OT-Our Tainted Food Supply

[Wewus432]

Excellent Matts, thank you.

[Kaz]

Originally posted by TheWewus:

Zzzz, are you zzzzzzzzz?

Yeah. Zzzz was going to be the new me, all nice with a happy face. But then you called me a douchebag...

 

Hey man, I don't really think you're a dumb ass,

Really?

 

I just like to push people's buttons to see what they'll do sometimes.

Hmmm, I may have to try that .

 

So, take that for an apology if you like

Okay. But that doesn't mean much really. I apologize all the time, but then I'll come back and be an asshole later.

 

take all this internet bullshit with a grain of salt.

Okay, but it's clear you don't care about my health, because I'm trying to cut down on salt. You must work for McDonald's. Do you know how much sodium there is in a happy meal?

 

It's not worth getting your panties in a wad.

Yeah, but it's fun to get your wad in some panties.

 

You're a weird guy for sure, but of course so am I, and a almost everybody else here.

Yeah...everybody is pretty weird. What's weird, though, is if everybody is weird, than that must be normal.

 

Zzzz, will you marry me?

Yes, but only if you'll cut off your deal, and live your life as a woman. I don't want to offend the sanctity of marriage.

 

And now to get back on topic: all this talk about fruits and vegetables and organic food, what are you guys, gay?

[phaeton]

DC says:

I love crunchy stuff, especially crackers and chips. The only thing in that area I can find that isn't partially hydrogenated is pretzels. What else?

Yeah.. pretzels are the moh scheezi. They are my favourite snack food next to plain old saltines. In fact, i don't believe in antacids. If i ever get an upset stomach either one of those two food products and a glass of water will fix me right up. But now we're talking an assload of sodium.

 

Sodium is also extremely rampant in a lot of the food we eat. When i was in high school, my dad's blood pressure started to rise, so as a family we started cutting back on the amount of salt in the foods we ate.

 

I will honestly attest that after 4 weeks of eating food with much lower salt, your tastebuds will have fully adjusted and IT WILL TASTE THE SAME AS BEFORE.

 

We are so desensitized to a lot of the food we eat. Just like the HFCS that Wewus talks of, there is a crap load of salt in everything. When i lived at home and my sodium intake was minimal, i never knew the difference until i ate out at a restaurant or someone's house- and stuff like that would make me gag. Literally.

 

Go dump a quarter sized pile of salt in the palm of your hand and eat it straight. That's what Taco Bell meat, McDonald's Fries and burgers, Applebee's soup, most chinese fast food and (*shudder*) potato chips taste like.

[TeleCarlos]

I'm sticking with the part that someone, with the help of our goverment, is benefiting from the widespread use of corn syrup thing.... It's f**cking everywhere!!!!!!

[DC]

Just checked some things around the house and although the pretzels didn't have partially hydrogenated oil, they did have corn syrup. Is that the same as the high frutose variety?

 

Also, the Ruffles just said potatos and peanut oil, no mention of partially hydrogenated. Are they actually okay in small doses?

[member 30687]

The items (hydrgenated oils & corn syrup) are not particularly healthy, that's for sure but they are accepted as GRAS (generally recognized as safe) for use in food & they can be easily avoided by those who take the time to learn about them & read labels,

As bad as they are, they don't really seem to me to be indications of "our tainted food supply".

 

Here 's the sort of thing that alarms me ...and should you as well.

[DC]

That's spooky.

[MattC]

Talk about a remnant of older times... Forget about lawns. If the environment is a concern, get rid of meat.

[member 30687]

Originally posted by Matt C:

Talk about a remnant of older times... Forget about lawns. If the environment is a concern, get rid of meat.

That's a personal choice but it would not prevent snafus like the one cited; even vegetables are prone to contamination...& perhaps more dangerous if one doesn't consider them a potential threat.

[MattC]

without resorting to propoganda like PETA morons might (ad-hominem, I know), the land devoted to cattle grazing produces far less food than it would if it were devoted to agriculture. Most meat (especially prepared meats like sausage) contain huge amounts of fat, sodium, cholesterol and the like.

