Listening to recorded music

[Mudcat]

This question was prompted by something I noticed while looking at the photos James-Italy has posted of his gear (nice collection BTW ). Specifically it was his Kenwood compact stereo system.

 

I don't know how many times I've seen guitarists have thousands of dollars invested in guitars/amps/effects who will sweat bullets over every detail of their rig in search of the ultimate tone (sorry everyone, Eric Johnson has already beat us to it ) who listen to their CD collection on a tiny, $200 stereo with cheezee speakers sitting on a bookshelf with no regard to setting up a proper listening location.

 

I am no audiophile (although I used to sell audiophile sound systems and pro audio gear), however I do have some reasonably nice old hifi gear set up with a proper "sweet spot" to listen to recorded music.

 

With the exception of when I was actually trying to "make it" as a pro musician and only worried about my own guitar sound, I have always been baffled by amateur and semi-pro guitarists who invest so much money in guitar gear but haven't bothered to invest time/money in putting together a reasonable hifi system. (No knock on your Kenwood bookshelf system James! ).

 

BTW - I don't think I qualify as a gear head, although I would like to . Here's my guitar rig. I've got a mid 60s Gretsch Tennessean, a Warmoth/ESP/Fender/Dimarzio/Seymour Duncan mongrel strat, an early 70s P-bass, a cheap Washburn flattop and an old Musicman amp. I have more money in my guitar stuff than my hi-fi system but I still have a true hi-fi set up to listen to recordings.

 

Thoughts anyone?

[Corner Pocket]

I agree. It is an amazing difference when you listen to a well thought out and set up hi-fi system. The depth and breadth of sound that can be generated from only two speakers is astounding. I'd rather put my $$$ into a 2 speaker system than the same amount of $$$ into a 5+1 surround.

 

The first time most people listen to an audiphile quality stereo, the system sounds wrong to them. With the right stereo set up, you can close your eyes and hear the band in the room with you.

 

I have an NAD integrated amp and Totem model 1 speakers. Not over the top by any means, but damn fine sounding.

 

Paul

[James-Italy]

Hey Mudcat!

Very observant. I remember looking at the photos after I took them and thinking, "Chi-Chi's chip can, cheap Kenwood stereo, and cd's ranging from Madonna to Poison to VH to Zep and with a little Loverboy mixed in. Hmmmm, don't know if this is cool?" but then I thought, "Oh hell, that's me! And who cares?"

 

In response to your question though, I thought I'd share my thoughts on the subject. It never ceases to amaze me how "audiophiles" seem to hear more than was probably ever recorded. I'm talking about those audiophiles that spend $5,000 for speaker wires, swear by $10,000+ tube amps, and consider brands like Infinity and Polk Audio to be consumer level (nice way to say cheap) speakers. From my experience, they'll argue to the death that they hear reproduction so precise and clear that they can hear the "true" reproduction of the original, something that with consumer level products we we can't hear. What do they hear on a CD of rock?!?!?! Do they realize what we guitarists use to produce this sound? What the hell are they really hearing that I can't hear on my decent system (not the Kenwood)? Oh well, I'll never understand it.

 

As guitar players we all know that tone is subjective. Just look at the differences between how we all set our amps. Some of us like the mid scooped, or the treble cranked to ten, or no treble and bass on 10, etc etc. The speaker cabs, speaker cones, mic used, mic placement all have a huge impact on the recording. And that's all before mixing. Then these recorded parts are mixed through a board while being listened to through studio monitors. Most of these links in the original professional recording chain are not up to "Audiophile" standards, yet these audiophiles are adamant that they hear something we don't. Maybe they hear something that was never there? Even allowing that the original Beatle & Zep CD's were remastered expertly on totally audiophile quality equipment, then we enter into the tone discussion. Audiophiles argue "their tone" is the correct one and if you don't have the right gear, you just can't hear it. Talk about gear snobs! grrrrrrrr

 

Don't get me wrong. I enjoy good quality audio reproduction gear, I'm just not fanatical about it. Which brings me back to that old Kenwood system. That system is at least 12 years old and I just keep it in my office which is where I took those pictures. I rarely ever turn it on and when I do it's more for background noise than for actual musical reproduction. The rest of my stereo equipment in the living room and cellar-studio is actually pretty decent. For consumer level stuff that is.

 

I'm quite happy with my studio setup which is where I can crank up the music without bothering anyone. There I've got a Denon PMA-1055R amp, Denon DRW-585 Double cassette desk, good CD player (don't remember what brand), good quality cables and speaker wire, Mission speakers, and of course, the Yamaha NS10m monitor speakers. Not top of the line stuff, but not Kenwood either. In the living room I had to compromise between quality and ascetics because my wife hates big speakers and wires and those stereo boxy-thingys. I bought the Bose Lifestyle 28 system for the living room because it's so small and unobtrusive, yet powerful. Good for watching movies or popping in a CD. Most people don't like the EQ'ing of the Bose, but I don't mind it. I will admit Bose does not offer a true representation of the original as it is very colored. In the car I've also got the Bose system and it is exceptional.

 

Living in a condo I can't really play music loud anyway so I do most of my listening through headphones. I've got three decent sets of cans that I use; a set of AKG K240 Studio, Sennheiser HD565, and Sennheiser HD580.

 

So in the end, while I'm not an "audiophile", I still care about good reproduction. Damn, wrote a novel here!

[Mudcat]

Originally posted by James-Italy:

I'm quite happy with my studio setup which is where I can crank up the music without bothering anyone. There I've got a Denon PMA-1055R amp, Denon DRW-585 Double cassette desk, good CD player (don't remember what brand), good quality cables and speaker wire, Mission speakers, and of course, the Yamaha NS10m monitor speakers. Not top of the line stuff, but not Kenwood either.

Rats! Even your audio system smokes mine! I suspected you had a nice system elsewhere and that the Kenwood was secondary.

 

Having sold audiophile gear for awhile in the 80s/90s I totally agree with you on the craziness of the "Stereophile" & "Absolute Sound" crowd. They don't listen to music, they listen to audio gear!

 

My whole hifi philosophy is to have a decent source, a decent amp, the best speakers you can afford/fit in your listening area (with spouse approval ) and a properly arranged listening environment. It ain't rocket science and it ain't necessarily that expensive.

[The Thrashole]

there is definitely a distinction between audiophile and Hi-Fi. I deal with audiophiles all stinkin day and according to these guys they could hear a mouse pee on a cotton ball at six meters and be able to tell which direction the stream was going. A good reproduction system is important though. I build my own speakers. It usually takes me a couple months of tweaking to get the damn things to integrate with the room, placement etc. But I will tell you the soundstage on the towers I am finishing up is huge with pinpoint imaging. My amplifiers are also bastardizd stuff with parts from a bunch of old gear.