owens hound Posted January 31, 2006 Share Posted January 31, 2006 Hello fellow LDL's, Your input will be greatly appreciated. One of my guitar students was told by his music teacher at school that he has real potential and a great chance at a future in music. He is 15 and of course his ego is soaring and he has his head in the clouds. His mother and I discussed this and she is concerned that he will drop everything else and concentrate on music and if this does not work out for him, he will have nothing to fall back on. Do any of you have any tips, real world stories, reality checks and suggestions for me to pass along to him. I don't want to be a real downer to him as he has come along way in a relatively short time(he's been playing for just over 1 year) but I want to be realistic and offer him sound advise. He and his band have played one small gig and he says that they have written 30 plus songs. They are working on a demo and hope to be able to do something with it in the future. Are there things that he should know for sure, things to be able to do, things to know how to play, theory etc? Thanks in advance, Jason www.myspace.com/nobandatpresent Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edendude Posted January 31, 2006 Share Posted January 31, 2006 I would tell him that a university or college campus is one of the best places to be, to meet other musicians, and to form a following for any band. He can have his cake and eat it too. Have him ponder the idea of a music degree program. This way he'll be insuring he has something to fall back on, while at the same time improving his chops and broadening his musical knowledge. My Last Band Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhilMan99 Posted January 31, 2006 Share Posted January 31, 2006 One aspect would be funds for school. On the one hand, college seems to be a requirement for flippin' burgers. On the other hand, with the way the global economy is going (with the "west" arguably being dragged-down to 3rd-world status), starting life $100K in debt is not so good either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric VB Posted January 31, 2006 Share Posted January 31, 2006 Examples of child prodigies in other fields should work, too. "Arnold" from "Different Strokes" comes to mind, but a 15yo probably wouldn't get that reference. When I was 11 I played in a school band with a guitar player who was also 11, and he played in a wedding band. It was like he had made the "big time". (He was good, but there was also the "wow factor" of "he's only 11?!" going for him.) I saw him again when he was 18, I think, and he was still playing out but he wasn't a superstar like EVH. I should try to track him down and see what he's doing today. I think it's safe to say he didn't build a fortune playing guitar and that he probably does something else to pay the bills. Music as a career is just as much about business as it is about musical talent. Make sure he knows that. Also, just like athletes, musicians would be foolish to bank everything on their physical talents. It takes just a moment for a rare disease to appear or an accident to happen and suddenly your career is over. A 15yo probably won't get this, but it's worth sharing. "American Idol", for better or worse, can show how cold the industry can be. Simon gets a lot of flack for being heartless, but his business sense is sound, IMO. It can also give you a sense of how much the odds are stacked against you. How many apply? Only one wins. The success rate for writing a hit song is pretty dismal, too. Thirty songs is 3 CDs and 3 full sets, but how many would get picked up by the recording industry? I'd also worry that the current fad in music puts singers on such a high shelf and treats instrumentalists as a dime a dozen. It rubs me the wrong way that some artists don't use a touring band anymore, but just pick up whatever musicians are available in each city of the tour. Making a living as a musician isn't impossible, and it's not all bad. I'll let someone else fill in the pros. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edendude Posted January 31, 2006 Share Posted January 31, 2006 One aspect would be funds for school.Access to educational funding in Canada is pretty good. And he could help with the funding situation by playing gigs, instead of flippin' burgers, while he attends. The drummer and the guitarist in my band, both have university music degrees. I wish I had taken that route. When they are not gigging, one runs a very successful music school, which he and his wife own, the other own's and runs a non-profit organization called The Atlantic Jazz Initiative, which secures funding for year round jazz artist performances and tours, and produces shows. My Last Band Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeremy c Posted January 31, 2006 Share Posted January 31, 2006 Having a band with 30 songs is not really a big deal. There are millions of bands. The odds of having a successful band are very low. If the kid is good, someone will hire him for actual paying gigs. If this happens and he is actually out there earning money at the age of 15 and getting a reputation as one of the best guitar players in town, maybe he could blow off high school. Brian Bromberg dropped out of high school with his parents' blessings. Of course he was hired to play with Stan Getz. And later he finished high school with a program of self study. Al DiMeola dropped out of college...he called his parents to say that he was quitting college to go on the road with a band. Of course they