Ross Brown Posted September 7, 2006 Share Posted September 7, 2006 Last night I went from being excited about heading to the studio to make a demo (see other thread) to gut wrenching, diarrhea creating nervousness because we have three outdoor gigs lined up (as of yesterday). The first being this Saturday! I was expecting that our first gigs would be bar gigs (and not until Oct 6th). I am the king of triple backup but wont have that luxury. Currently we dont have the sound system to handle the outdoor gig. One of my bandmates is working on renting equipment, etc. Makes me crazy to think of showing up and using sound equipment that we have never played with before at a very public gig. That is a topic of another thread I suppose. I would normally not do this to myself but I do realize that I am more compulsive than most so I will try to just go with it. The rest of the band wants to do it. My plan is to use the amp that I have for the bass. I have a Peavey 115 combo and an Ampeg B2-RE 450W head. I plan to use the 115 combo and plug in the cabinet from my Ampeg set up. That way I have two speaker cabinets and hopefully am pushing enough air. I will take the Ampeg B2-RE head along as back up. My understanding is that I can do this based on the info listed below. Peavey Combo 115 300 watts On the back it says External Speakers Minimum 4 ohms, Jack paralleled with 4 ohm internal speaker Minimum amplifier load 2 ohms 200W RMS 4 ohms 300W RMS 2 ohms 28V RMS Cabinet is an Ampeg SVT-410HLF 500W RMS/1000W Program Impedance 4 ohms Ampeg B2-RE head 450W @ 4 ohms 250W @ 8 ohms 4 ohms minimum Can someone please check my thinking? Better ideas are welcome. I prefer not to go through a sound system I have never seen or understand (control freak issue). This is not the part of performing that I have mastered yet. I am still working on just playing. The venue is a mini Ampitheater type set up in a downtown area. We will have our backs to water (harbor). I am comfortable with the music and our ability to play. I am not comfortable with our plans for the sound and set up etc. Should I just run?? "When I take a stroll down Jackass Lane it is usually to see someone that is already there" Mrs. Brown Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
josh a Posted September 7, 2006 Share Posted September 7, 2006 I think the Ampeg head and Ampeg cab would be louder/more headroom, and the combo as a backup/2nd option. And don't worry about the sound. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MvW Posted September 7, 2006 Share Posted September 7, 2006 I agree with josh above - use the Ampeg head and cab and just have the combo as a backup (have extra cables, powerstrips/ext. cords, fuses, etc for EVERYTHING, not just your equipment). Actually, if once you're set up and the drummer is having trouble hearing you, you can use the combo to point in his direction, running an out off the head. Don't worry about the overall sound, especially in ampitheater - there are far too many variables to worry yourself about. Play a tight set and people will take notice! And have fun! Report back when you can... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeremy c Posted September 7, 2006 Share Posted September 7, 2006 You're stressing too much. You can't control every variable. Every location you play will have different sound issues. Try not to beat yourself up too much. Just set up with the amp and speakers you have. You will be heard. The PA will help the band, whatever kind it is. Just have fun! Free download of my cd!. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ross Brown Posted September 7, 2006 Author Share Posted September 7, 2006 Originally posted by empiremark: I agree with josh above - use the Ampeg head and cab and just have the combo as a backup (have extra cables, powerstrips/ext. cords, fuses, etc for EVERYTHING, not just your equipment). Actually, if once you're set up and the drummer is having trouble hearing you, you can use the combo to point in his direction, running an out off the head. Don't worry about the overall sound, especially in ampitheater - there are far too many variables to worry yourself about. Play a tight set and people will take notice! And have fun! Report back when you can... I'll have to take a look to see about running the Ampeg head into the Combo as a monitor for the drummer. I wasn't sure if that was something that can be done. Thanks. "When I take a stroll down Jackass Lane it is usually to see someone that is already there" Mrs. Brown Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ross Brown Posted September 7, 2006 Author Share Posted September 7, 2006 Originally posted by jeremy c: You're stressing too much. You can't control every variable. Every location you play will have different sound issues. Try not to beat yourself up too much. Just