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2x10's and such...


Bass_god_offspring

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sup guys and girls.

 

anyways, i'll just get right down to my question...

 

i'm looking into a 2x10 cab to add to my carvin 4x10 (Mainly for transportation reasons). I have a Carvin R100 which, as most of you know, can power two cabs.

 

My red eye 4x10 goes to about 600 watts, so i was wondering: how hard can i push a 2x10 without blowing it? Consider the 2x10 about 400 watts max (carvin).

 

Would using both cabs at the same time change the amount of power i can push the 2x10 at?

 

would it be: 8ohms: 225/225w ???

 

(i found it on the carvin site, but i just want to check).

 

One more thing...

 

Has anyone ever heard of this brand of speakers?

 

here

Are they any good?

 

 

thanks a lot.

 

:wave:

-BGO

 

5 words you should live by...

 

Music is its own reward

 

---------------

My Band: www.Myspace.com/audreyisanarcissist

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I have the 410 version of that cab. And you get what you pay for. I havent blown it yet. The wood is really light and it feels kind of fragile, the handles are plastic. But i can crank out noise. It sounds great with my svp-pro and crown power amp.
We distort. You abide.
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I have the 410 version of that cab. And you get what you pay for.
ummm, do you mean that in a good way?

 

like, in a way that means, "yea, you should buy it?"

-BGO

 

5 words you should live by...

 

Music is its own reward

 

---------------

My Band: www.Myspace.com/audreyisanarcissist

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yeah, i've looked at avatar.

 

they're just as expensive as Carvin cabs, which, i would ideally want, another carvin.

 

thank you though.

-BGO

 

5 words you should live by...

 

Music is its own reward

 

---------------

My Band: www.Myspace.com/audreyisanarcissist

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Well Your head only supplies 500 watts per side so each cab will only get 500 watts max (i forget if that is at 4 or 2 ohms).

 

I would also second the Avatar. I enjoy mine thouroughly.

http://www.briantimpe.com/images/LDL/dots/blue.JPGhttp://www.briantimpe.com/images/LDL/dots/black.JPGhttp://www.briantimpe.com/images/LDL/dots/fuscia.JPGhttp://www.briantimpe.com/images/LDL/dots/grey.JPGhttp://www.briantimpe.com/images/LDL/dots/orange.JPGhttp://www.briantimpe.com/images/LDL/dots/purple.JPGhttp://www.briantimpe.com/images/LDL/dots/red.JPGhttp://www.briantimpe.com/images/LDL/dots/yellow.JPG
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I have an swr goliath 3 410. I'm currently switching it out in favor of two aguilar 210's for the improvement in tone, portability, and some other reasons on which I am not at liberty to say.......Just Kidding. I've just thought the 210 setup gives more versatility for setup anyways. You can use it in the ever so popular "claberstack", or align them in the eminent edendude "ministack"..not too mention the addition possibilty of putting each cabinet on a different side of the stage, or laying down each one flat if you're playing blues ;)
Hiram Bullock thinks I like the band volume too soft (but he plays guitar). Joe Sample thinks I like it way too loud (but he plays piano). -Marcus Miller
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if you are gonna go with the 2x10. then you should get an 8 ohm version. then you can mono bridge your amp and get 500 watts (like you will need to turn up that loud)to both speakers. i don't know if the carvin 2x10 comes in an 8 ohm version. so you could use either or both mono bridged.
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the carvin, avatar, and no-name brand on ebay are all 8 ohm.

 

is there any difference between a Carvin 2x10 and avatar?

 

They're the same price, but i've heard some bad things about the Avatar, like it doesn't have much low end???

-BGO

 

5 words you should live by...

 

Music is its own reward

 

---------------

My Band: www.Myspace.com/audreyisanarcissist

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Bassplayer gave the avatar its editors choice or whatever their good product award is. I played through a 410 version of it and it had plenty of low end with a 4 string (didnt use a fiver though.)

When i played the carvin 210 600 watt combo i thought that it lacked bass when run without the 15 counterpart.

We distort. You abide.
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Do you need a 2x10" now, or can you wait and save up for a better one? If you can wait, then do so. There are loads of SWR and Eden 2x10"s kicking around eBay and the classifieds. And then there's Carvin's 2x10" which GB's so fond of (with crossover mod, IIRC).