 

I've heard it said that, for many people who went vegetarian, they immedately lost excess weight, lost allergies, lost hypertension.

 

Of course, I'm not about about to go vegetarian;however it isn't uncommon for me to go days without eating meat without noticing it. I do know of many men who don't consider a meal as such without a meat main dish...

[phaeton]

I agree with Matt C...

 

Also, it is well documented that not only is it impossible for humans to digest meat completely (unlike dogs, cats or carnivorous animals), but humans have plant-eater teeth. We don't have the canines or sharp cuspids and bicuspids. Compare the toothy grin of a lion (or even your dog or cat) and the cud grinding teeth of a cow or horse. Then go look at your own and see what they most resemble.

 

Mind you, -I- am not a vegetarian either, and i do like the taste of meat. But i've also gone months without eating it and not paid much attention to it all.

 

My gf *is* a vegetarian, a real one, and she seems a lot healthier than me all the time. When i first met her, i thought this would be a hassle- i.e. we'd have to eat only at certain restaurants and so forth, but it's really not the case. It's quite a bit easier to be a vegetarian than i thought it would be.

 

And it's not just a matter of cutting meat out of the diet, she also makes sure that nothing has any trace elements of meat in it, nor that it would be prepared on the same cooking surface that meat products would be. It's also important to balance the diet. We are a meat-driven society, and a lot of the food we eat is usually a main course of meat and then side dishes to compliment it. Since the side dishes are designed to balance the meat, it is important to add something that is a drop-in replacement (nutritionwise) to meat, or completely overhaul the meal altogether.

 

Now... as far as *real* or *fake* vegetarians, if i had a dollar for every time i heard "oh, i'm a vegetarian, but i eat chicken and fish!"

 

bleh

 

(my gf counteracts that with "oh, i'm a vegetarian too! Except i eat rancid horseflesh and armadillo..")

[Lee Flier]

The fact is that meat and veggies both have a place in the human diet, the problem is the agricultural methods used, the quality control and the processing.

 

People like to cite land usage as a reason not to eat meat, but only a portion of land is arable, whereas quite a lot of marginal land can be grazed by animals. Also, grazing animals can coexist with native animals and plants whereas monocropped veggies and grains can't. Most vegetarians don't think about the fact that growing their soybeans means somebody had to plow under a lot of land and kill everything on it that wasn't soybeans. Deer, rabbits, ground hogs, all sorts of critters who depend on native forest or grassland get killed outright, or else get displaced and starve, because of agriculture.

 

So I'm afraid this particular argument often cited by vegetarians doesn't hold up very well. IF farming is done with respect for the land, it can include both plants and animals. If we're talking factory farming, it sucks whether we're talking animals or plants, although the health problems and humane treatment issues associated with animal farming are worse.

 

So really the best thing you can do for your health, for the environment, for the humane treatment of animals and all that good stuff, is simply to know where your food comes from and how it gets from there to your table. Locally grown food whether animal or vegetable, is ideal because you can hopefully actually see the farm and what goes on there, not to mention they don't have to shoot everything full of chemicals to prolong its shelf life. Trouble is of course, locally grown food is usually more expensive and you have to be able to take the time to prepare it yourself, which is probably modern society's biggest problem. Most of us are just too busy to be able to think much about what we're eating, which really really sucks, or else we can't afford good food, which probably sucks even more.

[Lee Flier]

Originally posted by Jimbroni:

There's alot of strange new info in healthy eating circa's these days. Things like margarine isn't necessarily better for you than real butter, which I believe. Unless you get the no transfat no HFCS, smart balance stuff. Sure margarine is lower in fat and cholestrol, but its full of poison which will not naturally breakdown in your body.

A friend of mine once did an experiment where he left a stick of butter and a stick of margarine out on his windowsill next to each other. Within an hour there were flies all over the butter, but they would not eat the margarine. That stuff is basically plastic. It's almost all hydrogenated oil and like you say, won't really break down in your body. Yuck.

