duff beer Posted October 4, 2009 Share Posted October 4, 2009 Hi everyone. What's your opinion on keyboard bass in a classic rock cover band? Scenerio: Our 3-piece band just added a good keyboard player. Prior to that our lineup was guitar/bass/drums. I play bass and can also play guitar. There are about 6-8 songs we would like to do that really need 2 guitars to sound right. The bass line in those songs is indistinct or lost in the mix (think "Free Falling" or "Running Down a Dream") and we think the bass can easily be done by the key player without taking away from the integrity of the song. Have any of you been in a band that has used key bass for some songs? Does the crowd even care as long as the song sounds good? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ross Brown Posted October 4, 2009 Share Posted October 4, 2009 Try it... go for sound of band verses "should".... "When I take a stroll down Jackass Lane it is usually to see someone that is already there" Mrs. Brown Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeremy c Posted October 4, 2009 Share Posted October 4, 2009 Hi everyone. What's your opinion on keyboard bass in a classic rock cover band? ..... Have any of you been in a band that has used key bass for some songs? ...... There are a lot of bands around here that use key bass in order to pay one less person. Actually, they often are only paying 1/2 less person because the keyboardists who do this demand more money. I've been replaced by key bass in a band or two. I went back and heard one of the bands. They sounded to me like.....a band without a bass player. The crowd didn't seem to notice. Ugh. Free download of my cd!. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duff beer Posted October 4, 2009 Author Share Posted October 4, 2009 We are a hobby band and the 3 of us have been together for about 25 years and are very good friends outside of the band. The key player has only been with us a couple months and I am in no danger of being replaced. This has nothing to do with saving money by dumping the bass player. I know that I wouldn't want to listen to a classic rock band that had key bass for every song, but it can't be that bad for 6-8 songs (out of 40) when 2 guitar parts would make the song sound more "right" than the 2nd guitar part being done on keyboard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cthulhu Fhtagn Posted October 4, 2009 Share Posted October 4, 2009 The original jazz trio had a guitar/key/vox. When I was bought on as bass, it took forever to get the keys off the arranger and stop playing the bass parts over me. Better than no bass at all, I guess. The bass line in those songs is indistinct or lost in the mix (think "Free Falling" or "Running Down a Dream") and we think the bass can easily be done by the key player without taking away from the integrity of the song. As long as the keys understands that they aren't doing bass parts for the ENTIRE GIG, it shouldn't be a problem. It's not like Petty songs have a high bass demand anyway. Ph'nglui mglw'nafh Cthulhu R'lyeh wgah'nagl fhtagn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duff beer Posted October 4, 2009 Author Share Posted October 4, 2009 As long as the keys understands that they aren't doing bass parts for the ENTIRE GIG, it shouldn't be a problem. It's not like Petty songs have a high bass demand anyway. I agree...the key player is very good and many of the songs we have been playing since he joined showcase his ability on piano, such as Elton John songs and the like. He has no interest is playing key bass all night...and I have no interest in playing guitar all night. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil W Posted October 4, 2009 Share Posted October 4, 2009 There are keyboard players who understand bass and can play bass as well or better than most bassists...but sadly they are rare and most don't understand the subtleties of what makes a bass part groove. For a few songs, provided the keyboard player plays the part with feel it might even provide a neat contrast. http://philwbass.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davio Posted October 4, 2009 Share Posted October 4, 2009 There are a handful of songs my funk/disco band does in which the bass can't be heard over the keyboard which is basically doubling the part with effects. It hurts for me to listen to it but the audience doesn't notice. ...but that's not classic rock. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
b5pilot Posted October 4, 2009 Share Posted October 4, 2009 I don't see too much of a problem with it as long as it's not all night long and the keyboard player can do a good job. Afterall for Starway to Heaven J.P.J. played the bass on a keyboard. Lydian mode? The only mode I know has the words "pie ala" in front of it. http://www.myspace.com/theeldoradosband Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbass1954 Posted October 4, 2009 Share Posted October 4, 2009 Here is a good example of key bass. These guys are friends of mine. Russ the drummer has played with everyone from Santana to Trey Anitassio. Can't control the ocean but we can learn to ride the waves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbass1954 Posted October 4, 2009 Share Posted October 4, 2009 Whoops forgot to add the link! Can't control the ocean but we can learn to ride the waves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeremy c Posted October 4, 2009 Share Posted October 4, 2009 I didn't watch the whole thing. Your friends are great players. IMHO, when the keyboardist is just playing the bass line, it's great. When he is comping with his right hand, the "edge" comes off the bass line. There are only a handful of players who can play a great bass part with one hand while playing a great keyboard part with the other hand. And I don't care what sample you use or how you set the ADSR envelope, a plucked instrument will always have a stronger attack than a keyboard in a live situation. A recording is a different beast entirely. Then all you have to do is hire Louis Johnson to play the bassline and then double it on a keyboard on another track. Free download of my cd!. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
picker Posted October 4, 2009 Share Posted October 4, 2009 Well, only having a key bass didn't hold the Doors back. I'd say it's about how good the keyboard guy is. IF he can pull it off, great. If not, could be pretty sad. Always remember that you are unique. Just like everyone else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davio Posted October 5, 2009 Share Posted October 5, 2009 IMHO, when the keyboardist is just playing the bass line, it's great. When he is comping with his right hand, the "edge" comes off the bass line. There are only a handful of players who can play a great bass part with one hand while playing a great keyboard part with the other hand. There's a keyboard player in a local/regional act around here that I shared a stage with a few weeks ago that blew my mind doing this. It took us a minute to realize there wasn't a bass player. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EddiePlaysBass Posted October 5, 2009 Share Posted October 5, 2009 Does the crowd even care as long as the song sounds good? In my experience they don't even care IF it sounds good And the answer to your question is: hell no ! They don't care what you play nor what you play it on. People still wonder why my "guitar" is bigger than the other two ... "I'm a work in progress." Micky Barnes The Ross Brown Shirt World Tour Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davo-London Posted October 5, 2009 Share Posted October 5, 2009 Zawinul used to double up Jaco's bass line sometimes. It drove Jaco mad though. Listen, no-one cares and if they do ... it'll be a bass player. Davo "We will make you bob your head whether you want to or not". - David Sisk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J. Dan Posted October 5, 2009 Share Posted October 5, 2009 I played keys and bass in my old band. Usually one or the other, though occasionally both at the same time. Obviously, when I was just playing keys, that's where the bass came from. It worked well for some of the more electronic songs that had synth bass to begin with. I was never happy with the sound of the bass for replacing "real" bass, but the crowd doesn't know the difference. One thing I did NOT do that could help - and I believe this was discussed on the keyboard corner - was a separate output for the key bass so it can be mixed separately. Many keyboards have an Aux out. If he can route his bass parts to that, then it can be mixed to be consistent with the bass guitar, and independent of the rest of the keyboard mix. Although, honestly most of it is playing style and the difficulty of playing a stringed instrument the same way on a keyboard. It can be done with decent results on the right songs though. Dan Acoustic/Electric stringed instruments ranging from 4 to 230 strings, hammered, picked, fingered, slapped, and plucked. Analog and Digital Electronic instruments, reeds, and throat/mouth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davio Posted October 5, 2009 Share Posted October 5, 2009 It drove Jaco mad though. I don't think that was the only cause... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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