dansouth Posted July 26, 2001 Share Posted July 26, 2001 How you you rate a new synth? Will your buy a synth with great specs and mediocre sound? Will you buy a synth with great sound and a limited feature set? Do you make your decision to buy based on the presets, or do you delve in deeper (ROM quality, voice architecture, etc)? Do you try to pick up on the "buzz", or do you trust your own instincts regardless what others say? How important is the user interface, programmability, portability? How important is price? How important is the manufacturer's reputation for service, quality, bugs, etc.? What features are so attractive that you'll forgive other shortcomings to get them? What issues are showstoppers, i.e. what will keep you from buying a synth no matter what other nifty features it has? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Smedberg Posted July 26, 2001 Share Posted July 26, 2001 Hello brother Dan, I wrote a long answer to all your questions but forgot to enter my name and password. Since all went away, I'm a little pissed right now. http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/frown.gif Have to calm down first. http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/frown.gif I'll come back to you! http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/frown.gif ------------------ --Smedis,-- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roto Posted July 26, 2001 Share Posted July 26, 2001 That's because UBB sucks. I've had at least two posts killed because I forgot to enter my login, or I didn't capitalize my username. For as much as UBB costs, it should have cookies to remember that. Snitz Forum is free and doesn't kill posts like that. Grrr Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steadyb Posted July 26, 2001 Share Posted July 26, 2001 ...anyway... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guestuserguestuser.com Posted July 26, 2001 Share Posted July 26, 2001 Originally posted by Robert Smedberg: I wrote a long answer to all your questions but forgot to enter my name and password. Since all went away, I'm a little pissed right now. http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/frown.gif When that happens to me, I have found that if I hit the "Back" button on my browser (Netscape 4.7), I can sometimes get back to my message. You've probably already tried that, though? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dansouth Posted July 26, 2001 Author Share Posted July 26, 2001 Well gee, guys! Thanks for all the responses about synthesizers. I think we've already run the "UBB sucks" thing into the ground. Could you please start another thread if you want to bitch about it so that this one can get back on topic. Another good idea trashed... Dave, can you zap this thread so I can start over????? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guestuserguestuser.com Posted July 26, 2001 Share Posted July 26, 2001 Originally posted by dansouth@yahoo.com: How you you rate a new synth? Will your buy a synth with great specs and mediocre sound? Will you buy a synth with great sound and a limited feature set? Do you make your decision to buy based on the presets, or do you delve in deeper (ROM quality, voice architecture, etc)? Do you try to pick up on the "buzz", or do you trust your own instincts regardless what others say? How important is the user interface, programmability, portability? How important is price? How important is the manufacturer's reputation for service, quality, bugs, etc.? What features are so attractive that you'll forgive other shortcomings to get them? What issues are showstoppers, i.e. what will keep you from buying a synth no matter what other nifty features it has? This is really the $64,000 question, isn't it? For me, I think of what task I want it for, and go from there. If I want a sound module to just sit in my studio and perform a certain task, then it makes things a bit easier, since I don't have to worry about it's performance capabilities, for intance. From this point of view, the narrow er the focus on what you want it for, the easier it gets. For instance, if you wanted a module (no keyboard) to perform virtual analog synthesis, then you have several to choose from. I'd probably go mostly for sound quality in that case, and maybe on user interface, ease of programmability and so on. The more you want it to do, the harder it gets. For me, the hardest thing to find has been a good performance synth that has good bread-and-butter keyboard sounds (piano, rhodes, wurly, b3, analog synth leads, strings, etc.), is lightweight, has a well-though-out user interface designed for performing, and has a 88- or 76-note keyboard with weighted action, that could also act as a keyboard controller. When you start looking for this instrument, you will be faced with having to make so many compromises that it gets very depressing. You can find a good 88-note weighted action digital piano that has good acoustic piano sound (Yamaha P80), but it sucks in all other deparments. You can find a really good modelled B3 (Korg CX3) but it won't have any of the other features. You can find an 88-note weighted