beatnix Posted August 6, 2006 Share Posted August 6, 2006 This year I have been using my laptop on gigs. I am get fairly use to having it be apart of my rig now. The thing that is bugging me about it right now is the noise that I get from the output. I have tried many different ways to get rid of the line noise. DI boxes, different A/D devices, new cables, etc. The only time it is not noise is when I let the laptop run on the battery. Soooooo.... I am looking to buy a line conditioner. Will this fix the problem? Does anyone use on with there rig? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sven Golly Posted August 6, 2006 Share Posted August 6, 2006 The problems is potentially noise from the lights being picked up by your power line for the laptop; very often these are highly susceptible to RF interference; they're not really designed to worry about RF in the audio stream. A power conditioner will isolate your AC source from other noise-generating items in the venue (such as lighting dimmer packs, a huge source of hum through AC), but it won't help if the noise is being picked up by your power cable for the laptop. I would leave the laptop connected to AC until showtime, then as you walk onstage, unplug power. Between sets, remember to plug it back in. That's just me being practical and working with what you know works. YMMV. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jazzwee Posted August 6, 2006 Share Posted August 6, 2006 I have had a lot of experience with this lately so I'd like to pass what I've learned. I too use a laptop, particularly for recording. I always have noise and I was using Creative Audigy Platinum ZS as my sound card (PCMCIA). If I unplugged the power on my computer and ran on batteries, the noise level went down significantly. So the presumption here is that I need to worry about power conditioning and such. The solution was not that obvious. I purchased a high end sound card (E-MU 1616). This is a pro recording interface with an extremely high sound to noise ratio, compared to consumer audio cards. Without a change to the laptop, and while always using AC, all the noise is now gone. Sometimes it is confusing to know if we are fixing the symptoms or the root cause. Change your soundcard. Hamburg Steinway O, Crumar Mojo, Nord Electro 4 HP 73, EV ZXA1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beatnix Posted August 6, 2006 Author Share Posted August 6, 2006 Thanks guys! I appreciate the help. I am going to check out the E-MU card to see how that works. I have been running my laptop on batterys during shows, but there are times I forget to plug it back in during a break. Maybe I can force it into a regular habit some how. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Byrdman Posted August 6, 2006 Share Posted August 6, 2006 I would expect that a firewire interface would also work better than an internal card. You could put one in a 2 or 3U X rack with a power conditioner and sit your laptop on top quite easilly. A pro quality sound card is what you need, one way or another. BTW anybody have a source for a 8U or larger 10" deep rack? I have not been able to find one. With modern devices 10" deep is plenty and saves space in the truck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
burningbusch Posted August 6, 2006 Share Posted August 6, 2006 My experiences are as follows: Had a Compaq laptop. Loud hum when connected to external amp/speakers. Hum goes away when run on batteries. Tried internal audio, USB, Firewire and even PCMCIA and had the exact same experiences with all. PCMCIA was RME so of decent quality. Tried another laptop, I think it was a Dell, with the same results. Got a Sony VAIO. No issue with hum when plugged into AC. Got a Apple iBook. Again no num issues when plugged into AC. Same noise level when running on batteries or AC. My conclusion, test the laptop to make sure it works properly under these conditions or return it. The power supplies on these laptops vary greatly. The Compaq provided something like 90 watts while the Sony was only 18 watts. If the issue goes away when you run on batteries doesn't that point to the power supply as a possible reason???? Also, I had a fairly expensive ($500) Furman power conditioner in my rack at the time. It would provide consistent proper voltage even if the club did not. It made no difference. Good luck. Busch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trill Posted August 6, 2006 Share Posted August 6, 2006 In my business, we were experiencing problems with noise when we tried to run our computor controlled machinery. The noise would cause the machine to do funny things or the program had trouble loading . We installed a Tripp-Lite Isobar after trying other surge protectors and a UPS. It has individually filtered outlets and appears to have eliminated almost all of the problems. And it only cost around $50.00 The lighting and wiring in a building can create a lot of interference and noise.Some of you guys may want to consider these for your home studios Tripp- LIte Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jazzwee Posted August 6, 2006 Share Posted August 6, 2006 Originally posted by burningbusch: My experiences are as follows: Had a Compaq laptop. Loud hum when connected to external amp/speakers. Hum goes away when run on batteries. Tried internal audio, USB, Firewire and even PCMCIA and had the exact same experiences with all. PCMCIA was RME so of decent quality. Tried another laptop, I think it was a Dell, with the same results. Got a Sony VAIO. No issue with hum when plugged into AC. Got a Apple iBook. Again no num issues when plugged into AC. Same noise level when running on batteries or AC. My conclusion, test the laptop to make sure it works properly under these conditions or return it. The power supplies on these laptops vary greatly. The Compaq provided something like 90 watts while the Sony was only 18 watts. If the issue goes away when you run on batteries doesn't that point to the power supply as a possible reason???? Also, I had a fairly expensive ($500) Furman power conditioner in my rack at the time. It would provide consistent proper voltage even if the club did not. It made no difference. Good luck. Busch. Just to be clear, my laptop is a dell. So whatever the reason(s) are for the noise, a proper sound card corrected it. Obviously the problem is in fact power issues, but what this tells me is that the more sophisticated sound cards have circuitry to filter these. Hamburg Steinway O, Crumar Mojo, Nord Electro 4 HP 73, EV ZXA1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dementedchord Posted August 8, 2006 Share Posted August 8, 2006 i had a small mixer(tascam) that i used on a keyboard rig back in the 70's that was susceptable to interference at a few clubs... the solution for me then and i suspect it will work here is a ferrite ring... about 11/2" ring 1/2" wide 1/4"deep ya loop the cord through it3-4 times and presto no noise... "style is determined not by what you can play but what you cant...." dave brubeck Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Still Learning Posted August 8, 2006 Share Posted August 8, 2006 Ferrite rings (also called RF chokes or inductors)usually help quite a bit, that's why you see them on many desk-top monitor AC cables and other AC cables. Remember that when you switch from AC power to battery power on many labtops, the CPU, the hard-drive, and some of the I/O clocks usually slow down and go into a lower power consumption mode. Running the CPU at a different (i.e. lower) clock speed can change the computers EMI susceptability significantly. On some machines there will be a significant change, on others no measureable change. Some laptop owners change the default clock speeds when powered from AC or battery. Bottom-line here is that if the labtop electronics themselves are picking up the stray EMI then power conditioning, ferrites etc. will have little effect because the original problem is not related to noise on the AC lines. My money is first and foremost on a high quality laptop that has been at least partially designed for high EMI environments, I would then invest in a high quality sound card. The benefits of which would be two fold: 1) a higher quality audio stream into/out-of the laptop and, 2) probably lower EMI on the audio/MIDI lines. Of course the cheapest way to go is try the ferrites first, if they work, great, if they don't then you're not out that much. just my $0.02 When most people go to work, they work. When musicians go to work, they play. Which do you prefer? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ITGITC Posted August 9, 2006 Share Posted August 9, 2006 http://www.ksr.ku.edu/libres/Mammals_of_Kansas/images/ferret.JPG Frankly, I can't see how a ring of ferrets is going to help anything. I'll just have to take your word for it, SL. "Music expresses that which cannot be put into words and that which cannot remain silent." - Victor Hugo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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