Leslie West!!!!

[RocketRick]

Whelp you new guys have big world to see!!!

 

Listen to Leslie West..

 

That's the meat.

 

BR

[Bejeeber]

I guess that's how Alaskans talk.

[Bluesape]

Well, there was lotsa meat on him when I saw him....

[Mudcat]

Mountain, a band that was named after the size of the man.

[LeftyBlues]

A true tone freak too, always playing some sweet vintage LP Jr. or similar. Blues = good.

[Caevan O’Shite]

The kicker here is that, uhmn, it's hard to desribe what was great about his playing and tone without either sounding like I'm making jokes, or setting up someone else too... All the adjectives that immediately come to mind are fodder for you guys' punch-lines!!

 

Blueraven, you're right, Leslie West is an incredible and very influential player! He was one of the people who set the bar higher and had a real stand-out sound. What he did with those Les Paul Juniors, such simple guitars, was fantastic; and his use of them was akin to the way Clapton and Bloomfield had "discovered" the late '50s Les Paul "standards" and what could be done with them.

 

What monster fat tone! Herculean licks! Huge sonic vision. "Mississippi Queen", most peoples' first introduction to Leslie West and Mountain, freakin' jumps out of your speakers even now, after all these years, let alone back when it was new!

 

He's really been under-appreciated in later years; the fact that Gibson tossed him a bone with that Epiphone endorsement, instead of a full-blown Gibson Leslie West custom sig-model made to his specs, is pretty sad; why in the world has he wound up having such an endorsement from Dean??

[Bejeeber]

why in the world has he wound up having such an endorsement from Dean??

 

And kind of a pointy headstock model to boot. Dang.

[miroslav]

Leslie West is certanly a mountain of a man and player.

 

But I have to point out that the sound of Mountain...their sonic vision...was probably/mostly due to their bass player, Felix Pappalardi, who happend to be the producer for Cream (Disraeli Gears, Wheels of Fire and Goodbye)...and he was also the producer on West's solo album (Mountain).

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Felix_Pappalardi

 

http://www.pappalardi.com/

 

I'm not saying West had little or nothing to do with it...just that Felix was a major force in the band and it's sound.

[Caevan O’Shite]

Yeah, yer right about Felix Pappalardi's influence there, and elsewhere. His name seems to pop up a lot here and there...

 

Hey, for those who don't know, Blueraven's other recent thread, "Strat step by step Setup", also has links to pics of some KILLER cool, old, vintage guitars of his (it wouldn't have been obvious from the topic-title, the thread kinda veered off but in a very good way)... You should stop by there and clonk on them links! You'll drool...

 

 

[RocketRick]

Well I was playing my Jr. night before last. And even tho the action is less then desirable, it does produce some awesome tones.

I think I;m gonna spring for a full setup with 9's. Maybe those GHSs.

 

Not sure how to get Leslie's tone=sound but it'll be fun trying. Maybe thru the Boogie huh?

 

Well I used to play lead and sing and for West to do what he did - play, write and sing.,,well it ain't no easy feat for most. Then you add that sound and well....you gotta admit all that with 3 pieces. Just inspiring for sure.

[Mudcat]

...Not sure how to get Leslie's tone=sound but it'll be fun trying. Maybe thru the Boogie huh?...

 

Not sure what he used in the studio but I do know West endorsed Sunn amps and used them live for quite awhile in the 70s.

[Terrell]

IMO - In the historic context of tone, he was light years ahead in the race. And he achieved something many players gravitated to upon hearing his...

[Goalie Blues]

I got to see him live last month on his tour with Joe Satriani.

 

Oh My Gosh

Unbelievable. I was blown away. It made me want to go out and buy any mountain album I could find.

He does have a sig model from dean, it's kind of a Les Paul/LP jr hybrid, but it still looks great. He also was playing a version with two pickups also, and his amps were budda (not sure I'm spelling that right).

At the end he and Joe came out and played together - Joe can lay down a blues lick as well as anybody.

 

For my first live show, none too shabby indeed. Now I'm trying to learn "Natucket Sleighride"

[Bejeeber]

I got to see him live last month on his tour with Joe Satriani.

 

Oh My Gosh

Unbelievable. I was blown away.....

........For my first live show, none too shabby indeed. Now I'm trying to learn "Natucket Sleighride"

 

Nice!

[Caevan O’Shite]

Blueraven- what amps do you have? Did I miss that somewhere along the line here?

 

You've got a perfect guitar for that, in that vintage LP Jr; almost any cranked-up tube-amp, controlled from the guitar's volume-knob, should at least get you in the West ballpark, I'd think.

 

Yeah, Goalie Blues, Budda amps are nice; I can easily imagine dialing-in some fat Leslie West tone with one of their amps, especially with a P-90 pickup...

