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OT: Funny Thing About the People Who Support War


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[quote]Originally posted by Nawledge: [QB]Steverb i don't think that this is going to work because, and these are irefutable facts that i am pointing out> "the terrorist have already proven that they don't come from one place, they are all over the world in many countries, and in our own"[QB][/quote]The terrorists are all over the world, I agree with that. One way those terrorists can do real damage is to buy some of the unaccounted for WMD from Iraq. We can never completely eradicate those WMD because they are too easy to hide in a country the size of California. That's why we must replace the current leaders with more sane, "managable" leaders and then give real economic aid and support for the people and infrastructure of Iraq. The dangerous tyrrant is gone. Long live the new Iraq. Our newest, bestest buddies. :thu:
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I wouldn't be focused on our newest bestest buddies, I would be focused on the newest crop of crop upon crop of terrorist we create for ourselves to fight in the name of fighting terrorism. people seem to think that these terrorist are walking around with armani suits and two way pagers ordering weapons of mass destruction from nation leaders. I don't think that is the picture, I think they will get into what ever country they want to and use what is already in that country by way of chemicals and explosives and do the most damage that way. Terrorism is gorilla warfare before it is organized highgrade weaponry. So while we are f*cking with saddam and anybody else who looks like an arab indonesia is going to be sending in thousands of terrorist who look asian, and they will be buying chemicals from your local grocery store and blowing the hell out of your neighborhood starbucks. or maybe they'll look like me and come from africa, or maybe they'll look like john walker and come from down the street from your house but you won't know it because you'll be too focused on a faraway nation with an evil dictator who has not declared war. the only way attacking another country makes sense is if we are going to wipe them out, well we are not going to wipe them out, so we are going to just cause havoc, chaos and hatred in that region which will give birth to many baby xtremist who will grow up fast and dagerous. what do you people think of the fact that the taliban has already regrouped in afghanistan? what happen to that success?, we have'nt even bombed pakistan, but do you know how many terrorist there are in pakistan, enough to change american way of life for ever, what do you think is going to happen after this war with the fallout and the chaos that the surrounding countries will be thrown into. and what is this notion that we can bomb saddam hussein and scare other terrorist from being terrorist out of fear. Fear of what???, these people are giving up their lives freely just to have the opportunity to take your life away. I don't think they are scared of dying, at least not scared enough for it to make any difference. can someone address these issues, and to the people trying to detract and stop us from discussing this topic, go post somewhere else, we are both sides concerned about our country and our world, so let us discuss these issues. go bake some cookies or something.
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Nawledge, You've said and others have as well that our efforts in Afghanistan have "failed" and that the Taliban is "regrouping"... this also implies that this re-imergence of the Taliban is with the approval and perhaps request of the people. I've just watched a National Geographic special that dealt with the actions of the forces currently in Afghanistan... and I saw some amazing footage... and gained new respect for the work of the thousands of US troops who are doing their best to help to rebuild. Schools, Mosques, wells, electicity, roads... the elimination of leftover weapons. They showed story after story of the positive impact these brave troops have had... and the welcome and thanks they are getting from everyday Afghans who just want to raise their standard of living out of the stone age. Don't get me wrong. I believe Afghanistan is still a very dangerous place, and I wouldn't be surprised if many Taliban and Al-qidia who survived would attempt to regroup and cause problems. I also expect that certain warlords that feel their power threatened, and will try to hold on to their power... it's an issue in any distributed power situation... but it doesn't mean that we shouldn't keep trying to to improve those peoples lives. If it wasn't for the US, who would do this? So before I "believe" your statements about our "failure" in Afghanistan, I'd ask to learn where you are getting your information... and if you've seen what I've seen that disputes it. guitplayer

