Dave Bryce Posted December 12, 2000 Share Posted December 12, 2000 Another Lightner topic: Which of your synths produce nice results when layered together? I have a couple: 1) PPG Wave 2.2 and Prophet VS - complex timbres galore! 2) Jupiter-8 (w/ MIDI retrofit, obviously) and Andromeda - fat and sizzly beyond belief 3) Wavestation and MKS-80 - analog meets digital. Once, I MIDI'd the JP8, MKS-80, Andromeda, and the Wave together. Cost me a bunch of $$$ to repair the foundation of my house... http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/biggrin.gif dB ==> David Bryce Music • Funky Young Monks <== Professional Affiliations: Royer Labs • Music Player Network Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pim Posted December 13, 2000 Share Posted December 13, 2000 Eh... I never layer. It is something I never do because I just love to hear the differences in characters between my synths. 15 Years ago, in my band, I layered a JX3P and a DX7 together. That was a good combination for on stage. But in the studio, I found out that more is not always better. However Dave, you made me curious. I'll give it a try with my VS, K5000s, Microwave XT, Jupiter6, and Andromeda, and I'll let you know in this forum what my favorite combi is going to be. ------------------ www.dancewave.nl My Music I always wondered what happened after the fade out? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marino Posted December 13, 2000 Share Posted December 13, 2000 Mmmm Dave, it seems that we love the same kind of synths... Almost every one of the sounds that I use is a combination of two or three different synthesizers. The Chroma, God bless it, was a very peculiar case: it was powerful beyond belief for solo sounds, but you couldn't layer it with anything else; it would start to show all its pitch imperfections, and it would sound awful. For Mini-type solo sounds, there is no substitute for the original; but I usually layer a Wavestation with the XP-80 (Vintage board). For dark and dense textures, nothing beats the K2000 and Matrix-12 together. Also, Wavestation plus Matrix for every kind of pad. If I need something with a bright, fast and percussive sound, I may layer an FM synth (TG77) with some marimba from the XP-80, and pan them. K2000 and VL1-m for *every* kind of "organic" melodic sound... This is what I would start with if I were in a hurry. BUT as you know, the real programming pleasure is in trying to break the rules, or simply "start fresh"... So if I have time, I just like to experiment! BTW I've noticed that when I work at tracks with lots of acoustic instruments (that is, most of times), I just NEED to layer, in order to compare with the complexities of guitars, saxes, percussion, etc.. By layering, of course, I mean using multiple sounds *to build a composite one*. When the track is more "synth only", I could use one synth per sound, but there are going to be a lot more "different" sounds. my 1 cent marino Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Bryce Posted December 13, 2000 Author Share Posted December 13, 2000 Originally posted by marino: For dark and dense textures, nothing beats the K2000 and Matrix-12 together. Ooooh - I'll bet that's great. My K2000 likes to be MIDI'd to my Chroma a whole bunch...I actually like to double them both in this combo, using two channels from the K2k panned from 10 to 2 o'clock, and two channels from the Chroma (hooray for the Syntec interface!) panned from 8:30 to 3:30 It does sound like we have extremely similar tastes in synths, doesn't it? http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/wink.gif Unfortunately, after displaying error messages for the past two months upon boot-up, my Chroma has just dropped completely dead, and will hopefully soon be going on holiday at Mr. Lightner's place. http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/frown.gif dB ==> David Bryce Music • Funky Young Monks <== Professional Affiliations: Royer Labs • Music Player Network Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
synthfoolsynthfool.com Posted December 13, 2000 Share Posted December 13, 2000 "my Chroma has just dropped completely dead, and will hopefully soon be going on holiday at Mr. Lightner's place." Unless you're planning on adding on a third wing to this place or renting the empty apt next door for me, I don't think that's gonna be happening anytime soon. Sorry. I'm having trouble even walking in here right now. Btw, I plan on finishing the "Devil's own Odyssey" sometime in 2001. Seems appropriate (2001 -A Spaced Odyssey). I apologize if this is an inside joke, but to put it simply I've been doing the completely ridiculous to an Arp Odyssey- modding it with TONS of stuff (wavetable oscilltor, Multimode filter, VC'd LFO's, wider ranges, distortion, midi, etc, etc, Only 20 something extra LEDS so