groaned. Then he said he would get them tickets for the first show....Carnegie Hall with Chick Corea. This is the level of talent at which I would tell someone that it is ok to blow off high school for guitar. Having a band with some original songs doesn't qualify....unless the band is the most popular band in the state. I was gigging at age 15. But I also graduated near the top of my class in high school and went off to college. It turned out that I was missing music too much in college and I dropped out and just gigged for a while. Then I went back and finished college as a music major (while gigging every night). The music major classes really, really helped advance my musical skills and I met many people with whom I still play music. I also was able to get a teaching position at a music school because I had a degree in music. But I am not a believer in "having something to fall back on." I believe that someone with talent and interest should put everything they can into their music. Free download of my cd!. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
owens hound Posted January 31, 2006 Author Share Posted January 31, 2006 Thanks for all of the suggestions. I think that getting a degree in music is a great idea. I'll suggest that to him for sure. The more exposure he can have to other musicians would be great for him. I want to be realistic with him and let him know that just because his music teacher thinks that he has a future, doesn't mean that he will be able to be a professional musician. I'm hoping that he won't want to quit school at this point with the pipedream of making it big one day. I also want to add that I don't think that he is a prodigy. He has come along way in just over a year, but still has a long way to go, in my opinion. I haven't heard all of his 30 songs, he has played my parts of songs that had some good musical ideas but there is for sure room for improvement and musical growth. His mother is concerned that he will drop everything to play full time. I'll also pass along your suggestions to her regarding post secondary school. I think that he is expected to go to University when he is done high school and he may do well working towards a music degree. www.myspace.com/nobandatpresent Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gruuve Posted January 31, 2006 Share Posted January 31, 2006 I agree with a lot of what has been said. Send him to college for a music degree and tell him to double-major in business as well. If you're going to make a living at music, it's as much a business as anything else...migth as well be professionally prepared for the business end of it as well as the talent end of it. I'd also say you should have a serious talk with him about the odds of "making it big" as well. Make sure he understands that it requires a tremendous amount of sacrifice and even then, you still might not "make it big". I have an engineering degree rather than a music degree. However, toward the end of college, I seriously considered doing music for a living. I carefully considered the possible outcomes, and decided to take the "safe" route of working in the technology field. (At the same time, I played with a band who had the best intentions for actually going somewhere, but that never happened.) I thought that a career in technology would be a stable and predictable path. Considering all the chaos I've seen in my career from failed startups, clueless small companies, and head-up-their-butt large companies, I now occasionally wonder if I actually make the right choice. At this point, I certainly can't say it was a more conservative choice. All that said, I'm surprised there isn't an American Idol type of show for instrumentalists or full bands...we've got every other kind of reality show conceivable... My inflation-adjust $0.02, Dave Old bass players never die, they just buy lighter rigs. - Tom Capasso, 11/9/2006 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ClarkW Posted January 31, 2006 Share Posted January 31, 2006 It's fine for him to dream of landing a record contract, having an album chart in the top 10, and spending the next 25 years under contract and doing 300 shows every other year... But the reality is just what many others have said here. If you want to make music a career, plan for a university degree and a wide variety of options to pay the bills. Teaching (institution or private), regular paying gigs (weddings, casuals, sideman for large acts), writing for magazines or publishers, etc. Many are not nearly as glamorous as being the tatooed and pierced up funky dude playing on SNL this weekend and the Tonight Show next week and co-hosting TRL the following day...but that's a tough life to live. Finish high school, no doubt about that. Go to college. Get the degree. Find a job just like everyone else who gets a degree in marketing or computer science or English... