

 

That said, I'd seriously consider a Hammond (SK1, XK1C, whatever) if you're happy with the sound, even if most may prefer Mojo, just because it's stronger as a MIDI controller. You can use its own front panel buttons to call up, not just organ sounds, but also whatever iPad sounds you want, as well as splits/layers of the iPad and internal sounds.

 

[gd1]

Great advice drawback and AnotherScott - thankyou. I was just looking at Heavy Brass. I've played plenty of A, B & C series Hammonds (never mind Lowery's, Electrohomes). I've only read about the Mojo's & Legends on the forum. I'll try to find a SK & XK series next week to demo. This week we're up against some fall deadlines. I was lucky enough to get my start on the Yonge St strip and have Goldy and Garth show me a thing or 3 on their Lowery's.

[drawback]

You know what, gd1 I wonder if you'd be better served in this case with an all-in-one. Certainly you could rent one from L&M to demo. Cost you less dough from the outset, versatile, lightweight. Lowrey-esque keys lol.

 

Roland VR-09.

[gd1]

That's not a bad idea, I have never played the VR series. Will have to call and have them send over a few different bds.

[AnotherScott]

Camelot Pro, iMidiPatchBay, Audiobus/Midiflow Splitter, have problems loading all these instruments/AUv3s at once. The most disconcerting is crashing, appearing to be caused by [url:https://micropyramid.com/blog/understanding-audio-quality-bit-rate-sample-rate/]sample rate[/url] mismatches. Every source you're accessing needs to stream at the same rate, either 44.1KHz or 48, but they all have to be consistent or chaos ensues.

 

Research on various iOS forums and my own trials has led to Ravenscroft as the big dog that just won't play with the others. It seems that whatever else is running, Ravenscroft likes to force its own preferred though inconsisent sample rate on the others, resulting in these mismatches

...

AUM...appears to state-save down to the sample rate � that is the key to everything. Every time I load my setup in AUM it's stable and predictable.

A new wrinkle on this issue... some iPads natively support multiple sample rates, and some don't. For example, while my 1st gen iPad Pro lets me choose whether an app is 44.1 or 48, my 5th Gen Ipad Mini forces everything to 48 no matter what, apparently because that device's internal audio interface does not support outputting at 44.1. (You can still use an external interface if you want to use a different sample rate.) And I'm pretty sure I've read that the opposite is true as well, that there are some older models that only did 44.1 and didn't support 48. But the point here is that the problem you had of running apps at mismatched rates presumably only exists on some iPad models, the ones that can actually run multiple rates in the first place. If you have a model that supports only one rate, then every app will output at that rate, and it would be impossible to run into the issue you had with different apps defaulting to different rates.

 

Interesting info in the thread at https://forum.audiob.us/discussion/32882/more-new-ipad-woes-can-t-switch-aum-from-anything-but-48k-sample-rate/p1

[drawback]

Thanks Scott - what led you this old thread?

 

I didn"t realize some iPads supported only one sample rate! That explains a lot, and seems as if my gripe against the 'big dogs' ie Ravenscroft was misplaced.

 

My first and current iPad is a 2018 Model 6, still presenting the rate mismatches. This iteration supports both 44.1 and 48 and I never know what it"s going to be. I load up AUM, get it stable and go from there, but I really wish it could be locked and force all apps to comply.

[AnotherScott]

I was googling a related question, and this thread popped up as a potential hit, so when I saw it I figured I'd update it with what I'd recently learned.

 

But speaking of "big dogs" -- The first time i ran into this issue, I was running B3X. Sometimes it would let me select 44.1 or 48, other times it was "stuck" at 48. I had not put together the pattern, that the times I could select it, I was on one iPad, and the times I couldn't, I was on another. It didn't even occur to me that this was something that would vary based on which model iPad you ran it on. So I contacted IK Multimedia to ask what might be causing this problem of sometimes being able to change the sample rate and other times not, and I also left a post on their public support forum. I never got any kind of response from either place, not even so much as an acknowledgment of the question. Echoing what I just said in another thread about an unrelated B3X issue, it's one thing if there's non-existent support for a 99 cent app, it's really irritating to get zero support on one of the most expensive apps you can get. (Meanwhile, I got excellent support from Guido when I had an issue concerning VB3m.)