action synth that has pretty good controller features (Yamaha S80, Kurzweil PC2, Roland SP88? is that right?) but it will be over 50 lbs, and won't have really good organ and leslie sounds, or it will have velocity-switched Rhodes sounds that will depress the hell out of you, or it will have only 4 sliders for it's drawbar organ, or there will be other infuriating compromise. I'm getting to the point where I'm about ready to abandon the search for this instrument. I think I have to re-align my goals, and re-think this, because it looks like I'm never going to get what I want unless I compromise on the sound, or on the features, or the interface, or something. The depressing thing for me is that all the components to make such a keyboard are available on the market in various keyboards and modules, but noone is willing to package them together, without a lot of compromise. This is because such an instrument would be expensive, I suppose. Regarding the "buzz" thing, that's very dangerous. You can't help being influenced by what you hear, but I have learned over the years, as I gain more knowledge about keyboards and synths, and as I get more confident about my own particular needs, that I place less and less value in what I hear from other people, since the things others find important may not be important to me at all, and vice versa. "What features are so attractive that you'll forgive other shortcomings to get them?" It's a shame we have to make so many compromises, isn't it? Why should we have to make these compromises? If you go looking for a car or truck for instance, you could probably find one that would meet your needs, no matter what those needs are, since there are a wide spectrum of designs avialable for different purposes. The only problem might be money (lack of it). But with keyboards, they all seem to be designed to cost $3000 or less. Can you imagine if automobiles and trucks were designed like that? If every vehicle had to cost $12,000 or less? This message has been edited by guestuser@guestuser.com on 07-26-2001 at 01:07 PM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steadyb Posted July 26, 2001 Share Posted July 26, 2001 Originally posted by dansouth@yahoo.com: How you you rate a new synth? On a scale from 1 to 10 (10 being best) Will your buy a synth with great specs and mediocre sound? no Will you buy a synth with great sound and a limited feature set? yes Do you make your decision to buy based on the presets, or do you delve in deeper (ROM quality, voice architecture, etc)? Presets are a good starting point, but where you can go from there is important too. Do you try to pick up on the "buzz", or do you trust your own instincts regardless what others say? Once I've picked up a good buzz, I then trust my instinct. How important is the user interface, programmability, portability? Depends on the synth. On the Andromeda it was very important.(user interface, programmability) How important is price? It's not. I can usually work out a pretty good deal. How important is the manufacturer's reputation for service, quality, bugs, etc.? not very What features are so attractive that you'll forgive other shortcomings to get them? I suppose if a synth came with Elle MacPherson included, I wouldn't care what the hell it did. What issues are showstoppers, i.e. what will keep you from buying a synth no matter what other nifty features it has? If I were to receive an electrical shock whenever I touched it. Of course, if I were to receive an electrical shock whenever I touched Elle MacPherson, that would still be worth it. This message has been edited by steadyb on 07-26-2001 at 01:39 PM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Smedberg Posted July 26, 2001 Share Posted July 26, 2001 Ooops. I didn't mean to start this kind of fuzz. Sorry for that Dan!! Well I'm calm now and can answer your questions. Can you forgive me? How you you rate a new synth? Will your buy a synth with great specs and mediocre sound? I think I can do that to some degree. I bought a K2500 because I liked the idea to have up to eight split zones in setup mode and even splits in program mode if I like to. I have had to many synths that just could have four zones. Well, the sounds isn't bad though. Will you buy a synth with great sound and a limited feature set? If I like to add a "bread'n butter" synth to my list I can live with that. Do you make your decision to buy based on the presets, or do you delve in deeper (ROM quality, voice architecture, etc)? Definitly dig deeper!! Do you try to pick up on the "buzz", or do you trust your own instincts regardless what others say? I trust my instinct. It's me who's gonna use it. How important is the user interface, programmability, portability? Very important. How important is price? Not at all. If I want something badly and also need it I buy it. How important is the manufacturer's reputation for service, quality, bugs, etc.? Minor importance. What features are so attractive that you'll forgive other shortcomings to get them? Don't know. What issues are showstoppers, i.e. what will keep you from buying a synth no matter what other nifty features it has? A bad