 

Fat and cholesterol are NOT necessarily bad for you. There are tons of examples of different cultures who've consumed incredible amounts of fat and cholesterol and yet they don't get heart disease and are not obese. The difference is 1) the source of the fat and cholestorol is whole unprocessed foods, not food shot full of chemicals, 2) people who come from traditional agrarian societies usually get a lot more exercise than we do, and 3) the fat is not combined in the body with refined sugar and other nasty processed stuff which is what the real problem is. There are a lot of foods which aren't bad at all by themselves but if they're combined with the wrong things or have some of the vital parts processed out, they become really unhealthy. Science now differentiates between "good" and "bad" fat and cholesterol and their corresponding effects on health.

 

Another thing a lot of people don't think about is that traditional farmers, hunters and gatherers relied heavily on fermenting foods to preserve them, and the beneficial bacteria involved in fermentation are also responsible for helping digestion and adding nutrients. Traditional Asian rice was partially fermented when it was processed the old fashioned way; ever since polished rice has become the norm, a lot of Asians' health has deteriorated because some of the nutrients they used to get from rice are now no longer there. And traditional farmers rarely drank fresh milk straight; it was nearly always made into buttermilk, cheese, yogurt, kefir or something similar, mainly so it would last longer. Breads were usually made with fermented dough (sourdough or a variant) as well, and a lot of people who have wheat or lactose intolerance don't have a problem with wheat or dairy when they're processed the old fashioned way.

 

Just a little "food" for thought, with no chemical additives.

[member 30687]

Originally posted by phaeton:

... but humans have plant-eater teeth. We don't have the canines or sharp cuspids and bicuspids. Compare the toothy grin of a lion (or even your dog or cat) and the cud grinding teeth of a cow or horse. Then go look at your own and see what they most resemble.

As said above I think this is a personal decision but the quoted section is not accurate. Apes and monkeys eat meat regularly; humans have done so since earliest days.

Look at the teeth of a baboon or chimp. Our incisors and canine teeth, though reduced, are still evident.

Archaelogical evidence indicates that what is often touted as the "proper" basis for human diets, i.e., grains, were not a regular part of human diet until about 14,000 years ago after cities developed; many think they were a response to the need to feed concentrated groups of people cheaply.

That information is widely available if you want to research it yourself.

 

On, perhaps, a less debatable topic, I reiterate that vegetarianism is no protection from food contamination nor, in these times of genetic alteration, any less tampered with than any other food type.

 

Caution is always advised.

[Wewus432]

I think people should be aware of what they are eating, at the very least, that's the point of this thread.

 

Nutrition is a subject of utmost importance. BE aware of it, at the very least.

 

Subject, being aware, for sure do that, for you, what say? For so do why didi dong fong.

[Tedly Nightshade]

Cattle are a tremendous burden on the planet and extremely destructive. Tilling the soil kills a lot of animals, destroys the soil structure, and causes dust bowls and erosion. Tilling permanently destroys soil.

 

There are ways around this- intensive no-till gardening can produce far, far more per acre than plowed ground, and is sustainable.

 

Reindeer (Wewus will love this) graze arctic tundra and turn widely scattered little clumps of vegetation into concentrated meat, hides, bone, horns. It's vastly, vastly cheaper and more efficient than cattle. You just go harvest some reindeer every now and again- no cost to have a bunch of reindeer out there. This was standard in the Soviet Union for a long time (read Farley Mowat's book, "The Siberians") but when it was tried in North America, the cattle companies shut it down because no way could they compete.

 

You should be concerned about the food supply. Know the farmers that grow your food- it's a lot more meaningful and you know what you're getting. Buying this USDA organic mega-industrial stuff is not like getting stuff from small sustainable farms, at all.

[G. Ratte]

That reindeer thing is interesting. So some maverick entrepreneur should make a fortune in reindeer ranching.

 

Someday, meat will come from genetically engineered creatures grown in vats, pumped through with artificial plasma. All muscle; no nerve cells, no consciousness.

 

Until the sentient robots attack!! And rip us to shreds and use our blood to lubricate their gears. Damn, that's gonna hurt.

[D_dup3]

Though frequently cited, farming dauses far less land loss than logging & the expansion of human living space.

[TeleCarlos]

I think I would like to be a vegetarian.

 

How do I join?