set up with the amp and speakers you have. You will be heard. The PA will help the band, whatever kind it is. Just have fun! Thanks Jeremy. I guess it is just nerves. I tend to overthink things. The more I think about it the more I am glad we are doing it. If nothing else it will be a great expereince and look good on our band's "resume". "When I take a stroll down Jackass Lane it is usually to see someone that is already there" Mrs. Brown Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ross Brown Posted September 8, 2006 Author Share Posted September 8, 2006 Got a call from guitar player late last night. He was able to find an rent a PA system that he has used many times before. I feel better. I also may run my Ampeg B2-RE head into the system so they can hear me throught the monitors. We'll see. I am lightening up at little. We have good song sets and a rehearsal tonite. Thanks again. I'll be alright. "When I take a stroll down Jackass Lane it is usually to see someone that is already there" Mrs. Brown Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moot Posted September 8, 2006 Share Posted September 8, 2006 Yes, by all means relax! Nerves are a matter of attitude and if you go in knowing you own your instrument and the set you will prevail. One thing you may consider is staying out of the monitors altogether. Chances are (if there is no seperate monitor mix) by the time you are loud enough for the drummer to hear you in his monitor you will be blaring out of the others. A cab on the other side of the stage next to the drummer is a much better solution. If he is between your cabs I guarentee he will hear you. "He is to music what Stevie Wonder is to photography." getz76 I have nothing nice to say so . . . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ross Brown Posted September 8, 2006 Author Share Posted September 8, 2006 Originally posted by empiremark: Actually, if once you're set up and the drummer is having trouble hearing you, you can use the combo to point in his direction, running an out off the head. Any idea how to do this? I never really expected to use the two systems together (in this configuration) so I have not spent much time fooling with it. I prefer not to blow it up the night before a gig. "When I take a stroll down Jackass Lane it is usually to see someone that is already there" Mrs. Brown Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moot Posted September 8, 2006 Share Posted September 8, 2006 I am not familiar with Ampeg heads but if you use a line/preamp out to the combo it will just be a powered monitor. "He is to music what Stevie Wonder is to photography." getz76 I have nothing nice to say so . . . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seamy ALB Posted September 8, 2006 Share Posted September 8, 2006 Position all your bacline amps in a curve position behind your drummer. That way he should hear all you guys no problem. Have a good one and remember keep smiling!! http://www.facebook.com/pages/A-Little-Bitter/185235472447 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ross Brown Posted September 8, 2006 Author Share Posted September 8, 2006 Originally posted by mattulator: I am not familiar with Ampeg heads but if you use a line/preamp out to the combo it will just be a powered monitor. There is a Pre AMP OUT on the Ampeg head. I will send from that jack to the Power AMP In jack on the Combo. No smoke, Right?? "When I take a stroll down Jackass Lane it is usually to see someone that is already there" Mrs. Brown Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wade_g Posted September 8, 2006 Share Posted September 8, 2006 No smoke is correct. Though definitely bring it up slowly. There is a difference between Belief and Truth. Constantly searching for Truth makes your Beliefs seem believable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ross Brown Posted September 8, 2006 Author Share Posted September 8, 2006 I may try it at lunchtime or after work, before rehearsal. Thanks. "When I take a stroll down Jackass Lane it is usually to see someone that is already there" Mrs. Brown Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhilMan99 Posted September 8, 2006 Share Posted September 8, 2006 Pretend you're a lead-vocalist, show-up drunk and 15 minutes late? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ross Brown Posted September 8, 2006 Author Share Posted September 8, 2006 Originally posted by PhilMan99: Pretend you're a lead-vocalist, show-up drunk and 15 minutes late? It would kill me. Funny though... "When I take a stroll down Jackass Lane it is usually to see someone that is already there" Mrs. Brown Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