keybed is something that can make me leave at once. Like the SQ-80. Horrible!! ------------------ --Smedis,-- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aeon Posted July 26, 2001 Share Posted July 26, 2001 How you you rate a new synth? As a function of the sum total of a number of factors, and for me the big ones are sound quality/nature, programming facilities/synth architecture, user interface and unique features. Will your buy a synth with great specs and mediocre sound? Absolutely not. Sound is the raison d'etre of my purchase. Will you buy a synth with great sound and a limited feature set? Without question...and I have done so. That said, there is some minimum threshold for features and functionality that must be met for me to consider a purchase. Do you make your decision to buy based on the presets, or do you delve in deeper (ROM quality, voice architecture, etc)? I will check out presets because they sometimes show some of the voice capability of the synth, but in general I do not give them much weight. My usual method is to fully read the manual, online or in the store, and then do some truffle-rooting...checking samples, loops and splits if it is a ROM-based wave device, otherwise checking the nature of the raw oscillator(s). I check envelope and LFO speeds/limits. I evaluate the nature and variety of filters. I am very critical of the number and variety of modulation routings. I dont know what more to say...I dont leave any stone unturned. This may take hours in a store, but I find most stores dont care because of my history with them, or the idea I am about to drop a chunk of cash with them. Do you try to pick up on the "buzz", or do you trust your own instincts regardless what others say? There are a few people I know on mailing lists whose opinion will spur me to check something out, but I dont pay much attention to buzz. I feel I have enough experience with synths at this point to trust my own instincts and judgements. I do enjoy reading a well-written review, although those seem to be far and in-between. How important is the user interface, programmability, portability? UI: 8 out of a possible 10 points of weight for importance. If I am going to use it, it had better be non-painful to do so...in fact, the UI should enhance the end experience. Programmability: 10 out of a possible 10 points of weight for importance. I want control, and meaningful control in terms of shaping sound. This is core. This relates directly to the end sound produced, and as a programmer, I require a good, programmble engine. Portability: 2 out of a possible 10 points of weight for importance. I dont gig much at all, so I rarely transport my synths. How important is price? It is important, as my resources are limited, but I do not consider price to be a major factor in my purchase decisions...just a medium-important one. How important is the manufacturer's reputation for service, quality, bugs, etc.? In this day and age of flashable OS-via-download synths, it has become very, very important. The age of fixed-feature-set synths is over...I expect meaningful updates, bug-fixes and even feature additions from the manufacturer that extend the power of the synth beyond what it had at the time of purchase. This being so, I always buy with the idea in mind the synth may never be updated, and it should be considered as finished the day I buy it. Bug fixes, however, are a must. Build quality is very important. I am willing to pay for it. Wall-warts are worse than line-lumps, but both suck ass. Internal PSUs with detachable IEC power jacks make me happy. Having direct communication with the developers/programmers is also important to me...but not required. What features are so attractive that you'll forgive other shortcomings to get them? Incredible sound combined with a deeply programmable and flexible synthesis engine controlled by a good UI...and that is about it. What issues are showstoppers, i.e. what will keep you from buying a synth no matter what other nifty features it has? Poor, uninspiring sound. Crappy ROM samples in a wave-playback synth. Lack of programming facilities. Slow envelopes. LFOs that do not enter the audio range. Lack of modulation routings. Obvious unpleasant aliasing artifacts (as opposed to the pleasing variety). Pedestrian sounds. Poor build quality. A price above $5K USD. Use of a wall-wart. (just kidding!) http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/biggrin.gif [edited for fluxored UBB code] This message has been edited by aeon@mediaone.net on 07-26-2001 at 04:35 PM Go tell someone you love that you love them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Postman Posted July 26, 2001 Share Posted July 26, 2001 ***How you you rate a new synth? Almost completely by how it sounds, especially the acoustic piano sound. However, if the action is such that it annoys me, that would have a big influence on my decision. After that, it's organ sound, pads, and lead synth in decreasing order of importance. I agree with the person above who complained about the lack of a synth out there that does all four well. [i played a Kurzweil 2600xs the other day. In my mind it