How do you work?

[d-kay]

Well, I came to think of this when I was experiencing "writer's block". I usually have a structure to how I create my tunes:

 

1. Fiddeling around with sounds until something catches my ear.

2. quickly just record it on my seq. (no drums or metronome, as they usually distract me from the original rythm)

3. Add a simple beat, just so that I can quantisize my original tune

3b. Adjust the tune so it fits to a 4-bar-pattern

 

4. Paste the original tune (which always seems to turn up as a bassline) a couple bars along with the simple drums.

5. Then I try to come up with a melody by recording while looping the 4 bars of bassline.

 

I always seem to fail at point 5. My bassline is somewhat to expressive, and leaves little or no room for the melody.

 

Any opinions?, tips?

[Bobro]

Being able to write an expressive bass line is a great gift- don't sacrifice that!

 

If you've got a good bassline and you learn the good old-fashioned "species counterpoint", you're set. There are many books on this

I'd suggest "Gradus ad Parnassum" by JJ Fux, the text Mozart used, as a start.

 

It's not about writing "classical music", it's about writing melodies that work together. The book starts off with very simple and restricted exercises, by the time you're through (it goes quick) you'll just hear the stuff without thinking about it and you can break the rules to your heart's content. Don't be fooled by the jargon- this stuff is totally organic and goes on all the time, usually unconciously and with different terminology. Although counterpoint texts usually deal with a specific style, the ideas can be applied to any style, from Palestrina to Weber to funk.

 

This way you can keep your bassline expressive- the whole point of "the rules" was originally to keep the melodies strong and true to themselves while working well together. On the other extreme, you can deliberately bend the "rules" to the point where the lines disappear into one smooov sound that sounds like a evolving chords.

 

If you don't read music, you can learn all this anyway, chances are your ear is already there, it's just a matter of a few simple ideas. IMO someone who understands "it's too hollow and medieval sounding here" has a more accurate perception of "the rules" than someone who needs to see the notes to know "there are forbidden parallel fifths" and it's just as musical to say "this line goes up while this line goes down" as "contrary motion".

 

If you post a bassline, there at least several people who post here at the forum regularly who can Fux with it both by the book and breaking the rules deliberately. Once you get it, you're off and running and will never be at a loss to come up with fine melodies over your bassline, or basslines for your vocal melody, or whatever.

 

-CB

[Raymar]

I used to build up tunes like that a section at a time, now I like to improvise for a half hour or so non-stop with a few sounds in realtime and record it in MIDI or on tape, then edit it down. It takes your mind to different places.

[d-kay]

Hmm, that book "Gradus ad Parnassum" , is it full of terms that a mediocre flute-player wouldn't understand?. I know what about basic minor/major chords, scales, and other basic music-notation. But when it comes to counter-point and chord-progression, I'm totally lost.

 

/d-kay

[Llarion]

My songs are more constructs than anything else. I sort of work backwards. The first thing I'll do is write a chord progression, and based on the chordal rhythm, a drum part will develop. I flesh the entire arrangement out in my head, and I record drums first, then the main key bed, then bass, then rhythm guitar, then string and other embellishments.

 

At that point, I'll usually write the melody. http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/biggrin.gif

 

 

 

------------------

Cheers!

 

Phil "Llarion: The Jazzinator" Traynor

www.mp3.com/llarion

Smooth Jazz

[Bobro]

Originally posted by Raymar:

I used to build up tunes like that a section at a time, now I like to improvise for a half hour or so non-stop with a few sounds in realtime and record it in MIDI or on tape, then edit it down. It takes your mind to different places.

 

"It takes your mind to different places" - yeah that's actually the most important thing I was trying to say! Excellent. I'm often somewhat hesitant about bringing up "technical" things, but it's like a boxer using a jump-rope- it's definitely a useful thing, but it's not like he's going to bust out with a jump-rope in the middle of the heavyweight championship. Giving your opponent a heart-attack from laughing isn't kosher according to Queensbury rules.

 

d-kay, the great thing about the older counterpoint books is that they're melody rather than chord-based. Historically the chords came from the melodies, not vice-versa. (I read some turn-of-the-century musicologist's paper on how I-V-I in Major is the only natural form of music, complete with his notational corrections of Bach's fuck-ups, but...judge for yourself.)

 

In your case you're strength is the basslines (melodies) so it seems natural to work from there.

 

But of course starting with chords is just as legitimate, different strokes for different folks.

 

Good pop music and good mixing is loaded with good old-fashioned counterpoint and voice leading because the same fundamental "rules" apply- keep the melodies singable, keep the mix from getting muddy.

 

There should be a book explaining the process for those who don't read music at all- the ear is where it's at anyway. "Up the Fire Escape to Parnassum, subtitled Whatever it Takes, by Professor Proletarijatski".

 

Anyway, check it out, if you've been jamming and recording for a while you'll probably have a more immediate and deeper understanding of what's going on than a lot of consevatory students (and maybe some of their teachers too, hehe).

 

-CB