far though... http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/smile.gif Too bad it's not ready for Christmas... I have no tree. http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/smile.gif K Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 13, 2000 Share Posted December 13, 2000 I never layer either (except within a synth). Tend to want to pull out the character of a synth (if it has character). Maybe I should try more of it though. I've stayed away from layering because of some bad experiences of turning mixes to mush. (But those were the rompler days.) In a sense I do layer in the sense that I may have multiple synth lines happening at the same time. I think that Rolands and Kurzweils compliment each other. Rolands and Yamahas fit together well (each sound remains distinct). I do wonder how some of these spacy romplers (K2, QS, JV, Wavestation) will sound when run through an Andromeda. Cheers, Jerry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Bryce Posted December 13, 2000 Author Share Posted December 13, 2000 Originally posted by synthfool@synthfool.com: Btw, I plan on finishing the "Devil's own Odyssey" sometime in 2001. I apologize if this is an inside joke, but to put it simply I've been doing the completely ridiculous to an Arp Odyssey- modding it with TONS of stuff (wavetable oscilltor, Multimode filter, VC'd LFO's, wider ranges, distortion, midi, etc, etc, Only 20 something extra LEDS so far though... K Mine!!! Mine!!!! I saw it first!!! http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/biggrin.gif Okay, maybe Mike Peake saw it before I did... dB ==> David Bryce Music • Funky Young Monks <== Professional Affiliations: Royer Labs • Music Player Network Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pim Posted December 15, 2000 Share Posted December 15, 2000 Layering is bad for your nightrest. 1. Andromeda and Prophet VS This combi is the end the world. Just fat and huge. 2. Prophet VS and Microwave XT. Never a dull moment. 3. Andromeda and Andromeda. No, I don't have two Andy's. (like some of us http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/wink.gif ) I am constructing the factory Mixes at this moment. Everybody who ever heard an Andromeda: hold your breath until you'll hear the mixes. Woooosh!! I made some layered beauties... ------------------ www.dancewave.nl My Music I always wondered what happened after the fade out? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Bryce Posted January 16, 2001 Author Share Posted January 16, 2001 I expected bigger things from this thread, so I'm bumping it from the back page. http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/smile.gif Are there only a few of us who like to layer different synths? It's a way favorite method of mine to find inspiration for a new tune - it's almost like getting a new synth in it's own way... dB ==> David Bryce Music • Funky Young Monks <== Professional Affiliations: Royer Labs • Music Player Network Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sbrock1san.rr.com Posted January 16, 2001 Share Posted January 16, 2001 The Roland D-50 layers well with just about everything. Most samples sound out of tune to me so I tend to layer them with a synthesized sound. Layering synths can give you an effect similar to chorusing and flanging only more complex and interesting to my ears. Drum machine sounds such as cymbals and hi-hats benefit from layering too, especially if they are old 12-bit samples. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joegerardi Posted January 16, 2001 Share Posted January 16, 2001 Korg M1 and the Emu Vintage Keys. For my old-fashioned sounds it was the cat's ass. Another one I liked was the Casio CZ-1 and a Yamaha TZ81Z Setup: Korg Kronos 61, Roland XV-88, Korg Triton-Rack, Motif-Rack, Korg N1r, Alesis QSR, Roland M-GS64 Yamaha KX-88, KX76, Roland Super-JX, E-Mu Longboard 61, Kawai K1II, Kawai K4. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wormhole Posted January 16, 2001 Share Posted January 16, 2001 It's preety simple but i like to layer my micromoog and my Korg micropreset. They give a great bass tone that fits in a mix really well (with a little filtering). Been trying different sounds to layer my Fizmo with but it has such a distinct sound it's kinda hard to find a good match. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marino Posted January 17, 2001 Share Posted January 17, 2001 "Korg micropreset"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jg42 Posted January 17, 2001 Share Posted January 17, 2001 Back in the old days I layered Yamaha TX81Z+KawaiK1+KorgDS-8... The Sound was great... http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/cool.gif I think the key was that all these synths were using the different synthesis method... ------------------ Kind Regards, Arseny www.mp3.com/arseny Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wormhole Posted January 17, 2001 Share Posted January 17, 2001 Korg micropresett http://www.synthmuseum.com/korg/kormp01.html Pretty basic but has good bass sound and the traveler is cool. