* Uhoh... tried high-dollar acoustic. Is this the answer? *

[LiveMusic]

I made a big mistake. While waiting on a simple repair for my Ovation 1617 I bought 20 years ago, I walked into the "expensive guitar room" part of the music store. I tried several. Guild, Martin. Then I picked up a Taylor 514 CE. Oh, my. I have NEVER experienced anything like this. It's like I instantly advanced 100% in playability. So easy to chord and play! Nice sound. But the playability, I was AMAZED.

 

Is this what it's all about? I thought I had a good guitar. I think I paid $1,200 for this Ovation way back then. Lemme tell you... there is NO COMPARISON. I haven't tried many expensive guitars but geez, this Taylor, it's like it just wanted to be played. My question is, is this what it's like to have a really good guitar? I'm so amazed by this, I'm considering buying it. $2,000 is a lot of money. But I'm thinking this might be a revelation for my enjoyment and proficiency. What do you think?

 

If I could get similar results for less, I'd rather do it but this has opened my eyes to playability. Perhaps the action is lower on the Taylor. Are there others for less than $2,000 that you would recommend? I also played a Takamine one time that I really liked.

[sbrock1san.rr.com]

I bought a Taylor 414 grand auditorium, it has no electronics or fancy inlays. Yes, it was a revelation and I've been playing guitar for 25 years.

 

I played so guitars before finding just the right one. When you know you found the right one you should just trust your instincts and buy it...but not after you've played many, many of them first. Even the same model will have variations. I compared mine(I paid $1,000) to guitars costing 2 or 3 times as much and came away smiling because cost doesn't mean a lot, finding an axe that has synergy with your personality means everything.

 

The Taylors are kind of a bright guitar but they are well balanced tonally as well. Part of the sound comes from them using Elixer strings, you can change the sound quite a bit by trying a different brand. You aren't the first person to discover the Taylors. They are really becoming popular and I think for good reason.

 

Good luck

[Tedster]

(Sings sappy song from "Sleepless in Seattle")

 

"When I fall in love...it will be forever..."

 

Yep, it sounds like ye done fallen fer a Taylor. When ye gittin' hitched? You gotta tell yore missus 'bout the "other woman" in yer life?

 

http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/biggrin.gif

 

All joking aside...I play a Guild...bought it for $450. I've played a few pretty sounding Taylors...couple of 'em pert near turned my head...but I love my Guild. It was love at first strum with mine, too. Maybe one o' these days some gussied up Taylor "gal" will steal my heart too, but 'til then I'll be satisfied.

[Beagle1]

Yeah, the 'playability' aspect of the Taylor x14 series is really strong. Licks that I really have to work at on my Martin seem effortless when I play them on my 714ce. SteveRB is right that there is a lot of variation in quality even among the same model. I originally wanted either a 414 or 514 but couldn't fine one at the time that really stood out. Then I picked up the 714 and that was it. I know someone who bought a 714 and then returned it because he found a 314 he liked better. You will know when you find the right one.

[josephandrews.edu]

Ovations usually sound kinda tinny in my opinion. Mbe thats why the Taylor swept you off your feet. Takamines are nice. Get what you really like and can afford.

 

Yah. ^^

[murph]

Understand that Ovations weren't designed to sound exactly like your standard acoustic guitar. They were designed for live playing through a PA. If you don't do that, maybe something like the Taylor is what you need. If it's a playability thing, spend $30 and get your Ovation set-up like that Taylor, and see if that changes your mind. It's certainly cheaper to go that route than throw down a couple grand to find that the action could have been changed, or the strings made the difference. Plus, if you plan on trading in or selling the Ovation, having it set-up properly should get you more money for it.

[LiveMusic]

Murph, what do you mean "get it set up like the Taylor?" Lower the action on my Ovation? I'm already using the same strings as are on that Taylor. Can they lower the action on my Ovation without getting fret buzz?

[Eric Worthington]

I've played an Ovation for years. Then I bought a Taylor. Now I hate the Ovation. It's become my "rock n roll" guitar now, meaning I'm not so concerned if it gets a little nicked, or is taken to places where I wouldn't want to take my Taylor.

 

A couple things to keep in mind:

The 314 will be the same as the 514 in many ways, including playability (like butta), and workmanship. The difference is in the wood, and maybe some cosmetic fanciness. The pickup systems will likely be the same (Fishman--excellent quality), although some have the higher-end Fishman that includes a mic inside the sound hole, where you can blend it with the under-the-saddle pick up. You could get a 314 for a lot less than a 514, and if you shop around a little, you could save a couple hundred.