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[quote]Originally posted by SteveRB: [b]The dangerous tyrrant is gone. Long live the new Iraq. Our newest, bestest buddies. :thu: [/b][/quote]I prefer the [i]Iraq Classic[/i] but it looks like we're going to get [i]Iraq Light[/i] .
It's OK to tempt fate. Just don't drop your drawers and moon her.
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guitplayer I don't think they've failed yet? so I won't say tell you that, what i've said is we have not succeeded. success could not happen over night, my point is there is still work to be done since we have taken on the job. how can we expect to successfuly fight the terrorism that we are about to unleash on the world when we can't even clean up afghanistan??, afghanistan is a much smaller place than the world but still too much for us to handle. if that is so we have no business doing what we are doing. we need to get those troops out of kuwait and into the afghan territory. Instead of and I quote our presidents bantor " one terrorist at a time" we need to be dealing with one country at a time, one war at a time, one problem at a time. what happens when there are riots, rape, or whatever in your town, do you hop a plane and go somewhere, no you take care of home first. what is every news channel in every town reporting, what is every mayor of every city reporting. Home Is Not Ready, Home Is Not Protected. even after all of this time since the most recent tragedy. North Korea can hit LA, I'm worried about that. I believe saddam should be got I believe osama should be got, but I believe that home should be taken care of first and that they should be gotten the correct way. I don't believe we are doing it in the right way. I think as a country we are living the falacy and fantasy that after we blow up iraq that all our problems will be solved. we are like a child that just wants to hit somebody. but we are not kids and this is much more serious and hitting Iraq will be just the beginning of our problems not the solution. I'm sure we will do this,,because i'm sure that George Bush our commander and Cheif does not have the forsight to see the tsunami of terrorism that will be our backlash. The sad thing is that we dont realize as a nation that we directing our own self destruction. I guess not many peoples minds will change, and those that do will not change the course we have taken, but you just wait until the morning after. cause we will be waiting to exhale for at least the rest of the lives of everybody on this board. peace
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I for one think that you don't fight terrorism by waiting for terrorists to strike you hard, then figure out who it was, and chase after them. You fight terrorism thru massive intelligence that uncovers plots,terrorists, and those who aid terrorism before they have a chance to strike. I believe Bush is doing this with Iraq. I happen to think that it's possible Colin Powell may know more of what Iraq is capable of and planning than I do. We know this is a man who plotted the assassination of our President. I don't see the evidence that he has decided to bury the hatchet with the US and embrace our wonderful democracy...I think he is willing and possibly soon able to deliver WMD to his surrounding neighbors and possibly to place them in the hands of terrorists who would bring them to the US. I'm sure there are those who would accuse me of trusting our government too much, but in the end, isn't this what we elect them for: To make decisions that may not be popular, but are the right decision for the welfare of our country? In my job, I make decisions based on hundreds of little circumstances every day. The people I am in charge of leading sometimes question my decisions, but primarily because they see only part of the picture. I would be a poor manager if I let the people below me dictate every decision I make just because they all thought we should do one thing. At the same time, I would be poor if I did not listen to what they had to say. I heard Clinton, who I'm not a huge fan of, talk at Willow Creek Community Church about watching polls, and he talked about reading them and knowing that some decisions are simple because from his vantage point, with the intelligence that the President of the US is afforded, the right thing to do is clear, even if the public sees it differently. Ok, I've rambled. I certainly would choose to live in peace, but it seems hard to do when your enemies repeatedly vow to destroy you and your way of life at any cost. I hope George W. is guided by a higher power as he makes these terrible and massive decisions. Later, kc
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[quote]Originally posted by Nawledge: I think as a country we are living the falacy and fantasy that after we blow up iraq that all our problems will be solved.[/quote]I don't know who is living that fallacy and fantasy...I'm not...many other people are not...the Government is not...many other countries in the world are not. Some may have misunderstood what was said right after 9/11...that fighting terrorism was something that was going to take a very long time...and that there were no guarantees. Also, this twisted viewpoint that some how the USA is creating terrorists...is well...pretty twisted. Will some terrorists respond back after we hit them...probably. Will they disappear if we never hit them...probably not. So...we can either sit back and be a patsy for the terrorists...or we can go after them... …not one country at a time...but on a global scale. Do you think...that they are all just waiting for us in one spot of the world, and all we have to do is go get 'em? Be serious...fighting terrorist on a global scale is not a simple thing to do. Our troops that are now being sent to Iraq...will not force a cut-back on our fight against terrorism here in the USA. And, there are other areas of the world where we may have to also go in very soon, if the “host” countries can't clean up the terrorists on their own. Fighting terrorist has to be a multi-pronged effort…and not just one thing at a time…terrorists don't usually stand still.