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marino Posted January 17, 2001 Share Posted January 17, 2001 Thanks Wormhole! I thought that I knew it all... http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/smile.gif (Um, is it correct English?) http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/smile.gif marino Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DBENNVAhotmail.com Posted January 18, 2001 Share Posted January 18, 2001 Peeps, In my old set up I had a Korg/Wavestation EX, & a Roland/JD-990 among other things that together sounded awesome. I'm experimenting with stuff in the Korg/Triton Rack,& the Roland/XV-5080 now. I'm lucky that I have Opcode/Studio Vision Pro that allows me to set up custom instruments that are made up of different sounds from different MIDI devices that will play all at the same time. I make up the instrument, & tell it what sounds I want to play from what MIDI device on whatever MIDI channel, & it does it. I could fire the same note on 8 different MIDI channels in each device, including triggering 8 different devices all at the same time. The ultimate in multi-timbral functionality. It's awesome the flexibility it has. Don't know of another program that will allow me to do this. All this through an emagic/Unitor 8 Mk.II USB/MIDI patchbay. It's way better than daisy chaining stuff. Quantum! C/O DBENNVA@hotmail.com This message has been edited by DBENNVA@hotmail.com on 01-17-2001 at 06:49 PM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Bryce Posted January 22, 2001 Author Share Posted January 22, 2001 Originally posted by DBENNVA@hotmail.com: I could fire the same note on 8 different MIDI channels in each device, including triggering 8 different devices all at the same time. The ultimate in multi-timbral functionality. It's awesome the flexibility it has. Don't know of another program that will allow me to do this. All this through an emagic/Unitor 8 Mk.II USB/MIDI patchbay. It's way better than daisy chaining stuff. Digital Performer also allows this - they call them device groups. Same deal - you can fire multiple channels on multiple synths with a single keystroke. You can also edit and reference the data as a single track. dB ==> David Bryce Music • Funky Young Monks <== Professional Affiliations: Royer Labs • Music Player Network Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keyman Posted January 23, 2001 Share Posted January 23, 2001 I like to layer the attack element of the FM and/or PCM synth with the body of the warm analog sound. My favorite layer synths are: DX/TX; JV-2080's; Pro-VS; Wavestation; Juno-60 and Pro-10. Hooked on Keys... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erik Norlander Posted January 29, 2001 Share Posted January 29, 2001 In the mid-80s, the "big thing" was to layer DX7 and Prophet-5. My verdict? Cool. I did this for a while, but being more of an Oberheim guy back then, I generally used the OBXa and later the OB8 with the DX7 instead of the Prophet. Of course, I had a Rev 3 Prophet, and we all know that the Rev 3 was "not the one". And yes, I spent a small fortune on MIDI retrofits... Nowadays I find that layering a sample playback synth with an analog synth yields excellent results. I have had much success layering my Alesis QS synths with the Roland MKS series stuff, specifically the MKS-80 and MKS-70. For brass and string sounds this is particularly effective. And if you don't mind that it doesn't sound remotely "real", my favorite layer *ever* is a sawtooth brass sound made up of MKS-70 and CS-80. Yes, and I actually have to double track them. Haven't sprung for the Kenton CS-80 MIDI kit yet... Cheers, Erik PS - Don't ever layer anything with a Minimoog. It's just wrong. The Mini is perfect on its own. I've done it a lot in the past and I deeply regret it now. ;-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Botch. Posted February 1, 2001 Share Posted February 1, 2001 Has anyone experimented with different types of synthesis, as opposed to specific synth models? For instance, I found layering my old "bell-like" DX7 with the fatness of an analog synth (Korg EX800) sounded nice, but layering FM with another FM didn't sound so nice. Anyone experiment with say, analog on ROMPLER, granular on FM, Phazed on Photo, etc? Botch "Eccentric language often is symptomatic of peculiar thinking" - George Will www.puddlestone.net Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
