Frustrated - my rig seems to lack volume

[SteveC]

Originally posted by Father Gino:

STOP STOP STOP STOP STOP STOP STOP STOP STOP

 

STOP IT!!!!!

 

Keep the #$%^& Avalon and buy a really nice folding hand truck.

 

Then play the rig you've got for at least two years and report back.

I may just do that!

[SteveC]

Originally posted by BenLoy:

Stop all this madness.

 

Plug the output of the SansAmp straight into the Avalon if you need grit. You'll get better gain structure that way. The SansAmp doesn't have enough output to plug straight into a power amp.

 

Use the Avalon straight into the power amp when you want a clean sound.

 

If you're concerned because the Avalon is too heavy then sell the Avalon and the QSC and buy a Walter Woods Hi-Power. It's the size of a cigar box and is loud as hell. Keep the SansAmp for some grit.

 

Spend more time practicing.

 

I love gear as much as the next guy but enough is enough. You have some good gear there. I can't imagine why you'd want to replace it unless it's too heavy.

And this as well.

[musicfiend]

Gas attack prevented?

[Mike Bear]

I have an older Peavy 115 combo. It cranks. It's actually very clean. More to the point tone wise. I use it for smaller gigs. The only problem is it doesn't have a horn.

 

I honestly believe everyone has their own version of rating amps. Even if there is supposed to be a rule of thumb. I mean 1,400 watt amps. If you turn it to 5 you'd blow most cabs. Yet we can most of the time, and do. Tube amps, 300w is lower wattage isn't as much power as sold state heads say at 800w. But hey, if it's louder, it's louder. Just like playing, gear is open to interpitation.

[moot]

Personally, I think the fact that you have kicked the wheel-and-deal-gear habit has effected your psyche. The GAS monkey is still on your back my friend. Appease the monkey.

[musicfiend]

I just had a thought, Isn't Anthony Jackson rumored to plug his fodera straight into a stweart power amp and then go into cabs some times......he doesn't even have a A preamp in his bass, why does it work for him?

[Fuego]

if the fodera is active, dosent already have a preamp?? so i guess thats y it works

[musicfiend]

Its not active, thats why I said there was no preamp involved. His bass just has one volume knob and one pickup.

[Big Daddy from Motown]

Musicfiend

"I just had a thought, Isn't Anthony Jackson rumored to plug his fodera straight into a stweart power amp and then go into cabs some times......he doesn't even have a A preamp in his bass, why does it work for him?"

 

It Doesn't, AJ definitely uses a pre amp outside of the bass.

 

 

Ben Loy answered this question superbly already. Read his post.

 

The power amp requires a certain level of voltage to develope it's full output power. Typically 1 volt rms. though sometimes more such as 1.5 vrms.

 

Ok the passive bass guitar is putting out something like 100 to 200 millvolts. That 100/1000 of a volt. Ok so we need to boost that signal around 10 times to drive the Qsc. Active may go way beyond this but only when in boost mode and than only at the frequencies boosted. Believe me MOST active basses will not output 1.5 volt RMS.

 

The pre amplifier is is another amplifier that has voltage gain. Boosting the guitar's level to that 1.5 VRMS .

 

You need the Avalon or another pre amp (cheaper and smaller) to get the full power out of the QSC power amp.

[rumpelstiltskin.]

Originally posted by coyote:

A SansAmp is not really designed to be a complete preamp.

this is the most correct answer thus far. well, except for maybe encouraging you to buy an EX-112.

 

actually, this is a fairly common complaint about the SABDDI, that it won't drive a QSC power amp fully. tech21nyc has actually addressed the issue with the newest generation of SABDDIs (and i'll bet behringer missed the boat on this one). they've included a switch on the side to boost its output up to line level.

 

for the older ones, tech21nyc will freely advise you how to modify the SABDDI to increase level permanently, in the same way the switch on the new ones works.

 

if you prefer to modify your amp, life effects pro audio offer a service to modify it. they also sell them pre-modified, for those who are considering buying new.

 

robb.

[SteveC]

I have that switch and it helps...not like the Avalon.

 

I put the Avalon and QSC back in the 4 space rack. It, of course, drives the amp fine and sounds...well you know...

 

I will stay with this unless Bob G. tells me an EA iAmp500 will do the same thing at 2 spaces and 13 pounds.

[rumpelstiltskin.]

i think you'd be happier with an eden than an iamp. i can't tell you how much happier i am with my warwick quadruplet modded for double output. i can actually get up to 590W out of my crest pro 7200 channel, instead of getting 300W. my HT-112 loves me for it, too.

 

robb.

[SteveC]

Isn't an iAMP a little more "flat" than an Eden? I thought Eden has a "color" of it's own?

[_Sweet Willie_]

I think the iAmp heads are more "flat" than Edens, but each has their own color or flava.

 

You should be all good w/ that Avalon and the QSC w/ the SABDDI as a method for adding a little grind.

