How full time musicians earn their living...

[Coach]

In preparation for an interview on a San Francisco area NPR show (see www.martynemko.com), I am gathering information from many sources including musician forums on the multiple tasks including accompanist, side man, private instructor, product specialist, programmer and other special career categories (see www.musicianslifecoach.com) that an individual full time musician combines into his career to earn a living in the music industry. I am also interested in any information you care to contribute about salaries or fees- hourly, weekly or yearly.

 

As an example, for the San Francisco Bay Area, musicians I interviewed combine a private teaching schedule (anywhere from $40- $80 an hour per lesson), weekday restaurant and club gigs (average $100 per night), side man single engagement gigs (called club dates on the East Coast and Casual on the West Coast) (ranging from $175- $350 per gig), band leader gigs ($500 to $2k and up). The taboo subject of income (not often divulged) ranged from $50k to $110k.

 

This can prove to be a very educational thread if enough of us offer as much as we are comfortable divulging.

 

I am very interested and appreciate any feedback. It seems timely during NAMM when the manufactures, distributors and retailers want to sell more product to musicians.

[Jasco]

For 12 years I made my living touring full time with a blues band. No other job or income.

 

For the past 4 years, I split my time doing regional gigs, teaching, and recording.

 

I occasionally make a little money buying and selling guitars, but it's more just a search for good guitars for myself than being in the guitar buying biz.

 

 

 

- Jasco

 

 

[Gifthorse]

Jasco, love your playing. Excellent feel and tone.

[anderz]

So far, I've made about 40 bucks from music. I'm a teenager, so Iz get cred ;D

[Eric Iverson]

Well, Anderseb, if you invest that $40 now in a good retirement plan, it might add up to something by the time you're on an old fart like me... LOL.

[Jasco]

Well, Anderseb, if you invest that $40 now in a good retirement plan, it might add up to something by the time you're on an old fart like me... LOL.

 

Lani's 2nd Principle of Economics:

$100 placed at 7% interest compounded quarterly for 200 years will increase to more than $100,000,000 by which time it will be worth nothing.

 

 

 

[Jasco]

Jasco, love your playing. Excellent feel and tone.

 

Thanks man. As with all serious musicians I'd assume, my playing is always just a work in progress, probably appreciated more by others than myself.

 

I listened to one of your tracks - good stuff as well!

 

 

[stratcat2k]

i guess it depends on what you define as "full time guitar player". i know I spend much more than 8 hours a day playing, reading, researching, listening and learning about guitars and music and the most i've ever earned was gas money! does that count?

 

in all seriousness to your post, i think the most interesting and telling results will refer to those players not located in the east or west coast, where a good deal of gigs and work is more or less a given for a reasonably professional musician; for instance, how does a full time guitar player make a living in a place like little rock, arkansas, or fond-du-lac, wisconsin, or fargo north dakota?

[SEHpicker]

I make enough money from gigs to feed my addiction. It buys me a new amp or guitar every now and then. But mostly playing with my band to an appreciative audience is the reward. I make tv commercials for a living and play my guitar for the thrill of it.

I don't really want music to become a job... for me, money and music have always been paradoxically opposed. I have nothing but respect for people that are able to continually grind out the tunes, make a living at it, and still keep it fresh and stay motivated. I guess that's the difference between the real pros and those of us that play just for the love of it.

SEHpicker

[Tennessee]

Agree with stratcat2. Look at the "other" main stay for guitaists, Tennessee and the South in general. I live in Southeastern Tennessee, like a graveyard of musicians who have given up trying to make it on the road. In my factory I have no less than three major talent axemen. Two played with local bands for almost 20 years, never got the big break - both made a few hundred a month doing maybe 6-7 gigs a month. Some venues were a few thousand people. Could not sustain a living. Think Anvil.

The third one was a country and western picker, played decades ago, actually made it to the Grand Ole Opery a couple of times. Was a guitarist with Merle Haggard. Got burned out when the R&R guys were riding around in planes and he spent his time on run down buses, eating out of cans. He pushes a broom in one of our factories and refuses to play save for church.

The three small music stores in my town are all owned by musicians who realized that there was no way to make a living with a band. One bassist, one lead, one horn guy. They are all pretty low on the income scale save for one who turned out to be great at selling used stuff.

And my period working with Time Warner in their duplication division we saw 90+ out of every 100 demo tapes dissapear into the night. Tons of talent, only so much room. Not a path that I would ever take to make a living.