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillWelcome Home Studios Posted January 31, 2006 Share Posted January 31, 2006 "A future in music"? suggest that this requires studying music, reading music, being able to sight-read and play anything. If he can do that, he could have a career in music. "Something to fall back on"??? What other disciple is practiced in which it is suggested that you find something else to fall back on? Two sides of the same coin... if you are really serious about a career in music, study music. Go to Berklee or Duquesne, and be real about it. If the idea is to fart around in basement bands for 30 years, that does not make a career. So he'd better find something else that he likes to do. Bill "I believe that entertainment can aspire to be art, and can become art, but if you set out to make art you're an idiot." Steve Martin Show business: we're all here because we're not all there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric VB Posted February 1, 2006 Share Posted February 1, 2006 Originally posted by Bill@Welcome Home Studios: What other disciple is practiced in which it is suggested that you find something else to fall back on? OT: Well, nowadays, I'd say no field is safe, and everybody should have a backup plan. I hope all those former Ford Motor Co. employees had a backup plan. This ain't your father's employment outlook, neither in finding decent work nor finding decent pay! Yes, I have a backup plan of my own, and I'm paranoid to be working on a third! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric VB Posted February 1, 2006 Share Posted February 1, 2006 Originally posted by Dave Sisk: All that said, I'm surprised there isn't an American Idol type of show for instrumentalists or full bands...we've got every other kind of reality show conceivable... Well, Dave, there's a banner ad that runs here for American Idol Underground . That may not be a bad idea; have the student enter his band and see how well they fare. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
owens hound Posted February 1, 2006 Author Share Posted February 1, 2006 Thanks again for all of the responses. I'll pass these along to my student and his mother. Very much appreciated. Jason www.myspace.com/nobandatpresent Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LLroomtempJ Posted February 1, 2006 Share Posted February 1, 2006 Originally posted by owen's hound: Thanks again for all of the responses. I'll pass these along to my student and his mother. Very much appreciated. Jason ANOTHER JASON!!!!!!!!! how did i miss this for a whole year? jason 2cor5:21 Soli Deo Gloria "it's the beauty of a community. it takes a village to raise a[n] [LLroomtempJ]." -robb My YouTube Channel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
owens hound Posted February 1, 2006 Author Share Posted February 1, 2006 Hey Jason, I thought "Jason's" were a dime a dozen. In highschool(1985-1989) there were at least 2 other Jasons in every class I was in. Maybe the name is not as popular as it was then. I also found math difficult to focus when they referred to 'adjacent' angles I thought they were talking about me! On another note, how are you liking your 7 string? I'd love to work up to being ableto play one. Do you play full chords as well on it? www.myspace.com/nobandatpresent Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LLroomtempJ Posted February 1, 2006 Share Posted February 1, 2006 Yes, Jason's are fairly common, but there aren't many on this forum. The 7 is great. There's actually a video of me playing it in my profile. I don't think that i did any chording for the whole show. When i chord, i tend to omit the 5 unless it's dominant...but i often include the seventh, the third and tensions. jason 2cor5:21 Soli Deo Gloria "it's the beauty of a community. it takes a village to raise a[n] [LLroomtempJ]." -robb My YouTube Channel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
owens hound Posted February 1, 2006 Author Share Posted February 1, 2006 I'll check out the video, how do you have it tuned? As I was a guitar player first, I really like the idea of playing chords and having the extended range of notes. Hopefully I'll get a 7 down the road. www.myspace.com/nobandatpresent Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
owens hound Posted February 1, 2006 Author Share Posted February 1, 2006 Hey Jason, I started watching your video on my computer at work, I'll watch the rest when i get home as I can't hear the bass as well at work, no sub. I liked what I heard so far. Very nice looking bass as well. www.myspace.com/nobandatpresent Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fred TBP Posted February 1, 2006 Share Posted February 1, 2006 Has he ever been away from home in a less than ideal setting? Has he ever spent the night in a hospital for an injury? Has he ever been arrested and spent a night in jail? Much as being onstage for that hour or two is glamorous and head-filling, the other 22-23 hours just suck. sleeping on buses or in cheezy motels at the wrong time of day, eating road food, not having enough personal time to get your head and health together, losing touch with family and friends, having to borrow money and wait for your pay to come while the bills and interest pile up, depending on people to set up stuff only to find out they screwed up and you have 5 minutes to fix it or you're screwed... I'm summarizing this but there are books on the topic. And I haven't addressed dangerous substances, sexually-transmittable diseases, unwanted pregnancies and lawsuits. If you're not the headliner and you don't have a possee to get you through the rough spots, you could wind up in a foreign prison without a passport (which happened to a friend of mine) or in a rest stop with a broke down car and barely enough money to get home to your parents (which happened to me at 19) or back where you started on skid row after being on top. (which happened to some other friends of mine) Life isn't like the movies or MTV (there's no nice way to put this) - it's much scarier than that and it can kill you if you don't have your head together. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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