 

Then again, the "tubesim" setting on the EBS MultiComp definitely adds some mad phatness to your tone -- but that's neither here nor there.

 

Peace.

--SW

[rumpelstiltskin.]

Originally posted by SteveC:

Isn't an iAMP a little more "flat" than an Eden? I thought Eden has a "color" of it's own?

yes, the eden does have a little more color, but most of what is attributed to the eden sound comes from their cabinets. trust me. i have played an eden through an HT-112. i have also played an iAMP. i found it to be very unenergetic.

 

i think you'll appreciate the incrementally more lively clean sound of the eden, but you'll want to keep the sansamp for the woolier tones. or, at least, that's how i'd do it if i were going down that road. i have considered going down that road, too. (well, with the eden, not the sansamp.)

 

robb.

[musicfiend]

At namm a couple of years ago i played a sadowsky j bass to mr sadowsky's booth. He had the bass running into an iamp set flat. For some reason the amp had an inhrent trebly quality to my ears, even though i messed with the onboard controls it was always there. Can't say it bothered me very much though...because i was playing a sadowsky

[SteveC]

So Eden seems to be the choice of the forum users.

[musicfiend]

I dont really like eden as much as some other amps, i love pretty much all of aguilars stuff. But if I did not have the money or the justification for their stuff, I'd probably for a swr wm combo or such.

[SteveC]

I've had SWR stuff before...Maybe an SM900?

[Mike Bear]

I played an SM900 for the first time in years not too long ago. I forgot how it sounded. It is a very versitile amp.

[_Sweet Willie_]

Steve,

 

We can toss around the names of various brands and models of amps for days. Stop for a second and really review the criteria that are important to you. Then eliminate every amp that doesn't fall within those criteria. You will then be down to a number small enough that you might even be able to test drive a couple before making a purchase.

 

1. Power: Minimum/how much headroom do you want? Into how many ohms?

 

2. Size: How heavy? How many rackspaces?

 

3. EQ: How much flexibility? Preferences for center or shelving frequencies?

 

4. Effects loop: Necessary? Unnecessary?

 

5. Other features: DI? Mute? Tuner out? 1/4" jacks, speakons, etc.?

 

6. Tone: Ol' skool w/ grit? Modern/clean? Specific tonal flavor? Transparent/uncoloring?

 

Etc.

 

Eden, Woods, SWR, EA, Peavey, GK...

 

Peace.

--s-uu

[rumpelstiltskin.]

Originally posted by SteveC:

So Eden seems to be the choice of the forum users.

yes, but it's more important what your choice is. the swr may work for you, but i've never played an swr i've liked. i'm pretty rare in that respect, though.

 

robb.

[SteveC]

Originally posted by Dr. Sweet Willie:

Steve,

 

We can toss around the names of various brands and models of amps for days. Stop for a second and really review the criteria that are important to you. Then eliminate every amp that doesn't fall within those criteria. You will then be down to a number small enough that you might even be able to test drive a couple before making a purchase.

 

1. Power: Minimum/how much headroom do you want? Into how many ohms?

 

2. Size: How heavy? How many rackspaces?

 

3. EQ: How much flexibility? Preferences for center or shelving frequencies?

 

4. Effects loop: Necessary? Unnecessary?

 

5. Other features: DI? Mute? Tuner out? 1/4" jacks, speakons, etc.?

 

6. Tone: Ol' skool w/ grit? Modern/clean? Specific tonal flavor? Transparent/uncoloring?

 

Etc.

 

Eden, Woods, SWR, EA, Peavey, GK...

 

Peace.

--s-uu

I was going to let this thread die out, but here's one more post on the subject.

 

1. Power = 300 watts @ 8 ohm and able to handle a 4 ohm load if I ever add another Bergie.

 

2. No more than 2 rack spaces or smaller, under 25 pounds would be nice

 

3. Not quite as picky here

 

4. Don't need an effects loop

 

5. DI, I have a tuner, Connections not a big deal - 1/4", speakon, whatever

 

6. I'd like a modern, fairly clean tone. I have the BDDI for the dirt.

[getz out]

Acoustic Image Focus:

 

350-watts @ 8 ohms

600-watts @ 4 ohms

 

4 lbs.

 

Much smaller than 2 rack spaces.

[mcbn]

By "modern, fairly clean tone" do you mean extremely transparent to the point of being almost sterile?

 

The AI seems like it might be just the ticket.

 

$1200 gives you a lot of different options though.

[SteveC]

I like the Focus as well, but $1,200 is a bit steep. Selling the stuff I have will bring maybe $800 - $900.

[getz out]

It comes with a bag, though.

[wraub]

 

Peace,

 

wraub

[SteveC]

A very nice bag, too.

[SteveC]

I received an email from Jim at Bergantino. I gave him some history and my current rig and he suggested an Ashdown ABM300.