frozen_dup1 Posted August 15, 2001 Share Posted August 15, 2001 When I'm practicing rudiments / stick control should I be playing evenly or with accents. If with accents, where should I be inserting the accent. I'm using the George Stone's Stick Control book as recommended by you guys. Thanks Brad Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrummerCafe Posted August 15, 2001 Share Posted August 15, 2001 Play the exercises with NO accents at first ... like monotone speech. I tell all my students that the goal is for me to be able to close my eyes and not be able to audibly tell which exercise they are playing. Once you've mastered the sticking, start using accents. There are many ways to go about this; I'll share a few of my ways then someone else can share theirs. I play all the exercises with accents on beat one, then beat two, then beat three, then beat four. Then I go back and play accents on all the down beats (1,2,3 and 4) ... then all the upbeats (all the "ands"). After this I play all the Right Hand strokes accented, then go back and play all the Left Hand strokes accented. Now go back and mix it up. Find different combinations of all the variations you've learned and put them together. You can take all of this and apply it to the drum kit. Instead of "accenting" ... play the stroke on a different drum or cymbal. Do this again but this time substitute your right foot or left foot (kick drum or hihat). The list goes on and on. I've got a hand out that I give to my students for use with Stick Control. I'll see if I can make that available to everyone here on the forum. Be creative and come up with your own ideas! ------------------ Bart Elliott http://bartelliott.com Drummer Cafe - community drum & percussion forum Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LethalDose Posted August 15, 2001 Share Posted August 15, 2001 Didn't Stone do an "Accents and Rebound" method book also? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrummerCafe Posted August 15, 2001 Share Posted August 15, 2001 Yes he did. Drummer Cafe - community drum & percussion forum Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 15, 2001 Share Posted August 15, 2001 What Bartman said is correct and I'll add a few more things to it. Again, follow the Stone book exercise by exercise. It's an old book but it's still the gospel for many percussionist. The main point I wanted to add to advice above is to always play with a relaxed natural grip and stroke. I know this might sound like obvious advice but I see a lot of beginers (and pros) that play to tight. This was brought on in the 80's by drum corps but shouldn't be tought. As a matter of fact most good corps lines teach only relaxed "off the head" type of stroke. Check out Cavies for this! http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/smile.gif This will translate into good technique on any percussion instrument whether it be snare drum, timpani, marimba, or drum set. Just my 1 1/2 cents. Donnie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
felix stein Posted August 15, 2001 Share Posted August 15, 2001 Free lessons, I LOVE IT! felix's band Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rlhubley Posted August 15, 2001 Share Posted August 15, 2001 There was a great 2 or 3 part lesson in ModernDrummer about a year and a half(maybe longer) ago. It was on paradiddles. It covered starting the paradiddle in different spots as well as many different accent patterns. I'll list a couple here(capitol letter=accent, lowercase=no accent), but will try to find the article tonight. I've been wanting it anyway. Here are a couple though 1. Rlrr Lrll 2. Lrrl Rllr 3. Rrlr Llrl 4. Rlrl Lrlr 5. RLrr LRll 6. rLRr lRLl 7. rlRR lrLL 8. RlrL LrlR This is only the tip of the iceberg! But is a great exercise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frozen_dup1 Posted August 16, 2001 Author Share Posted August 16, 2001 Thanks again for the help. I looked on the back cover and found the Rebound and Accent book by Stone. I will get through Stick control first. I'm still on the first page. When I finish the first page do I continue on to page two and leave page one; or do I continue using page one while I'm learning page two etc.? I actually watched the DCI on PBS. I thought a drum corp just walked down the street in a parade and I was going to be bored watching it. That was amazing, I couldn't believe they could run and drum at the same time and form all those shapes. Brad Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djarrett Posted August 16, 2001 Share Posted August 16, 2001 Hey, Frozen: Along with what Bart said ... I'll add this: One of the greatest teachers I ever studied with was Jim Hall at the University of South Carolina ... sadly he retired this year. Jim taught the likes of Gregg Bissonette, Rick Lathum, and Ed Soph while Jim taught at North Texas. Jim used to make a copies of the page we were studying in Stick Control each week. As like Bart, he would do the accent on beat one (first time through), then two, then three, then four. After the individual accents, he would come back and add two accents ... one on beat one and two for each measure. Then move the two accents over one beat each subsequent time through. Then add three accents ... one on beat one, two and three. Move that sequence of accents over one beat each subsequent time through ... and so on and so on! You can get up to as many accents spilling from measure to measure as you can tolerate. The combination is endless. Important note: Start at a reasonable tempo and with the previously mentioned relaxed strokes, do implement some control. Practice these in front of a mirror. You may be surprised at how uneven your accents are from hand to hand. Frozen ... do yourself a favor ... go see Drum Corps live next season!!! You may want to carry