picker Posted September 8, 2006 Share Posted September 8, 2006 If you're gonna feed the Power Amp In on the Peavey with the preammp out of the Ampeg, start out with both amps down as far as they will go. A lot of the time, the Power Amp In bypasses the the volume control, so the Peavey may be at full volume with no way to to turn it down. After you plug in and turn the amps on, turn the master volume on the Ampeg up to a reasonable level, and bring up preamp gain up slowly. You might not be able to balance the level of the two amps very well because of not having a volume control on the Peavey. Actually, you'd be a lot better off putting the Ampeg through the PA, and putting him in the monitors. It's easier to control. Always remember that you are unique. Just like everyone else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ross Brown Posted September 9, 2006 Author Share Posted September 9, 2006 Originally posted by Picker: If you're gonna feed the Power Amp In on the Peavey with the preammp out of the Ampeg, start out with both amps down as far as they will go. A lot of the time, the Power Amp In bypasses the the volume control, so the Peavey may be at full volume with no way to to turn it down. After you plug in and turn the amps on, turn the master volume on the Ampeg up to a reasonable level, and bring up preamp gain up slowly. You might not be able to balance the level of the two amps very well because of not having a volume control on the Peavey. Actually, you'd be a lot better off putting the Ampeg through the PA, and putting him in the monitors. It's easier to control. Thanks. I tried it. I could control the Peavey but it wasn't great. I think we may run the ampeg head through the PA. If that doesn't work I will have the Peavey there and just do it that way. Based on what I know so far and last nights rehearsal, I may have an interesting story to tell tommorrow or Monday. Look for the thread "Drummers should not be allowed to talk or decide anything". Just kidding, but... "When I take a stroll down Jackass Lane it is usually to see someone that is already there" Mrs. Brown Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seamy ALB Posted September 10, 2006 Share Posted September 10, 2006 How did the gig go?? http://www.facebook.com/pages/A-Little-Bitter/185235472447 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gruuve Posted September 10, 2006 Share Posted September 10, 2006 Ross, don't sweat it dude...I'd agree with most, use the Ampeg head and cab, and run a line out from it's preamp out/effects send/whatever into the effects return or other power amp input on the Peavey combo...that way you can utilize the amplifier power of both units....assuming you actually need to be that loud. I gather you've already had this gig? Hope it went well... Dave Old bass players never die, they just buy lighter rigs. - Tom Capasso, 11/9/2006 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ross Brown Posted September 11, 2006 Author Share Posted September 11, 2006 Summary of gig: Background: Drummer had another singer (a buddy) show up at our rehearsal Friday night to help out with a couple of the songs. On Saturday (day of show) there is a guy that we never met (or heard of) waiting with the drummer. He was introduced as a buddy of mine that is going to do the sound. Our singer is also our sound guy and also the guy who leased the PA and equipment for this gig. What Happened: Gig was at Inner Harbor Ampitheater in Baltimore. Supposed to start at 8pm Drummer (gig organizer) didnt know how to get there and got lost. He had told all of us (3 other vehicles) to follow him so he could show us were to unload and then where to park. He pulled away from us as we entered the city. We found it on our own. Talked to the police and other performers. We waited for him at the unloading spot for the Ampitheater and told him how to find us (cell phone) He didnt show until 8pm. He still hadnt signed us in or obtained a key/connection to the electric power at the Ampitheater. That office was 2 blocks away but he didnt know where it was. (yet he had played there before??). Guitarist with PA equipment blew a fuse and said. it takes me 1 hour and 15 minutes to set up once we are unloaded. I signed for $10,000 worth of equipment and I am not setting it up in a hurry, in a crowd, with the drummers buddy. I am outta here. He left. Not all that cool, but I have to agree with him. (Also consider the buddy singer and sound guy crap). Oh yea, and the Buddy singer on Friday night was dispensing his prescription medicine to the drummer. Pain relievers, muscles relaxers, etc. Blew me away. This was new information to all of us. The good news is that I figured out how to work my amps better and run them through the PA or through my combo! And to think I thought that would be the problem. Thanks everyone for the advice. "When I take a stroll down Jackass Lane it is usually to see someone that is already