 

Buy one. It's great to have a second good guitar anyway. The Taylor is particularly good played acoustic, and for any kind of fingerpicking, it's tremendous.

[Lee Flier]

I'm not surprised. I hate Ovations. http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/biggrin.gif

 

Maybe the Taylor is indeed "your" guitar, but just to make sure, if I were you I'd play some other models too. Not because I'm trying to diss Taylors, they're killer, but if you're trying to be budget conscious you might find another guitar that you like just as well for less. I guess what I'm really saying is, it's not hard to improve on an Ovation. http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/biggrin.gif

 

But hey, if that Taylor is really special to you, go for it!

 

--Lee

[jef5f]

I've only played a few giutars like origianly described by LiveMusic. A Tacoma Chief, a new Martin D-15, and every Taylor i've ever picked up. go with your feelings here.

 

Have you also noticed that the sound of an amplified Ovation is significantly different then other guitars. It seems I can always tell whether it is an Ovation or not.

[murph]

Originally posted by LiveMusic:

Murph, what do you mean "get it set up like the Taylor?" Lower the action on my Ovation? I'm already using the same strings as are on that Taylor. Can they lower the action on my Ovation without getting fret buzz?

Very possibly. Go back to the store with a ruler, and see how far the strings are off of the fretwire at the 12th fret. Take the Ovation to a reputable guira repair shop, and ask them what it would take to get the action that low. You may just need a truss rod or bridge adjustment, a fret leveling, or an all-out fret replacement, depending. Obviously, if the place is good, they won't do anything you don't really need. on't forget to bring an extra set of strings; if they're not also a store, they may charge you retail for the set, which may be the wrong ones to begin with.

 

It's very possible that the Ovation is not the guitar for you anymore. I'm never giving up my Taylors. Having lost a dream guitar in the past, I hate to see anyone fall into the same trap.

[michael saulnier]

I've got a couple of Ovations, (my Custom Balladeer was my first guitar), a couple of Taylors, (a 414ce and a 710bce), and a nice Larrivee L-9.

 

There's no question that most Taylors play and sound nicer than most Ovations. Besides these companies, there's a large number of high end builders that make great guitars in the $2000 price range.

 

Here's a few to consider: Bourgeois, Breedlove, C. Fox Guitars, Collings, Froggy Bottom, James Goodall, Larrivee, Lowden, Martin, and Santa Cruz. There's also great Guilds, Gibsons, and other mainstream builders. If you want to learn more about these makers check out Harmony Central guitar database or check out a local dealer in my area that has a website with descriptions and pictures of many of these... http://www.buffalobrosguitars.com. (No spam here... I don't have any connection to these guys other than as a satisfied customer!)

 

If money is an issue, (isn't it always), you'll probably want to focus on features like sound, wood and shape, and forget fancy inlays and other cosmetic features that look great, add value to the guitar, but don't affect the sound and playability. Most of the high end builders have some kind of "entry level" product.

 

BTW, I saw a recent article with Bob Taylor saying the 514 model is their most popular. It isn't their "low end"... the 300 and 400 series cover that, but it's the favorite combination of high end features and electronics without the added cosmetics found on their upper end series. (It's the first level where the advanced piezo and mic "blender" electronics are used... highly recommended).

 

At this level, the acoustic of your dreams is a big investment and it's worth learning a little about your choices. But don't get caught up in what's "best"... instead... if you find a guitar that "speaks to you" like the Taylor 514, (and you have the $'s), get it. Don't settle for a guitar that is OK, but doesn't inspire you. Long after you've spent the money, you'll have the guitar. Why not make sure it's one you really want.

 

guitplayer

[Chip McDonald]

Originally posted by LiveMusic:

like to have a really good guitar? I'm so amazed by this, I'm considering buying it. $2,000 is a lot of money. But I'm thinking this might be a revelation for my enjoyment and proficiency. What do you think?

 

Taylors generally have smaller necks than "average". They're usually all well made and have somewhat low action. However, a good Ovation can be setup extreamly low, so I would discount that...

 

Taylors also have a more "scooped mid" sound than something like a Martin.

After having pushed up mids with the Ovation, the Taylor is probably the biggest, obvious contrast. The only thing to consider is it's use; if that is indeed what draws you, I'd make sure it's still going to work for your given situation. If you're going to do "brash rock and roll" strumming, or hard/loud single note things, something more like a Martin sound would probably be better.

 

REGARDLESS - trees are becoming more scarce. You'll be very sorry 3 years from now if you don't go ahead and buy into that price level - and get a "real" acoustic - if you can do it today.

 

Keep the Ovation for live gigs, though - unless you can afford to ding up a $1,500+ guitar.