a change of underware!! DJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frozen_dup1 Posted August 17, 2001 Author Share Posted August 17, 2001 DJ, I understand the underwear statement http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/smile.gif. I'm spending over an hour completing page 1, at tempos from 120 to 168. Some of those I have to go to the slower tempo, but I'm repeating each one 20 times like it says. When I do those accents like you suggest it seems like I will be there for a day at a time practicing page 1. Do you do accents on beat 1, one day and on beat 2, the next and so on? I'm sorry for all the questions on rudiments. I would love to get a teacher but I own my own business and never have a normal arrival time at home for dinner, never mind drum lessons. Brad Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrummerCafe Posted August 17, 2001 Share Posted August 17, 2001 I'm not DJ, but I'll give you my two cents. This is a LIFE long endeavor ... you will never, ever play everything that can be done with Stick Control. Even if you do finish the book with all the suggestions you've heard, chances are you didn't play each one perfectly. What I'm trying to say here is that you just need to set some goals and work towards them. It's okay to move around from page to page; you don't have to start at the beginning and play each page in order. Pick some exercises off one page and some off another. Log it all in a journal or something to keep track of where you are at. Perhaps notate your top tempos with each exercise. It's like the Bible in that every time you read it you get something new out of it. Every day is a new revelation or enlightment; enjoy it and keeping pushing forward. Sounds like you are doing a great job with all of this. I'm only saying what I'm saying because I don't want you to get bummed out, burned out or frustrated. Set a goal, meet that goal, step back and feel good about your accomplishment ... then start the process all over again. Be encouraged! ------------------ Bart Elliott http://bartelliott.com Drummer Cafe - community drum & percussion forum Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rlhubley Posted August 17, 2001 Share Posted August 17, 2001 i totaly agree with Bart on this one. goals=progress I also want to mention 2 more of what i definitely consider to be drummer's "bibles" 1. Syncopation, by Ted Reed. This book is like stick control in that it can be interpreted in infinite ways, but it concentrates more on rythym. 2. The New Breed, by Gary Chester. Gary is an old school studio drummer who has passed away. He was on numerous albums. This book is incredibly difficult. It has a very systematic way to approach coordination. I HIGHLY reccomend buying this book. If you do, read all of the instructions and information before starting the exercises. BTW, do NOT try to jump into the back or even middle of the book first, and also do NOT try to start off with the New Breed 2! Both of these books are exceptional, buy them both! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrummerCafe Posted August 17, 2001 Share Posted August 17, 2001 I agree with Robert about Syncopation and New Breed; both are Bibles for drummers. Typically there is only ONE Bible ... but for us drummers, there are definitely several! ;-) I also agree about the New Breed book in that you want to play it from the beginning and work your way through. It is set-up to be a progressive book and is laid out accordingly. With Stick Control and Syncopation you could move around, not necessarily working from start to finish ... although it wouldn't be a bad idea to do so. I've stated this in an older thread, but I'll state it again. With the New Breed book, I work one system at a time until I can play it perfectly (with a metronome and counting out loud) over all the melody pages. Then I check that system off and move on to the next one. I don't work out of the book that much because of time constraints ... but I'm presently on System 15. I have worked some of the Advanced Systems however, just for fun. So, the entire New Breed book is one of my goals. Think how good it will feel to be able to hold the book up and say "I can play this entire book, just as the author intended." Then there's the case of tempos! The next challenge would be to play through at a faster tempo than before. I've also enjoyed making up my own systems ... and applying them to the drumkit as well as my percussion set-ups. ------------------ Bart Elliott http://bartelliott.com Drummer Cafe - community drum & percussion forum Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frozen_dup1 Posted August 18, 2001 Author Share Posted August 18, 2001 Bart; I have been doing this stick control for a short while. Already I have moved my tempo from low 60's to mid 150's-180 for most exercises. I know speed doesn't mean much against control. But, for me it has increased my control and speed a lot faster than I thought. I don't mind doing the lessons either. I still have not had much time to work on the kick with these patterns. But, I'm anxious to continue working on that as well, considering that's what I really bought the book for. Rlhubley thanks for the recommendation on more books and Bart; Thanks as usual Frozen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaddabout Posted August 18, 2001 Share Posted August 18, 2001 Originally posted by rlhubley: I also want to mention 2 more of what i definitely consider to be drummer's "bibles" 1. Syncopation, by Ted Reed. 2. The New Breed, by Gary Chester. Toss in Anthony J. Cirrone's Portraits in Rhythm, and we're one book short of the drummer's Pentatauch. Maybe Jim Chapin's Advanced Technique's for the Modern Drummer? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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