Tone pot capacitor question.

[picker]

I'm doing some work on a cheapo telecaster. It has a neck'bucker and will have a tele-sized 'bucker in the bridge. Currently, the tone control is kinda weak, it that it doesn't change much through the sweep. I'm wondering what cap and pot values would fix that. I realize that 'buckers work best with 500K pots, but what cap should I put in the circuit?

[Caevan O’Shite]

2 hours ago, picker said:

I'm doing some work on a cheapo telecaster. It has a neck'bucker and will have a tele-sized 'bucker in the bridge. Currently, the tone control is kinda weak, it that it doesn't change much through the sweep. I'm wondering what cap and pot values would fix that. I realize that 'buckers work best with 500K pots, but what cap should I put in the circuit?

The pot taper may or may not be a part of that problem; replace both volume and tone pots with better quality pots. Audio Taper will probably serve you well, and you're right, you'll almost certainly want to stick with 500k pots. Look for CTS and Fender pots intended for guitars. If you get a No Load tone pot, it'll be removed from the circuit when its turned all the way up, and then begin rolling off treble to ground as you nudge it down; this'll give you a great range of brighter to darker tone. You can modify a 'regular' pot to do the same, as well.

As for the capacitor on the tone-pot...

Don't worry about hifalutin, expensive paper-in-oil (aka PIO) caps, oversized/overrated higher voltage caps, all that cap crap... that stuff is exaggerated at the very least, and often just smoke and snake-oil. Less expensive little ceramic caps, "orange drops", etc. will do you fine.

One of these days, I'm going to do an A/B switching comparison of a bunch of tone-caps, including some of the PIO types and the like, just for the fun of it and to decide for myself if  can hear any differences, and if so, how much and how usable a difference, if it's all BS... One of these days.

Now...

A .047mf or .050mf cap would be pretty typical and standard; what's been in a LOT of old, used and "vintage" guitars over the decades.

A .020mf cap would leave a little more of the mids and upper-mids intact, untouched, as you roll the tone-knob back. That value is used on many 'modern' Gibsons and Fenders.

A .0022mf cap will leave even more mids and upper-mids intact, and might be perceived a bit like a 'mid-boost' when rolled back just a little to a 'sweet-spot', especially with the guitars volume-knob all the way up.

Higher and lower values than these will be more extreme in how little and how much treble and mids are removed, and how deeply and how quickly through the tone-knobs rotation.
    
  

[KuruPrionz]

Mr. O'Shite has it pretty well covered regarding capacitors. There is no "snake oil magic" regarding a tone capacitor or some "boo-teeky" manufacturer would be using them. 

Another option to consider is the EMG SPC, it's a simultaneous treble roll-off / mid boost on a single knob. It does require a 9v battery but the battery will last well over a year if you remember to unplug your guitar when not in use. Will work with passive or active pickups. 

 

Being able to kick up the mids will change your world. 

 

I use it to go from strum to shred, backed off is the sound of the guitar and kicked up is my lead tone. It won't go all the way down like a volume knob, which means you can quickly spin it and get back to playing without worrying that you've just turned your volume off. 

[Caevan O’Shite]

1 hour ago, KuruPrionz said:

Mr. O'Shite has it pretty well covered regarding capacitors. There is no "snake oil magic" regarding a tone capacitor or some "boo-teeky" manufacturer would be using them. 

Another option to consider is the EMG SPC, it's a simultaneous treble roll-off / mid boost on a single knob. It does require a 9v battery but the battery will last well over a year if you remember to unplug your guitar when not in use. Will work with passive or active pickups. 

 

Being able to kick up the mids will change your world. 

 

I use it to go from strum to shred, backed off is the sound of the guitar and kicked up is my lead tone. It won't go all the way down like a volume knob, which means you can quickly spin it and get back to playing without worrying that you've just turned your volume off. 

The EMG SPC is tha bomb. Although it might not roll off enough treble for someone who uses a standard tone-control to do that; the SPC's treble roll-off is fairly subtle, like the difference in treble between a Strat single-coil and a P.A.F. type humbucker- which is what it was designed to do.
     
 

[KuruPrionz]

40 minutes ago, Caevan O’Shite said:

The EMG SPC is tha bomb. Although it might not roll off enough treble for someone who uses a standard tone-control to do that; the SPC's treble roll-off is fairly subtle, like the difference in treble between a Strat single-coil and a P.A.F. type humbucker- which is what it was designed to do.
     
 

This is why God put tone controls on amplifiers, so you can get the sound you need.

You might roll the treble off for a recording but you could just do that going in or after the fact. 

Do it live and your guitar will disappear in the mix, that's been my experience. Better to just go to the neck pickup and play softer if you need a mellow tone. Keep some clarity or vanish into the murk. 😇

[CEB]

What is the bucker.  Is it something like a classic Vintage Stack designed primarily for noise canceling but still sounds mostly like a Tele or is it some raunchy hot rails?

[picker]

On 11/10/2022 at 9:38 AM, Caevan O’Shite said:

A .0022mf cap will leave even more mids and upper-mids intact, and might be perceived a bit like a 'mid-boost' when rolled back just a little to a 'sweet-spot', especially with the guitars volume-knob all the way up.

    
  

Caev, is a tolerance of +/- 20% acceptable?

[KuruPrionz]

1 hour ago, picker said:

Caev, is a tolerance of +/- 20% acceptable?

Taking into consideration that you are working the capacitor with a potentiometer so the effect is variable, absolutely acceptable. 

It never stopped Gibson or Fender. 

[Caevan O’Shite]

7 hours ago, picker said:

Caev, is a tolerance of +/- 20% acceptable?

picker-

Short answer: yes.

I don't think that +/- 20% swing would be terribly noticeable; it could be, and if so, it would be a matter of personal prefereance if you were hearing too much or too little depth of 'scoop' into the upper-mids, too much or too little treble-roll-off.

And what Kuru said.