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[quote]Originally posted by miroslav: [b] [quote]Originally posted by Nawledge: I think as a country we are living the falacy and fantasy that after we blow up iraq that all our problems will be solved.[/quote]I don't know who is living that fallacy and fantasy...I'm not...many other people are not...the Government is not...many other countries in the world are not. Some may have misunderstood what was said right after 9/11...that fighting terrorism was something that was going to take a very long time...and that there were no guarantees. Also, this twisted viewpoint that some how the USA is creating terrorists...is well...pretty twisted. Will some terrorists respond back after we hit them...probably. Will they disappear if we never hit them...probably not. So...we can either sit back and be a patsy for the terrorists...or we can go after them... …not one country at a time...but on a global scale. Do you think...that they are all just waiting for us in one spot of the world, and all we have to do is go get 'em? Be serious...fighting terrorist on a global scale is not a simple thing to do. Our troops that are now being sent to Iraq...will not force a cut-back on our fight against terrorism here in the USA. And, there are other areas of the world where we may have to also go in very soon, if the “host” countries can't clean up the terrorists on their own. Fighting terrorist has to be a multi-pronged effort…and not just one thing at a time…terrorists don't usually stand still.[/b][/quote]Agreed!

 

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multipronged. agreed this way. not agreed first things first. there haven't been cutbacks here at home because there hasn't been anything to cut back, we haven't even started, well the government has made sure that the airline idustry moves quicker than the us gov. why is that your local news can find so many unprotected targets but the gov. cant seem to get the ball rolling when it comes to protecting the citizens. I have'nt seen one doctor or local law enforcement agent, or city offical express anything but frustration over the fact that no money or supplies have been given to them to prepare for the trouble that could happen inside this country, yet the troops and weapons were over there in mass before the inspectors were even remotely done with there work. that sounds like backwards focus to me. you secure home before launching attacts elswhere.
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[quote]Originally posted by CarmenC: [b]Holiday From History By Charles Krauthammer Friday, February 14, 2003; Page A31 [/b][/quote]Carmen, note that I posted a *link* to a web page, not the entire web page itself... Also note I take the time to edit the previous post that I reply to so that people don't have to read what has already been posted. I don't know about anyone else here, but I'm not going to take the time to read your reposted articles if you can't summarize them in your own words. I could sit here and come up with 50 links in probably less than an hour to support my position, cut and past the whole thing and post it here - and NOBODY WOULD READ IT. [i]You are not accomplishing anything by doing that[/i].

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O.K...so here is an question. What would happen if we simply did what the protestors wish? We have two choices to appease the anti war groups. 1. Bring the troops home. From everywhere. Korea, Afghanistan, Germany, France, Kosovo, etc. Immediately stop being the police for the world. Use the troops to defend our own borders. Leave any country or territory that does not support our help or involvement including Puerto Rico. 2. Send more inspectors to Iraq. I suggest 250,000 inspectors. Armed. I would like to see the United States leave the UN, ask them nicely to set up shop in another country that is willing to pay for most of their activities. Leave NATO. Let the French and Germans and Russians defend themselves. Also remove our majority monitary support of that organization. Tarrif French, German, Russian and Chinese products by at least 100% of their prices now. Make a new $50,000 Mercedes cost $100,000. Double the cost of French wine, cheese, etc. Make the Chinese explain nicely to the North Koreans that they should calm down and play nice or start looking around for food and military support from somewhere else. Cut our multi billion dollar aid to foreign nations down to about ten dollars. If we are the assholes of the world, let the world feed itself without our help. America provides not less than a hundred times the foreign aid of any other country. If terrorists attack another country, if Sadam starts lobbing Scuds into Israel, Kuwait, Jordan, etc. We should simply do nothing. Follow the logic of Susan Sarandon... if he has done nothing to us, we should leave him alone. I agree. Wait until we are attacked on our own soil. Who cares about an embassy or a destroyer here and there? Wait until they come on shore and then get them. But, do not chase them if they leave the country..let them go. If we happen to catch a foreign national on our soil trying to kill us, get him a good attorney, contact the ACLU, the Trial Lawyers Association and Amnesty International to make sure they are treated fairly. Don't follow them, don't wiretap them, don't check their email..wait until they kill a bunch of us and then get them, unless they have left the country, in which case, leave them alone. Try to capture them quickly before the horror of what they have done fades and we start worrying about our civil rights and how the rest of the world thinks about us and what giant jerks we have leading our country. Collin Powell/Madaline Albright..hummmm, hard to decide. America...land of the free, home of the grave.