 

Alex

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I'm also in the market for a 210 cab. The only one I've found that seems to have the low end to handle the B is Eden's new XST. The rest, as far as I've seen, start at about 60Hz while the XST goes down to 30Hz. I think Eden's XLT starts at 45Hz but I don't remember for sure.

 

And, no, I don't get any money from Eden. But I'm willing to talk sponsorship with them if they would like? :D

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Originally posted by Wolf Tyrant:

I'm also in the market for a 210 cab. The only one I've found that seems to have the low end to handle the B is Eden's new XST. The rest, as far as I've seen, start at about 60Hz while the XST goes down to 30Hz. I think Eden's XLT starts at 45Hz but I don't remember for sure.

Lies, damn lies, and Eden's frequency response claims...

 

Their website used to quote the numbers as +/-2dB, and their 210XLT as 48-14000Hz.

 

This is a graph of the XLT's actual response(as measured by petebass from talkbass):

 

http://www.spiderplant.net/alex/Eden%202x10.jpg

 

That big dip around 40Hz is suspected to be a room measurement anomaly, so ignoring that and just considering the standard ported cab roll-off of 24dB/octave below the tuning frequency the cab still comes in with a -3dB low point of about 60Hz. And the midrange doesn't look anywhere near flat to 2dB.

 

They're good cabs but they're not magic.

 

Alex

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Just a thought, but I'm keeping my eyes open for a used Bergantino HT-210 to complement my HT-322. It seems to have almost the exact same specs as the HT-322 (slightly lower sensitivity) in a smaller package. If it sounds like the 322, I'll like it.

 

Alex, know if a FR curve exists for either of the Bergs? How about a FR curve for your Acme LowB2's?

 

Dave

Old bass players never die, they just buy lighter rigs.

- Tom Capasso, 11/9/2006

 

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Originally posted by Bass_god_offspring:

the carvin, avatar, and no-name brand on ebay are all 8 ohm.

 

is there any difference between a Carvin 2x10 and avatar?

 

They're the same price, but i've heard some bad things about the Avatar, like it doesn't have much low end???

Hey BGO I have the Avatar B210 and it is useless by itself. I used to use it with thier B115. Which together wasn't bad but not as good as my two Acme LB2s.

 

Wade

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BGO,

 

I had an Avatar 210 and it lacked the low end without some major knob tweaking. The cab was very bright overall. I don't think it should be used as a stand alone cab for anyone playing punk/metal/hard rock.

 

Avatar does have a new 210 cab out though, one that is supposed to be tuned a little deeper. That may be worth someone checking into.

 

Also, stay away from cheap ebay cabs.

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Also, do you really need a 210 with a 410?

 

Also, remember lets say your amp puts out 1000 watts bridged into 4 ohms. Now if your 210 and 410 are both 8 ohms that will give you a 4 ohm load but the speakers in your 410 will be receiving 125 watts each while the speakers in the 210 will be receiving 250 watts each. Not that it won't work I just thought I'd let you know that the speakers in the 210 could be seeing more power than the speakers in the 410.

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Man, after reading this thread, I'm more glad than ever I chose the Avatar B112 over the B210 Neo.

 

I am really pleased with that box thus far.

 

And, I agree with NUTT, avoid the usual Ebay cabs. Particle board, weak glue-ups, no-name speakers... No thanks.

 

Peace,

 

wraub

 

I'm a lot more like I am now than I was when I got here.

 

 

 

 

 

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Are you likely to need more than a 4x10"? If you just want a nice compact cab that can stand alone and bring the bottom, search for an Acme Low-B2 on eBay, 4 ohms ideally. Bridge the R1000 into it for a surprisingly loud and big bottomed compact rig. (And be amazed at how you can finally hear your effects clearly...)

 

Alex

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Originally posted by mattulator:

I would look into a 1 or 2 12" BGO.

Or build something! Your pedal board came out good right?

Matt, I'd have to disagree on this suggestion...building a speaker cab is quite an involved process, you have to understand the drivers and all their Theile-Small parameters, other "trade-secret" stuff about positioning the drivers, some thermodynamics to do calculations involving how much "bigger" you make the cab by stuffing it with fiberglass, etc....it's all quite involved. A local company built some cabs for me once and they weren't great, and those folks were very experienced. I think that most of us could probably cut and glue the wood right, but the science has to be in there or you don't have any idea what you're going to get will sound like, even in the theoretical sense.