comes pretty damn close. $3700, though: that's steep for me.] ***Will your buy a synth with great specs and mediocre sound? No. ***Will you buy a synth with great sound and a limited feature set? Yes. After 20 years I have to admit to myself that I suck at programming timbres. I'm so discouraged I don't even try any more. Is there a book out there on the subject? ***Do you make your decision to buy based on the presets, or do you delve in deeper (ROM quality, voice architecture, etc)? I'm a professional software developer, so in spite of my previous answer for some reason I still look into what the engine can do. Maybe it's just wanting to show off to guitar players. http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/wink.gif An onboard sampler will lessen the importance of the presets in my mind. ***Do you try to pick up on the "buzz", or do you trust your own instincts regardless what others say? I use my ears. I think what a person likes to hear is very subjective. The threads that talk about this synth being better than that synth don't make sense to me. It depends what you like, you know? ***How important is the user interface, programmability, portability? For the first two, somewhat. As a developer I find lousy UIs irritating (because I take them seriously and they should, too), but I can usually figure out what the programmer was thinking. Portability is key. If the DS8 didn't weigh 80 lbs., I'd own it. How important is price? Very. Unlike most of the people on this board, music is no longer my profession. I tried and starved then sold out. It's a hobby now. I have trouble justifying big purchases. I sometimes wish I played guitar. Seems like guitar equipment is way cheaper. ***How important is the manufacturer's reputation for service, quality, bugs, etc.? Not very. I've never had a synth break down on me. I don't tour or anything, so I can protect my equipment from taking all but minor abuse. I've never had to call tech support. The synths I've used haven't been hard to figure out. ***What features are so attractive that you'll forgive other shortcomings to get them? The piano sound. I bought a U-20 a decade ago based on that alone. Midi delay be damned. ***What issues are showstoppers, i.e. what will keep you from buying a synth no matter what other nifty features it has? Uninspiring sounds. Weight. Excessive price. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bucktunes Posted July 28, 2001 Share Posted July 28, 2001 Originally posted by dansouth@yahoo.com: How you you rate a new synth? Will your buy a synth with great specs and mediocre sound? Will you buy a synth with great sound and a limited feature set? I'd never buy a synth if I wasn't impressed with the sound, no matter how many bells and whistles it has. As far as features, it depends on how central to my rig I plan on making it. I'd still be willing to make it my secondary synth if it sounded great, but was skimpy on features. Do you make your decision to buy based on the presets, or do you delve in deeper (ROM quality, voice architecture, etc)? Do you try to pick up on the "buzz", or do you trust your own instincts regardless what others say? Initially, the "buzz" is what gets my attention to try it out. I rarely bother touching a synth if I haven't heard good things about it. Once I start playing it I can tune out whatever hype I've heard and use my own ears to judge it, though. The presets certainly tell me the sound quality of the synth, but I won't judge it's capabilities on just the presets. Usually I've done my research homework before I go to the store so I can just listen when I play it. My rule of thumb is; If it takes me 15 minutes to get past the first 10 presets, it might be love! http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/biggrin.gif How important is the user interface, programmability, portability? How important is price? How important is the manufacturer's reputation for service, quality, bugs, etc.? User interface is very important. I want it to be so intuitive that I rarely need to open the manual. Programming is not much of an issue as long as I can easily get to the most commonly tweaked parameters. Portability is fairly important since I usually need to set up and break down fairly quickly. It should be portable enough that I can take it in and out of it's case and set it up by myself. As long as it can be bought for $2K or less I'm not too fussy about price. I'll only buy stuff that's stone reliable, so reputation is VERY important. I have no patience for flaky equipment! Expandability is important, too. Especially if it's my main synth. What features are so attractive that you'll forgive other shortcomings to get them? Great sound, playability, at a bargain price. What issues are showstoppers, i.e. what will keep you from buying a synth no matter what other nifty features it has? Unimpressive sound, questionable reliability, a spongy keyboard, poor MIDI performance. An example of that last point; A few years ago I almost bought a Korg SGProX until I found out it only received on 1 MIDI channel! Good thing I decided to wait, because now there are numerous competitors that don't