You can really love it, but your chances to go big are like the NFL, or NBA. Less than one percent.

[p90jr]

I've always promoted shows and helped book touring bands in my town, or played on the bills, and bands passing through crashed at my place for quite a bit. Most of these original bands, with college radio-level or better airplay and press and discs in stores and maybe on some chart somewhere don't have much money. They choose to stay on the road and take the meal that comes with the hospitality for the show, live as cheaply as possible "back home' (in the case of one guy - in a band I've heard people refer to as "big" - that meant living in a friend's garage). I can tell you that in secondary markets (below major cities) touring bands that aren't well-known, hit-having major label types (who, in that case, are making their living off the record company advance and royalties and show and merchandise income) don't get paid much from shows... maybe a few hundred bucks, for driving a few hundred miles on the way to somewhere. They're gambling on making the big score, someday.

 

The local folks I know who are only "professional musicians" are mostly in cover bands (and increasingly have to dress up in cartoonish costumes and have over the top production aspects to draw a crowd) or they play for a high-paying church.

 

I know some people who only play for a living in New Orleans, and they don't live what anyone would consider "middle-class" type lives... bohemian poverty chic. Most of them will give in to bartending or waiting tables or something when they don't have steady gigs that pay the bills.

 

 

[skipclone 1]

One of the debates I`ve gotten in from time to time is about who the real `pros` are. Some may say it`s the studio guys, who often are paid much more than live players but usually few people outside of the music community have any idea who they are, even the top guys. They may never have written an original song in their lives. Often they can really play, and that`s it.

Others insist it`s the guys who are out there in front of audiences, know what people want to hear, know exactly how something sounds in a crowded room instead of a manufactured environment in a music store and know what gear falls apart after a week, but often end up playing songs that you would gladly run across a busy highway blindfolded to get away from.

Then there`s the experimenters, they may play for little if any cash but the people that know their music are often fanatically dedicated and at some point, if they make it every other record may be trying to sound like them. Matter of perspective I suppose.

I have been paid well in the past, my first regular gig was at a club which was owned by a wealthy industrialist. I got drunk with him one night and he did nothing but complain abot how complicated his life was.

Anyway I think the media gigs I have done, be it music, acting or whatever all have the same issue-they can pay well but not consistently. I did have a T.V. show here that went for a year, the pay was good but not enough to live on by itself. One of the reasons I stick with the job I have is, there`s always a demand-in fact I just went through an emotional wringer between my current and former employers, both of who did everything possible to get me to work for them. And the working time allows me enough flexibility to be able to take side work if and when it comes up. But my basic pay sucks, that`s the tradeoff.

 

[Coach]

Great thread to the post.

 

It would be beneficial to everyone earning a living in the music industry to consider themselves as one commmunity, as opposed to keyboardists vs guitarists.

 

Guitarists should monitor the keyboardist's and bassist's forum from time to time and reply.

[yvangkwheng]

well, full-time musician sounds a decenlty-paid job nowadays. many ppl in china are currently studying music and things related for their future making more money to live a better life.

[skipclone 1]

Welcome to the forum yvangkwheng, hope you can hang around. Lots of cool stuff here.

[Eric Iverson]

There are also people who go the academic route and become music professors and such.

Some of them who do so like it, and others hate it, especially if they don't have many talented students, or who aren't interested in the style the professor wants to teach.

It might not be a bad gig if you could play on the side with your peers once in a while.

[skipclone 1]

There is a Berklee instructor who has a band, I think they are called the Codetalkers. Unfortunately I missed them when they were here. I believe they also have a CD out.

[tony conley]

My goal this year is to end the year living off what I do musically. This comes after two years of living in a retreat meditating, praying, running, reading and writing. I am beginning a new life from almost scratch.

 

I joined a country band last night for the first time. That'll be about $300 a month. It's a great start. I'm sure that I will have to supplement my income for a period with a "real" job, of which I am in hot pursuit. It's a frightful, and exciting period to say the least.

 

I have earned my living for many years in music and associated fields, but severely injured my wrist some time back, and was put on ice for three years of rather intense rehabilitation. I can play about 75% of what I once was able and am tremendously grateful for even that, as my left hand was nearly severed.

 

My efforts can be heard at:

 

Http://www.myspace.com/tonyconleymusic

 

The clock is running, and I've country songs to learn, my music to compose, and many words to be written as well.

 

I am my own experiment. Great thread - really interesting and appreciated. Best of luck to all.

 

thanks, tony conley