synthiboy1 Posted June 12, 2001 Share Posted June 12, 2001 Sometimes I layer the Korg PS 3100 with the 3200 . The 3200 goes through the Roland Re 501 and the 3100 goes through the Roland re 201.( both tape echoes) Sounds very strange and weird. C C Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Bryce Posted June 12, 2001 Author Share Posted June 12, 2001 Coincidentally, I know someone who layers a Korg MS10 with an MS20. dB ==> David Bryce Music • Funky Young Monks <== Professional Affiliations: Royer Labs • Music Player Network Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
synthetic Posted June 12, 2001 Share Posted June 12, 2001 I try not to layer at all. If I want to double a pad, for example, I'll play the part twice, maybe even change the voicings slightly between the two takes. This works great when I play a part using my Roland sampler for strings then double it with a Wavestation pad, for example. The timing inaccuracies and voicing "mistakes" (I might add a 9th, etc.) make the double sound HUGE. I prefer simple tones for leads, so I've never doubled one of these, but I'll bet I would play it twice like it was a guitar or vocal lead. I may have, at one time or another, layered a piano with a DX electric piano or string pad. I apologize to the synth community at large. ("Burn him!") Just my 2 pesos, -jl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gregg Seibert Posted June 12, 2001 Share Posted June 12, 2001 I always put the layers on separate tracks in DP, because the darn producer almost aways thinks the keys "are taking up too much space in the mix" and thins things out. At least this way I can turn the layers on and off easily, and the producer won't reach for the EQ knob. We create these wonderful huge sounds and then have to stay out of the way of the darn Les Pauls!!! Gregg Without music, life would be a mistake - Nietzche QSC K10, Kurz PC3, K2500x, K2000R, Korg Z1, Roland A80, Roland S-750, 1970 MiniMoog, Synthi AKS, bunch of old rack modules. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
analogman1 Posted June 14, 2001 Share Posted June 14, 2001 At the risk of being risque... I think that *I* "layer" the best...that's why she comes back for more!!! TB Tom Nord Electro 5D, Modal Cobalt 8, Yamaha upright piano, numerous plug-ins... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keys4hire Posted June 14, 2001 Share Posted June 14, 2001 I tend to layer by manufacturers since each manufacturer and sythesis engine has it's own particular character. For example I utilize my kurzweil's for the crispness of their sound and warm it up with the trinity or jd990. Or for a more "occurs in nature" format I tend to utilize multiple samples of the same types of instruments layered together. As in a string section, I use my E-4xt's with different forms of bow attack and different section sizes and utilize velocity and pressure to slide in or out of the different layers of samples. I will also warm them up a little by using a Korg O1w and Wavestation but these I perform on a different track so I can have complete control in the mix. i guess that's a layer of a different kind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gulliver Posted July 6, 2004 Share Posted July 6, 2004 My workhorse TS-10 layers with all the other synths I own (not much: SD-1, MR-Rack, FS1R, XV-5050, Micro Q) just beautifully. Though all depends on patches of course... I am back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vortex Posted July 7, 2004 Share Posted July 7, 2004 I have two hardware synths at the moment, a Yamaha FS1R and a Studio Electronics SE-1. I have had nice results combining these with softsynths. These hardware synths add a convincing quality to the high and low frequencies of the softsynths. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stephen Fortner Posted July 7, 2004 Share Posted July 7, 2004 I did what Nordlander did in the 80's: layered a DX7 and Oberheim OB8. Had a lot of people checking out my sounds back then... it'd get these cool sounds where a bell-like tone or other percussive FM attack gives way to a swelling analog pad off the Oberheim. I layered the DX with my old Poly 800, too, before I got the OB. More recently, a K2000 and Roland JD800 together got some interesting stuff. I don't remember the JD patch name (don't have the thing here right now) but it was this killer YYZ-like reverse sweep, which I layered with "Ethereal Echoes" on the Kurz. Truth is, I spend so much time gigging live that I'm always thinking in terms of polytimbral setups where different synths are for different musical parts, as opposed to more fun "stacked" sounds. Stephen Fortner Principal, Fortner Media Former Editor in Chief, Keyboard Magazine Digital Piano Consultant, Piano Buyer Magazine Industry affiliations: Antares, Arturia, Giles Communications, MS Media, Polyverse Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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