 

http://www.mp3.com/chipmcdonald

[LiveMusic]

Chip, what do you mean by "scooped mid" and "pushed up mid?"

 

If action can be lowered on a guitar, why isn't it that way already? Or maybe it's changed over 20 years. Is there a negative to lowering it?

[Chip McDonald]

Originally posted by LiveMusic:

Chip, what do you mean by "scooped mid" and "pushed up mid?"

 

Hmm... well, without going into an explanation of the audio spectrum, Taylor's are known for having a "ready produced" sort of sound, with a de-emphasized mid range response. In other words, if you listen to a lot of current Nashville acoustic guitar things, the sound will more closely match something like that on record, than maybe a Martin off the shelf. Acoustic guitar sounds have gradually become more "whispy" in the top end and less mid-range dominant in recordings, and Taylors tend to lean towards that naturally. Some Martin idealists like to deride Taylors as being less of a guitar because of that, while usually Taylor afficianados like it because of that.

 

Regardless, the Ovation is sort of (roughly...) like the inverse of the Taylor sound-wise.

 

If action can be lowered on a guitar, why isn't it that way already? Or

 

It's a matter of preferance and philosophy.

 

Philosophy - some acoustic purists feel a guitar should *never*, ever buzz in the least. Other people actually prefer low action *for* the earthy quality the buzziness yields, and others don't care and just want the playability of low action.

 

Taylors can be set up really low with a minimal amount of buzzing, although good Ovations can be as well. It's not done from the factory because they have to accomodate a mid-line between the above mentioned philosophies *as well as* take into account that the guitar's action will vary depending on the clime it ends up in, and other factors that are beyond their control.

 

On a cheaper guitar it's merely because they'd have to pay another human at the end of the line to set the guitar up more precisely.

 

maybe it's changed over 20 years. Is there a negative to lowering it?

 

Buzzing, depending on your tastes. If you get it set up with an equivalently "acceptable" minor buzz occuring throughout the length of the string, you're probably losing low end response and altering the overtones.

It's a matter of philosophy and end use. If you're just going to be playing open position chords there probably shouldn't be any need to lower it. As you get away from that mode of use I think it's a personal choice - there isn't a right or wrong unless a person is pretentiously idiotic, within reason.

 

http://www.mp3.com/chipmcdonald

[nrg music]

Quote

posted by Lee Flier

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I'm not surprised. I hate Ovations.

 

Maybe the Taylor is indeed "your" guitar, but just to make sure, if I were you I'd play some other models too.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Now then just to make a huge change on these boards I actually find myself agreeing with Lee http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/redface.gif

I also hate ovations I had one a while ago, kept it for a week and took it back..... Hideously tinny thang!! I tried Taylor, Martins, Guild and Gibson and much to my surprise ended up buying $2500.00 worth of beautiful Yamaha. I love this guitar and yes Tedster I told my wife this is the other woman in my life...... and yes I'm still looking forward to going back to sharing a bed with her at some point!!! She reckons I love it a hell of a lot more than her...... Can you believe that? But it is a fabulous guitar, so as Lee says check out everything you just never know....It doesn't matter about brand it's in the tone and the feel if it's right then it's right..

 

Simon http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/biggrin.gif

[Allan Speers]

Chip,

 

I never heard that explanation of Taylors, though it certainly jives with my impressions of the line. I've only heard a few Taylors that really sounded great, but the action is always excellent. Partly those skinny necks, which of course hurts the sound and sustain a little.

 

Since you seem to know a bit about Taylors, any idea if their fingerboards are compound-radiused? I've never had a chance to actually measure one, but I wouldn't be surprised. That would allow a lower action without buzzing, theoretically.

 

Any idea?

[Sir Bob]

Isn't the debate about acoustic guitar sounds more about: MAHOGANY VS. ROSEWOOD? That is, which wood for back and sides?

 

I recently read that you want mahogany for finger picking and rosewood for flatpicking? I suppose mahogany is preferred for just plain strumming. But after playing many at the store recently, I have liked a jumbo with maple back and sides for strumming.

 

Oh yes, I've gotten the Taylor bug too. They seem very playable.

[Chip McDonald]

Originally posted by Allan Speers:

Since you seem to know a bit about Taylors, any idea if their fingerboards are compound-radiused?

 

I don't think they are, I think they're just meticulous with their fret work, and maybe the thinner necks respond to truss rod adjustments better.

I'm not a Taylor expert (although I wouldn't mind being one if offered the opportunity... ), but I *have* gone through a pretty intensive shopping/comparison process in the past regarding them...

 

 

http://www.mp3.com/chipmcdonald