have this limitation. I don't buy new keyboards very often, so I have to be sure that whatever I buy will keep me happy for years. That's why it always comes down to sound. Bells and whistles will lose their novelty eventually, so you'd better like the way it sounds! I expect I'll be playing my Triton for a long time. http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/smile.gif Peace all, Steve ><> Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joegerardi Posted July 28, 2001 Share Posted July 28, 2001 There's really only 2 requirements for me: Sound, and feel of the keybed. Those are all that are necessary. If it's a module, then all that matters is the sound. I don't care about effects, arpeggiators, et al, and I've been programming them so long (Gawd! I just realized that it's been 30 years since I got my first synth!) that I can pretty much get whatever I need out of them one way or another. Setup: Korg Kronos 61, Roland XV-88, Korg Triton-Rack, Motif-Rack, Korg N1r, Alesis QSR, Roland M-GS64 Yamaha KX-88, KX76, Roland Super-JX, E-Mu Longboard 61, Kawai K1II, Kawai K4. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guestuserguestuser.com Posted July 28, 2001 Share Posted July 28, 2001 Originally posted by joegerardi: There's really only 2 requirements for me: Sound, and feel of the keybed. Those are all that are necessary. If it's a module, then all that matters is the sound. I don't care about effects, arpeggiators, et al, and I've been programming them so long (Gawd! I just realized that it's been 30 years since I got my first synth!) that I can pretty much get whatever I need out of them one way or another. That point of view always makes me scratch my head. Maybe you do have good programming skills, I'm not questioning that. But in my experience, you can't "make a silk hat out of a sow's ear", as my mom used to say. Or, to use a cruder, more modern version, "you can't polish a turd". Let's say you have a ROMpler with a built-in set of piano samples, and you want to edit a patch to make it sound better. Now matter how good your programming skills, the quality of the original samples will be a severely limiting factor. Ok, on to Rhodes patches, my "pet peeve". It will depend on a lot of factors. Let's say you're working with a ROMpler or sampler. It will depend on the quality of the base samples, obviously. It will depend on whether the synth supports velocity-crossfading or only cross-switching. If it supports cross-switching, then it will depend on how many cross-switches are avialable. If there are only two cross-switches avialable, and no cross-fading, then there will be only so much you can accomplish unless you decide to forego velocity switching, in which case, the only way to make it respond to velocity is through filter EG's and amp EG's. There's only so much you can do with that. So while I agree that with good programming skills, you can manipulate the sound a lot. But the ultimate sound will be limited by what's avialable to you, in my opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soapbox Posted July 29, 2001 Share Posted July 29, 2001 THESE ARE MY PRIORITIES: (in order of importance) 1) Does it have a sound that's cool and unique? I've got a ton of good piano sounds, thank you! 2) How good are the factory sounds? I'm willing to take the time to program my own if need be, but I do a lot of work under deadline conditions, so I like to get good sounds up and going fast! 3) How easy is it to tweak the sounds? If the sound is almost good enough, can I make it right quickly or will I have to go hunting through scores of sounds again until I find one that's just right? 4) Does it come in a rackmount version? I really only need one weighted and one unweighted controller. Extra keyboards are wasted space as far as I'm concerned. Gimme racks!!! 5) If it's a software synth, what kind of copy protection scheme is used? I hate dongles!!! Arrgh! I also hate having to repeatedly reenter serial codes! 6) What do my friends and reviewers say? They will lead me to features I might not have found on my own. 7) How much does it cost? Rarely a consideration, since most synths tend to run in about the same the $1,000 - $2,000 range. However, Andy's price tag is a deal breaker for me at this point in time. (On the other hand, the Andromeda should hold its value better than my first E-IV which, including 128 MB of RAM, cost me $7,000 in 1996. I'd be lucky to get $2,000 for that sampler today!) 