 

AND, even if you learn the science behind it and decide what you want your specs to be (a difficult first step without experience at it), then design the cab to fit those specs, you still don't have that heuristic knowledge and experience (I know this driver sounds like this while this other one sounds like this, or I know this type of wood sounds better than that one, etc.) that will yield a great sounding cab.

 

Now, one can get the science under their belt and gain the experience by building 10-20 cabs, but that's much more expensive than just buying a cab.

 

BUT, what you could do BGO is go to someone who builds custom cabs. This could get expensive though. You might want to check out www.drbasscabs.com...the owner/operator is a bassist who builds cabs. I don't know how they sound, but I've seen a lot of good reviews and they seem to be priced surprisingly low.

 

I don't think anyone has actually asked yet: what are you trying to accomplish with a 210? Are you going to use it stand-alone or along with the 410?

 

HTH,

Dave

Old bass players never die, they just buy lighter rigs.

- Tom Capasso, 11/9/2006

 

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Matt, I'd have to disagree on this suggestion...building a speaker cab is quite an involved process, you have to understand the drivers and all their Theile-Small parameters, other "trade-secret" stuff about positioning the drivers, some thermodynamics to do calculations involving how much "bigger" you make the cab by stuffing it with fiberglass, etc....it's all quite involved. Dave Sisk
Agreed Dave. I started a long, long time ago and it has become a passion for me. It is a very enjoyable passion and the thought of our young BGO getting into it just kinda blew my skirt up a little. After all he's young and his mind is sharp - if anybody could do it . . . ;)

"He is to music what Stevie Wonder is to photography." getz76

 

I have nothing nice to say so . . .

 

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Originally posted by mattulator:

Matt, I'd have to disagree on this suggestion...building a speaker cab is quite an involved process, you have to understand the drivers and all their Theile-Small parameters, other "trade-secret" stuff about positioning the drivers, some thermodynamics to do calculations involving how much "bigger" you make the cab by stuffing it with fiberglass, etc....it's all quite involved. Dave Sisk
Agreed Dave. I started a long, long time ago and it has become a passion for me. It is a very enjoyable passion and the thought of our young BGO getting into it just kinda blew my skirt up a little. After all he's young and his mind is sharp - if anybody could do it . . . ;)
Matt:

 

Well, in all fairness, a factor I didn't consider is all the knowledge of all the folks on this board. I suppose with some folks like yourself who've actually done it advising him on how to do it, who knows...BGO might create the next hot bass product. :cool:

Old bass players never die, they just buy lighter rigs.

- Tom Capasso, 11/9/2006

 

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first off, thanks for all the helpful posts!

 

second..

 

Also, do you really need a 210 with a 410?
Actually, i want a 2x10 mainly to be a stand alone unit. The other day i tried to get my carvin 4x10 into the trunk of a Toyota Camry (it was raining), and it wasn't at all fun (i eventually had to tarp the stuff down on the bed of my truck).

 

i want a 2x10 that is powerful enough to be used at band practice, and still be able to compliment my 4x10 for shows.

 

like i said, mainly it's a portability issue (small enough to fit in a back seat).

 

i will look into the eden (though expensive) and acme cabs on ebay.

 

thanks again.

 

:wave:

-BGO

 

5 words you should live by...

 

Music is its own reward

 

---------------

My Band: www.Myspace.com/audreyisanarcissist

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I doubt you'll need more than a 410 for shows. Have you considered selling the 4x10" and getting two 2x10" cabs?

yeah, but i'd rather have a full 4x10 in addition to a smaller cab.

 

don't ask me for more details than that, lol, i have my reasons. :)

-BGO

 

5 words you should live by...

 

Music is its own reward

 

---------------

My Band: www.Myspace.com/audreyisanarcissist

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What are the details?

 

Oh, and by-the-way, putting together a cabinet isn't that hard. With the advent of free modeling software, even someone who has no idea about the physics behind speaker construction and design can do it; check out winISD. Great, free program.

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