there" Mrs. Brown Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric VB Posted September 11, 2006 Share Posted September 11, 2006 Wow! What a story, Ross! It reminds me of a gig I was supposed to do years back, but only in the "we didn't end up playing" aspect. Out on a farm in the middle of no where, a bunch of bands were going to put on a show and camp out in tents all weekend. The local police -- all two of them -- were freaked out that it was going to be another Woodstock. We were going to be the first band to go on. Well, there's like 5 people there when the guitarist and I show up. This was in the days prior to cell phones, so we had no idea where our drummer was. (Turns out he blew up his engine on the drive up and got a tow and ride home instead of trying to make the gig.) We get introduced to another drummer who is there but isn't playing that weekend. He's willing to give it a go. Finally we give up waiting for our drummer and the guitarist decides to cancel. Turned out to be a good thing, too, because it was a very rainy weekend. I was really bummed out that we didn't play. I was used to playing in the school band, and we didn't cancel shows. (One time we performed our halftime show just standing in formation on the field because it was too wet and muddy to march, but we still played!) I even seem to remember marching in the rain with a big brass lightning rod, er, sousaphone wrapped around me. We practiced hard, we were ready to play, we drove for hours to get there, and there were only 5 people there. So what if we crashed and burned with a drummer we'd never practiced with? Who was going to notice, the cows? I'd already sat in with other groups where I'd never even heard the songs they were playing, so I wasn't too worried. Well, it still turned out to be a good decision in the long run. It would have sucked to be on an uncovered stage outdoors playing in a rain storm. Something tells me, Ross, you're going to have an interesting band meeting sometime soon. I can look past your drummer not knowing where the office is -- even though he played there before -- because it's possible someone else always took care of that instead of him. The rest of his behavior and actions were very unprofessional, IMO. Even if he had shown up in time to set up, you guys may have been in for a bumpy ride. So chalk one up to experience. Hope your next gig goes more smoothly! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Force Posted September 11, 2006 Share Posted September 11, 2006 Ross! Brother! Man, I didn't know whether to laugh or cry after reading your post. (actually, I laughed--not at you, but at the absurdity of the whole situation! ) Hang in there, bro.. Steve Force, Durham, North Carolina -------- My Professional Websites Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ross Brown Posted September 11, 2006 Author Share Posted September 11, 2006 quote:Originally posted by forceman: Ross! Brother! Man, I didn't know whether to laugh or cry after reading your post. (actually, I laughed--not at you, but at the absurdity of the whole situation! ) Hang in there, bro.. "When I take a stroll down Jackass Lane it is usually to see someone that is already there" Mrs. Brown Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhilMan99 Posted September 11, 2006 Share Posted September 11, 2006 "The show must go on..." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil W Posted September 11, 2006 Share Posted September 11, 2006 Hey, at least it's a good story! hang in there, mate! http://philwbass.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ross Brown Posted September 11, 2006 Author Share Posted September 11, 2006 We fired the drummer tonite. Bad, bad chemistry. We just need to find the right one. "When I take a stroll down Jackass Lane it is usually to see someone that is already there" Mrs. Brown Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Force Posted September 11, 2006 Share Posted September 11, 2006 Originally posted by Ross Brown: We fired the drummer tonite. Bad, bad chemistry. We just need to find the right one. Good for you. Steve Force, Durham, North Carolina -------- My Professional Websites Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luke73 Posted September 12, 2006 Share Posted September 12, 2006 Good move...the drummer sounds like a real flake! Sorry to read the sad story, but good luck and move on! http://www.myspace.com/twoshortrocks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ross Brown Posted September 12, 2006 Author Share Posted September 12, 2006 Incredible flake. I wouldn't have believed it unless I saw it with my own eyes. "When I take a stroll down Jackass Lane it is usually to see someone that is already there" Mrs. Brown Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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