Mark G.

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[quote]Originally posted by GZsound@hotmail.com: [b] I would like to see the United States leave the UN, ask them nicely to set up shop in another country that is willing to pay for most of their activities. [/b][/quote]I would like to see the United States pay what is owed to the UN. I would like to see the United States honor the international war crimes legislation & court rather than ignoring it. I would like the United States to sign and ratify the Kyoto treaty and other urgent protocols. If what is wasted on this charade would be used to adress world hunger, illitteracy (sp?) and enviromental issues, it would make the world a better place for all. Such a move would also do a whole lot to stop terrorism. It is time for a paradigm shift. /Mats

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I would think the conservative-leaning contributors of this forum would be even more interested in taking CC to task for this nonsense, since by making such an ass of himself he may be undermining their arguments by association with him and the idiotic drivel he is spewing. Thanks for the support, CC, not that we needed it. :rolleyes: :freak:
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[quote]Originally posted by Mats_Olsson: [b]illitteracy (sp?) [/b][/quote]Mats... that's funny... (no offence intended!!! :D ) And I'd have to agree with you on those last points. I think its safe to say that while [i]all[/i] sides have issues with each other... there are a lot of other global issues that are being overlooked and pushed to the side... and in a perfect world we would be spending all of the time and effort and money on those issues, rather than bickering over who did what to whom and who needs a kick in the ass... etc... unfortunately, this aint a perfect world... And CarmenC! Please... You hurt your own credibility by continuing to post the same article over and over! Even just posting the links... find some more content to 'wow' us with, don't just beat us over the head with the same tired old stick! DX

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[quote]Originally posted by Mats_Olsson: [b]Carmen, why do you keep cutting and pasting rather than just providing a link to any article you want us to read? /Mats[/b][/quote]There's a link before the paste. Read and click! Are you blind?

An appeaser is one who feeds a crocodile, hoping it will eat him last.

Sir Winston Churchill

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[quote]Originally posted by S.A.L.: [b]I would think the conservative-leaning contributors of this forum would be even more interested in taking CC to task for this nonsense, since by making such an ass of himself he may be undermining their arguments by association with him and the idiotic drivel he is spewing. [/b][/quote]Shhhhhhhhh.........

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[quote]Originally posted by danymal_x: [b] [quote]Originally posted by Mats_Olsson: [b]illitteracy (sp?) [/b][/quote]Mats... that's funny... (no offence intended!!! :D ) And I'd have to agree with you on those last points. I think its safe to say that while [i]all[/i] sides have issues with each other... there are a lot of other global issues that are being overlooked and pushed to the side... and in a perfect world we would be spending all of the time and effort and money on those issues, rather than bickering over who did what to whom and who needs a kick in the ass... etc... unfortunately, this aint a perfect world... And CarmenC! Please... You hurt your own credibility by continuing to post the same article over and over! Even just posting the links... find some more content to 'wow' us with, don't just beat us over the head with the same tired old stick! DX[/b][/quote]You hurt your credibility by failing to notice that I posted a DIFFERENT ARTICLE! I posted a link, then the DIFFERENT ARTICLE! Even a different stick doesn't work...

An appeaser is one who feeds a crocodile, hoping it will eat him last.

Sir Winston Churchill

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[quote]Originally posted by arneal: [b]Oh yeah, right......Ann Coulter as the voice of anything rational, balanced or even factually reliable? Try again.[/b][/quote]A brilliant rebuttal! Congratulations..

An appeaser is one who feeds a crocodile, hoping it will eat him last.

Sir Winston Churchill

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[quote]Originally posted by S.A.L.: [b]I would think the conservative-leaning contributors of this forum would be even more interested in taking CC to task for this nonsense, since by making such an ass of himself he may be undermining their arguments by association with him and the idiotic drivel he is spewing. Thanks for the support, CC, not that we needed it. :rolleyes: :freak: [/b][/quote]No constructive comments, so the personal attacks begin....typical. Did you see the anti- war protests this past weekend? Millions marched... BILLIONS didn't! :p

An appeaser is one who feeds a crocodile, hoping it will eat him last.