 

Able to do a really good high-gain sound, but also very capable of a really good low/medium-gain thing when the Master's full-up and the pre-gain knob is set to taste. Those Budda amps are classic rock machines with modern control-ability! Fat city with teeth!

[Goalie Blues]

Budda amps are nice; I can easily imagine dialing-in some fat Leslie West tone with one of their amps, especially with a P-90 pickup...

 

Able to do a really good high-gain sound, but also very capable of a really good low/medium-gain thing when the Master's full-up and the pre-gain knob is set to taste. Those Budda amps are classic rock machines with modern control-ability! Fat city with teeth!

 

I hear you, they're just insanely expensive!

[RocketRick]

GB,

 

Your lucky you got to see him. I didn't even know he was still performing. And with Satriani! Must have been true lick & sound fest.

 

CO's - Amps. Well an old Peavy 2-10 solid state. A mid-80's Mesa II-c. With 60/100 watt switch. It has that simul-class switch. I bought 2 speakers to try in it but haven't done it yet. One Alnico 12" Tone Tubby and one 12" JBL D 120-8 that Tone Tubby reconed.

 

I also have an old Univox 60watt tube amp head that quite unique in its sound.

 

Oh and that small Fender G-DEC amp for fun jamming.

 

I also have the GNX4 which I need to practice with. It does best thru the old Carvin mixing board to some outboard cabs with horns.

 

One little device is that old Tube Driver. It seems more compatible with the solid state amp then the Mesa.

 

I'll check out the Budda amps..A new one for me

[Caevan O’Shite]

That's funny- I have a GNX4, too, and I like to put a distortion-pedal that uses a tube in it in front of the GNX4; a Radial Tonebone "Plexitube" pedal, which is a hybrid tube/SS unit with dual channels...

[RocketRick]

Never tried the Tube Driver with the Gnx4. But then again I haven't played the GNX4 that much. I do know it sounds best thru the old Carvin performance mixer and NOT thru the amps.

 

I am amped about getting the Jr set up and running thru the Mesa boogies II-c+ tho. I received that Dan Erlewine guitar setup book today. Might be faster to pay a luthier to do it then me try and do it.

 

Seems like I remember that the bridge on the Jr could not be lowered any more and might need the metal furrel that the bridge screws into turned or ground down to be able to lower the bridge.

Details always details..Grrr.!!

[RocketRick]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leslie_West

[Caevan O’Shite]

Yeah, the GNX4 sounds compromised through a guitar amp's input. (Or, maybe I should say that a good tube-amp sounds compromised with a digital-modeler connected to it.) You might want to try plugging it into the effects-loop return of a guitar amp, though, bypassing the amp's preamp and tone-control section sometimes helps, and it gets warmed up going through a tube power-amp. Varies with what amp, guitar, etc., though.

 

Even if you have a pro do the work (and I think that's a good idea, with the LP Jr), having that book to refer to will give you a better idea of what where 'n' how, and you'll better know what will get you what you want done.

 

If you go to the Les Paul Forum, there's a sub-forum there called "Dan's Guitar Shop"; "Dan" is Dan Erlewine, the same guy who wrote that book and does columns and articles for GP. He's done work on a LOT of Les Pauls and LP Jrs and Specials (Michael Bloomfield's "sunburst" LP used to belong to Dan!). He's made special custom-made one-piece bridges for LP Jrs and Specials (and '53 LPs) that are shaped for improved intonation and action. Even if you didn't want him top do one for you, a good luthier (or a good one, along with a good machinist) could make one for your guitar following pics of Dan's...

[RocketRick]

Thanks for the tip CO'S.

 

We must think alike. In the last few days, since I've been pouring thru his book, I've been considering calling him or trying to email him about the problem. Now I can thanks to your tip. Kudos man!..

 

I'm sure once he see the pics he'll know just what to do. There is at least on guitar luthier here. He's young and has a helper but I just don't think their there yet. Know what I mean? Nice guy and I like him but!!!!.....

 

Hmm another idea to try. Plug into the effects-loop. I'll try that. Another good tip.

 

Hey about 1.5-2yrs ago when getting my guitar itch again, I got stewed on 4-bottles of wine and did a late night jam with that Fender G-DEC. No biggie. PM me and I'll send you a mp3 or wave of it. I recorded it with that Zoom H4. Using the Strat.

[Caevan O’Shite]

Hey, try this with your Tube Driver and your GNX4, whether into headphones or whatever:

 

Plug your guitar into the Tube Driver, and go from the TD to the GNX4.

 

Bring up factory-preset #60, "Pat Jazz". Edit the delay, reverb, and modulation effects if you need to, but leave the basic amp-modeling the way it is.