8) How reliable are the manufacturers products? This was once a much higher consideration, but it's rare to find truly buggy products these days. Enthusiasm powers the world. Craig Anderton's Archiving Article Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Bryce Posted July 30, 2001 Share Posted July 30, 2001 Originally posted by guestuser@guestuser.com: That point of view always makes me scratch my head. Maybe you do have good programming skills, I'm not questioning that. But in my experience, you can't "make a silk hat out of a sow's ear", as my mom used to say. Or, to use a cruder, more modern version, "you can't polish a turd". Maybe I'm missing something here... http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/confused.gif I don't think that Joe is saying anything about polishing a turd. It seems to me that what Joe is saying is (and I hope that he'll correct me if I am wrong) that if a product sounds really great to him, he's sold. If so, I agree with him. Sound is everything to me, period. One of the things that people who know me have heard me say ad nauseum is that I believe that there are five good reasons to buy a synth (or any musical instrument, for that matter). They are: The sound The sound The sound The feel of the keys The sound. If the unit in question is a module, change the fourth reason to "the sound". Sound is pretty much the only reason that I buy any instrument. If the keybed feels bad, I'm frequently even willing to forgive that as long the thing has MIDI so I can play it from something else. If it has a killer feature set/spec sheet and doesn't sound good to me, I probably don't want it at any price, because I almost certainly won't use something that doesn't inspire me, and it'll just collect dust. Along with Joe, I too feel that I've been programming long enough that I can pretty much get what I want out of most machines, regardless of the UI. There are definitely certain machines whose UIs appeal to me more than others, but I am more than willing to tackle a cryptic interface if the synth that it's controlling rocks my world. Hey, man - I have a Chroma...you haven't lived until you've tried to program one of those bad boys. If you don't have the manual handy, you can pretty much forget it. ...great sound, though... http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/wink.gifhttp://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/biggrin.gif dB ==> David Bryce Music • Funky Young Monks <== Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joegerardi Posted July 30, 2001 Share Posted July 30, 2001 Dave: You hit the nail on the head. If the sound is there, but perhaps not tweaked the way I want it, I know I'll get it to where I want it to be. This is a quote off my home page: "I tend to gravitate towards older synths: I don't feel there's any newer keyboards out there that really are much of an innovation over the older stuff. There's been little in technological breakthroughs in the last 12 years, really, it's just rehashing the same old technology, and adding more bells and whistles. I'm against that. I'm a player. I don't care about things like sequencers, effects, arpeggiators, ad nauseum. Give me an instrument. Something to play, not programmed songs. Music is living, breathing ART, not some digital button-pushing program that creates sterile music." If the piano sound is close, but not quite what I believe the sound should be, then I'll MAKE it the sound I want. Same for every other sound in there. Really, with today's instruments, there's few that don't have great, usuable samples. That said, I DO tend to shy away from instruments that really boast fabulous effects. To me, they are kind of a crutch for not getting great programming. If a piano (Hammond, Rhodes, Moog-type sound, etc.,) sound good dry, then they can only sound better once some judicious use of effects are employed. I don't want the newest goo-gaws. I want an instrument. THAT said, I just wish I could figure out the effects setion of the Alesis stuff. Nothing has ever been harder for me to try to program, C++ included! http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/biggrin.gifhttp://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/smile.gifhttp://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/biggrin.gifhttp://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/smile.gifhttp://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/biggrin.gif Setup: Korg Kronos 61, Roland XV-88, Korg Triton-Rack, Motif-Rack, Korg N1r, Alesis QSR, Roland M-GS64 Yamaha KX-88, KX76, Roland Super-JX, E-Mu Longboard 61, Kawai K1II, Kawai K4. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Bryce Posted July 30, 2001 Share Posted July 30, 2001 Originally posted by joegerardi: THAT said, I just wish I could figure out the effects setion of the Alesis stuff. Nothing has ever been harder for me to try to program, C++ included! Yeah, it is a bit tough to navigate, isn't it? http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/eek.gifhttp://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/rolleyes.gifhttp://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/eek.gif The way that I learned the Alesis fx section was to make photocopies of the five algorithms, and then I taped them to my wall until I could see them in my head. That made a big difference. If you really want to get into it, use the Unisyn editor that came with the stuff - it gives you a much better visual representation of what is going on. Also, if you have specific questions, please feel free to post 'em here. There are a few of us who may be able to help you... http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/wink.gif dB ==> David Bryce Music • Funky Young Monks <== Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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