Sir Winston Churchill

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CarmenC, I'm going to have to respectfully request that you either a) Go and listen to the lyrics of 'Generals and Majors' and 'Living Through Another Cuba', or b)change you avatar, because at the moment, I am finding it so near-impossible to reconcile your posts with the image by your name that I am tempted to rattle off an Email to Andy Partridge directing him toward your numerous pro-slaughter posts on these forums of late. You have already commented elsewhere that you don't think XTC's anti-war sentiments apply in the current climate. I would say to you they have never been more appropriate. What's that line in ....Another Cuba about this kind of thing happening every 20 years or so? Either remove you pro-war filters from these forums or remove the avatar, they are currently a match made in hell.

This is Preservation Month. I appreciate preservation. It's what you do when you run for president. You gotta preserve."

-- Geroge W Bush speaking during Perseverance Month at Fairgrounds Elementary School in Nashua, N.H.

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[quote]Originally posted by CarmenC: [b] You hurt your credibility by failing to notice that I posted a DIFFERENT ARTICLE! I posted a link, then the DIFFERENT ARTICLE! Even a different stick doesn't work...[/b][/quote]Actually, it only reinforces my point... I didn't bother to read your post because it looked just like all the rest. Kinda like the kid who cried 'wolf' :thu: DX

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[quote]Originally posted by Michael Quayle: [b]CarmenC, I'm going to have to respectfully request that you either a) Go and listen to the lyrics of 'Generals and Majors' and 'Living Through Another Cuba', or b)change you avatar, because at the moment, I am finding it so near-impossible to reconcile your posts with the image by your name that I am tempted to rattle off an Email to Andy Partridge directing him toward your numerous pro-slaughter posts on these forums of late. You have already commented elsewhere that you don't think XTC's anti-war sentiments apply in the current climate. I would say to you they have never been more appropriate. What's that line in ....Another Cuba about this kind of thing happening every 20 years or so? Either remove you pro-war filters from these forums or remove the avatar, they are currently a match made in hell.[/b][/quote]Why should I listen to anything you tell me to do. Yawn...how smug. If you don't like my avatar...oh, well...deal with it. I know their lyrics...I like their music. What pro- slaughter post are you referring to? Why don't you present XTC's lyrics to Saddam? Because he would kill you and your family on the spot. Tell Andy I said Hi... [img]http://www.rushlimbaugh.com/home/weekend_sites/week_in_review_021003___021403/content/axis_of_appeasement_actions.Par.0002.ImageFile.jpg[/img] :wave:

An appeaser is one who feeds a crocodile, hoping it will eat him last.

Sir Winston Churchill

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[quote]Originally posted by danymal_x: [b]
quote:
Originally posted by CarmenC: You hurt your credibility by failing to notice that I posted a DIFFERENT ARTICLE! I posted a link, then the DIFFERENT ARTICLE! Even a different stick doesn't work...[/b][/quote]Actually, it only reinforces my point... I didn't bother to read your post because it looked just like all the rest. Kinda like the kid who cried 'wolf' :wave:

An appeaser is one who feeds a crocodile, hoping it will eat him last.

Sir Winston Churchill

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While wasting time on the web, I came across this little tidbit when I tried to go to the "Guest book" section at one of the Susan Sarandon websites. "The Guest book is now closed I have decided to close the Guest Book. Just for the record, I am pro peace, anti Saddam, pro America and anti Bush. Inconsistent? Yes, but that's life. If you disagree, that's fine by me, but I won't give up my Web space to the ill-informed right-wing rantings, peppered with This site has attracted some adverse comments from visitors who are ignorant enough to think that "liberal" is an insult. It isn't - it's a compliment. Let this serve as a reminder to the rest of us that there are still some genuine bigots out there. Just remember that Free Speech is unconditional and does not have a tag line of 'only if you agree with me'." What was that last line again? "Just remember that Free Speech is unconditional and does not have a tag line of 'only if you agree with me'." Oh, so that must be why the liberal weenie who runs this site CLOSED THE FREAKIN' GUESTBOOK - because Free Speech is unconditional! If you're saying "What the f.. ?" right now, congratulate yourself for having a brain. Yeah... you read it right. A perfect example of hypocrisy in action.
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[quote]Originally posted by CarmenC: [b]No constructive comments, so the personal attacks begin....typical.[/b][/quote] [quote]Originally posted by CarmenC: [b]It reinforces your point alright, the one on your head... :wave: [/b][/quote]hhmmmm. :rolleyes:
It's OK to tempt fate. Just don't drop your drawers and moon her.
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