 

Kick in the Tube Driver, and dial in a tone that you like, and the amount of volume that you like (maybe have a slight boost, but not too much).

 

Use that preset for your clean sound, and the Tube Driver for the overdrive and distortion sounds, like a channel-swiching amp; use your guitar's volume-knob to clean up and tweak the overdrive and distortion of the Tube Driver, classic old-school style.

 

That particular preset's amp-model just seems to work very well as a canvas against which to paint with overdrive and distortion pedals; it's nice and warm and fat, not as thin and bright as some of them.

 

That's the program that I based some of my presets on, that I use my Radial Tonebone 'Plexitube' pedal with. Works great!

 

I use that more than any of the GNX4's "Stompbox" or overdriven/distorted amp-models.

 

Post a link to a hosted mp3 of that in your signature-line (you can edit it in there via the "My Profile" 'page), so that any and all of us can check it out; and you could post it in the music thread near the top of the first 'page of the Forum here, as well.

[RocketRick]

I'll try that CO'S. thanks fo the tip.

 

Had to get a banjo I got of Ebay working..Now to reset the Strat with 9's. Damn 10's. Take the 2 springs I put on off also. I ordered 2 sets of the GHS strings your rec.

 

later

[Caevan O’Shite]

That's too funny, I HATE 9's! Waaay too light for me, even on a longer Fender-style scale-length guitar like a Strat or a Tele. Even 10's seem a bit light to me- they're as light as I'd go on a Strat or Tele. I'm generally an 11's and up (standard-tuned/concert-pitch A=440 hz) kinda guy.

 

I hafta think that with a really spot-on set-up, that you'd come to like some 10s on that Strat after a while, especially some DR round-core strings like their "Tight-Fit" or "Pure Blues" sets, or the (hex-cored) GHS "Nickel Rockers"...

[RocketRick]

why do you like the larger gage strings? Is it because of bending and breaking the 9's? I understand the larger ones provide more electromagnetic signal strength also.

 

I did order the GHS strings in 9's.

[Caevan O’Shite]

It's just the way they feel better to me; part of it must be 'cause I play without a pick, a sorta bastardized fingerstyle- the medium and heavier strings just work better for me for that.

 

And even though the tension is higher, the thicker plain-strings feel softer and rounder to my fingertips than the lighter-gauge ones, which feel like they're cutting into my fingertips.

 

And, I'm just used to 'em.

 

On a Strat, if you can get by with the half-step down tuning, 11's or 12's tuned down a 1/2-step to Eb feel and sound great! Even tuned to regular A=440, the 11's aren't so bad on a Strat. And they just rule on a Les Paul's shorter scale-length!

[RocketRick]

I'm trying to decide to try and adjust the Strat to the 10's and give em a try or just go back to the 9's. I gotta tell ya, I don't like the action or the feel of the tension on the 10's. I stink I can adjust the action for the 10's tho. Maybe its just a matter of getting used to them.

 

Also, whats the REAL diff in the Elixir Polywebs and the Nanoweb per sound and feel if you've tried them?

 

So what's the point of tuning down 1/2 step? Is it to lessen the tension? Never heard of that either..Sheezam Andy!

 

I had some ghs boomers in 9's sent up but I don't think that's what you rec..

[Caevan O’Shite]

A lot of people really like the GHS Boomers; they're a great string, they're one of the nickel-plated steel-alloy strings, like the DR Tight-Fit strings (or their even brighter, louder DR High Beams) which makes tham bright and powerful, high-output, compared to the more vintage-flavored solid/pure nickel type strings like the GHS Nickel Rockers and the DR Pure Blues. The all-nickel types have a lower overall output, but a bolder, fuller midrange and a different sort of punch.

 

Yeah, tuning down will reduce the tension- they won't be as tight, right? They'll be looser, easier to bend. A half-step down for 11s or 10s will work, but starts to get pretty floppy with 9s or 8s- although, this is also really a matter of personal preference. I just like the medium and heavy strings, "Your Mileage May Vary"! Go with what you like, although I do think that with the right set-up, you'd have a good chance of coming to like the 10s, they're a nice middle-ground between the really light 9s and medium to heavier 11s, 12s, 13s, 14s...

 

Like Reif said way back there, tighten the truss-rod by about a quarter of a turn; trial-&-error will tell you if that's too much or too little. That will straighten out the neck, yeilding less "relief", or bow, for less room between the frets and the strings, resulting efectively in a little lower action overall and a better feel over a good length of the fretboard where the bowing takes place.

 

I can't really say much about any of the Elixer strings, or any other coated strings; I have very little playing time on any of them, and have never bought them. I'm lucky, my fingers usually stay really dry while I'm playing, and I don't get that caustic, oxidizing reaction on my strings like some players do.