spiral light Posted January 24, 2005 Share Posted January 24, 2005 In the next few months I should have my humble studio up and operational again (ie I'm buying a new house) and I am preparing a few acoustic pieces that I wrote for recording. My vision for recording is like this: One mic on the acoustic into the board (via pre-amp) and onto one track and another track with the piezzo (via tube pre). Tracks panned not any further apart than ~11 & 1 o'clock. Reverb for each track (for ambiance) set to ~9 & 3 o'clock. I know that using two mics you have to be careful of phasing, is it an issue with 1 mic and a pickup signal? I also know that it would be easiest to stick to one track but I like the blended sound. comments/criticisms??? www.windhamhill.com - Shameless Advertising! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tedster Posted January 24, 2005 Share Posted January 24, 2005 Your sentence "I like the blended sound" sums it up. Normally, I personally don't like the sound of a piezo into the board...but, depending on what you're using for a mic, it might be okay to mix a little of it in. But, again, it's your taste. I just use a condenser mic a couple of feet from the soundhole, and move my position around until I get a passable sound. "Cisco Kid, was a friend of mine" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillWelcome Home Studios Posted January 24, 2005 Share Posted January 24, 2005 The piezeos usually don't sound very good for recordings, but can add to the overall sound when blended in with a couple of mics. Now I have a studio and have been recording acoustic guitars since 1965, so I might be a little more tweeky about it than some, but definitely not as tweeky as many, many others. There are a lot of ways to capture the sound of any acoustic instrument. The first thing to understand is that sound eminates from many places on the instrument, not just one spot. Oh. the room plays a big part in the sound, too. I get my best acoustic sounds using 2 mics. One is placed up near the 12 fret, aimed at an angle towards the sound hole. The other is low on the lower bout, behind and a bit below the bridge. I generally use a small diaphragm condenser in the first place, but the second position might be anything from another SD, to a large diaphragm condenser, or just a dynamic, or even a ribbon. My current choices are generally an old Neumann KM 84i and a tube SD, the AKG C-28. I've been using that basic setup for a couple of years now, ever since I got the C-28s and discovered the roundness in tone but great accuracy of a tube/small diaphragm condenser mic. In the body position I've lately been using the Coles 4038, a Korby 47, a Korby Convertible with the 251 capsule or the 67M capsule, an RCA PB90, or an RCA 77D. Each style of mic has different things to offer, so what is being played figures into the equation. I might also add a room mic... perhaps an SD KM-83i, or any of my large diaphragm condensers. I only use the on-board pickup for tuning. (That is my personal choice.) The preamp has a lot to do with the sound, too. For really clean stuff, I use the John Hardy. But I like the ATI Paragon pres and the Midas XL-4 pres, too. Lately I've been using the Great River MP2-NV, but that might be just because it si my newest mic pre and I'm getting the hang of it. It really sounds sweet, though. Another good place to stick a mic is just over the right shoulder of the (right handed...) player/ Picks up what he hears, as the mic is by his ear. This makes it easier to match the sound in the monitors with the sound that he hears when playing. Combined with the mic at the 12th fret, this is a good sound. In a really good room,yuo can get pretty far away from the guitar. But in most smaller rooms, a foot to 18 inches is about all the farther back you can get before the room reverbrations start to intrude. Bill "I believe that entertainment can aspire to be art, and can become art, but if you set out to make art you're an idiot." Steve Martin Show business: we're all here because we're not all there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A String Posted January 24, 2005 Share Posted January 24, 2005 That's some handy info Bill! Craig Stringnetwork on Facebook String Network Forum My Music Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billster Posted January 24, 2005 Share Posted January 24, 2005 There will be phase issues between the piezo and the microphone, so be attentive if you go that way. Buy my CD on CD Baby! Bill Hartzell - the website MySpace?!?! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steevo Posted January 24, 2005 Share Posted January 24, 2005 All of what Bill said... Guess it depends on the particular sound your're after ... I like the acoustic approach myself. Hopefully you've got a good quiet room and a few good mics. You could grab the piezo output on a seperate track just in case. Here's a little sound clip of an acoustic recording I did some time back. Not me playing. 3 mics. AKG414 large diaphram condenser 12" or so from the soundhole. Then, a pair of AKG451 condensers for stereo ambience in the room ... also giving it a wee bit of natural delay and 'stereo' attributes. Blended mics and added the amount of reverb that the client wanted. Sounded like this: Acoustic Recording Sample - WAV (8Mb)... for you audiophiles Acoustic Recording Sample - MP3 (800k)... for your computer speakers I thought it turned out pretty good for a single pass recording (not doubled I mean) and no electronic effects except for the reverb (the amount you may or may not like). Not sure how on topic this is but maybe it will help. Later. S. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bejeeber Posted January 24, 2005 Share Posted January 24, 2005 Here's a little sound clip of an acoustic recording I did some time back.... That's a beeyootifully chimey performance and recording. What mosel of guitar was used? Just a pinch between the geek and chum Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steevo Posted January 25, 2005 Share Posted January 25, 2005 Originally posted by Bejeeber: Here's a little sound clip of an acoustic recording I did some time back.... That's a beeyootifully chimey performance and recording. What mosel of guitar was used?I believe that was a high-end Taylor ... don't know much about them really. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bejeeber Posted January 25, 2005 Share Posted January 25, 2005 Well glad you could tell in my post that "mosel" actually meant "model". Doh! Must start using spell check. Just a pinch between the geek and chum Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spiral light Posted January 25, 2005 Author Share Posted January 25, 2005 Hey Bill, thanks for the info, I'm going to save that post and put it on the wall of my new studio. great advice!! Steevo - great recording, you say the ambiance mics were used for 'stereo' attributes, did you pan them left & right? Is phase only a problem if tracks are panned to the same place? More questions!! www.windhamhill.com - Shameless Advertising! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steevo Posted January 25, 2005 Share Posted January 25, 2005 Originally posted by spiral light: Hey Bill, thanks for the info, I'm going to save that post and put it on the wall of my new studio. great advice!! Steevo - great recording, you say the ambiance mics were used for 'stereo' attributes, did you pan them left & right? Is phase only a problem if tracks are panned to the same place? More questions!!Yeah, soundhole mic panned center and ambience mics hard left and right. As far as phasing goes, its a bit of a complicated deal that's beyond quick response. But I would say yes, any phasing problems between two mics (sources) will be most obvious when panned to the same place. The distance of the mic to the source and the distance between the mics themselves will determine at what frequency(s) the phase problems will exist. But I wouldn't be that concerned about it. Anytime you open up more than one mic on a source, you've got phase 'problems'. The trick is to make sure that you don't have a big one that ruins the natural sound. Just check your stereo mix in mono and listen for any tonal changes ... if it sounds the same in mono, you're good to go. Generally speaking... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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