Jazz+ Posted November 18, 2008 Share Posted November 18, 2008 Anybody tried this new VST upright acoustic bass? Demos: http://vsl.co.at/en/211/496/721/533/756/486.htm Review: Vienna Symphonic Library Upright Bass Vienna Instrument Upright Bass is a download-only product that runs exclusively on the Vienna Instrument, a unique player specialising in on-the-fly patch changes. In common with other Vienna titles, this was recorded in the Silent Stage, a custom-built facility where a dropped pin is a major breach of the peace and surreptitious farts resound like nuclear explosions. Austrian jazz bassist Bernd Konzett lugged his instrument into this quiet place and performed a 7GB set of mainly pizzicato samples and he suffered for his art when playing the slides. According to VSL, "the strings heat up to high temperatures, resulting in regular blistering of the fingertips, leaving behind a certain smell of burned and blistered skin." (A case of Bernd flesh?) The samples are clean and precise with excellent tuning. The upright's sound is big and warm and the three velocity layers used in many of the patches ensure a good dynamic response. Applying their usual forensic approach, VSL sampled the pizzicato parts in damped, muted and 'snap' styles, with three vibrato options and various note lengths, efficiently covering all the musical territory from fast, bebop walking bass-lines to slow, one-note-per-bar jazz ballads. The collection allows for the odd avant-garde excursion, if you want to don that particular beret, and there's also a set of VSL's trademark monophonic legato samples to aid the realism of melodic solo lines. To activate the finger-singeing slides (glissandi), you hold down a note, then play the target note you want to slide to. One slight problem with the slow 'performance glissandi'' is that the target note sounds loudly at the end of the slide, so you have to lift your finger off the key smartly if you don't want to hear it. I also felt the volume of the normal-speed slides was too low in relation to their starting notes. But, on the plus side, the slides faithfully track intervals of up to an octave, and you can determine exactly when the glissando starts after playing the initial note. Upright Bass's arco samples are played with a deliberately edgy bowing and no vibrato, an unmelodious delivery intended as an effect. Also provided are ghost notes, 'upbeats' (single notes preceded by one, two or three grace notes) and a variety of note repetitions, so you'll never hear the same two samples in a row. Some of the note-repetition patches feature the raunchy, snarling string buzz you may have noticed in the soundtrack of ITV's soap satire Moving Wallpaper. All good stuff, although the review wasn't entirely pain-free I shared some of the bassist's agony in the form of buttock cramp as I waited for the samples to download. But at least the price tag won't leave you with burned fingers. Dave Stewart http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/nov08/articles/sampleshop_1108.htm. Harry Likas was the Technical Editor of Mark Levine's "The Jazz Theory Book" and helped develop "The Jazz Piano Book." Find 700 of Harry’s piano arrangements of standards for educational purposes and jazz piano tutorials at www.Patreon.com/HarryLikas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Schmieder Posted November 18, 2008 Share Posted November 18, 2008 It isn't new; I've been using it for almost a year now. By far the best ever, and their Jazz Drums are now available as well, as a freebie for those who buy their phenomenal new Vienna Suite mixing/tracking/mastering effects, which are unbelievably transparent for native plug-ins and have excellent presets for orchestral instruments as well as easy-on-the-eyes interfaces. The Vienna Suite is around $500 post-conversion (it is priced in euros) and for people who buy in the next few weeks, you get the Jazz Drums for free as well as any new effects they add to the suite in the next few months. Then the price goes up. Back to their upright bass, I compared it to everything else out there (quite literally), and nothing else approaches it for fluidity, realism, depth, phrasing, etc. It's of the same quality as Scarbee's bass guitar libraries. Eugenio Upright, 60th Anniversary P-Bass, USA Geddy Lee J-Bass, Yamaha BBP35, D'angelico SS Bari, EXL1, Select Strat, 70th Anniversary Esquire, LP 57, Eastman T486, T64, Ibanez PM2, Hammond XK4, Moog Voyager Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jazz+ Posted November 18, 2008 Author Share Posted November 18, 2008 Also noticed this new " Chris Hein Bass " http://www.soundsonline.com/Chris-Hein-Bass-pr-BS-415.html Harry Likas was the Technical Editor of Mark Levine's "The Jazz Theory Book" and helped develop "The Jazz Piano Book." Find 700 of Harry’s piano arrangements of standards for educational purposes and jazz piano tutorials at www.Patreon.com/HarryLikas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jazz+ Posted November 18, 2008 Author Share Posted November 18, 2008 Here's a link to the Vienna Symphony Jazz Drums deal you mentioned: http://vsl.co.at/en/211/1343/1465/1080.vsl Harry Likas was the Technical Editor of Mark Levine's "The Jazz Theory Book" and helped develop "The Jazz Piano Book." Find 700 of Harry’s piano arrangements of standards for educational purposes and jazz piano tutorials at www.Patreon.com/HarryLikas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jazz+ Posted November 18, 2008 Author Share Posted November 18, 2008 So how do the Vienna Symphony Strings compare with the East West Orchestra Gold? Harry Likas was the Technical Editor of Mark Levine's "The Jazz Theory Book" and helped develop "The Jazz Piano Book." Find 700 of Harry’s piano arrangements of standards for educational purposes and jazz piano tutorials at www.Patreon.com/HarryLikas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jazz+ Posted November 18, 2008 Author Share Posted November 18, 2008 The Vienna Symphony Jazz Drums don't seem to be a regular product. Which are the best "jazz drums" in VST land? Harry Likas was the Technical Editor of Mark Levine's "The Jazz Theory Book" and helped develop "The Jazz Piano Book." Find 700 of Harry’s piano arrangements of standards for educational purposes and jazz piano tutorials at www.Patreon.com/HarryLikas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davinwv Posted November 18, 2008 Share Posted November 18, 2008 Mark: Can you just download the Upright and use it in standalone mode, or in your DAW? I see they have host and mixing software, but it does not seem to be required to play the library. Is that correct? Thanks, Davin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Schmieder Posted November 18, 2008 Share Posted November 18, 2008 Every VSL library comes with the Vienna Instruments player AFAIK. Check their website carefully; I see no reason why that would not be the case, but it's best to verify, as I already owned other products so already had the player. It can run standalone or as a VST or AU plug-in. Not sure about RTAS or DXi as neither one pertains to my setup so I don't check. Eugenio Upright, 60th Anniversary P-Bass, USA Geddy Lee J-Bass, Yamaha BBP35, D'angelico SS Bari, EXL1, Select Strat, 70th Anniversary Esquire, LP 57, Eastman T486, T64, Ibanez PM2, Hammond XK4, Moog Voyager Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Schmieder Posted November 18, 2008 Share Posted November 18, 2008 The Jazz Drums are strictly a freebie for early buyers of Vienna Suite; they will not be sold at this time. Though it's possible within a year's time that they might package it -- probably for a price higher than that of Vienna Suite today. Go for it! I look forward to comparing these to B.F.D.'s jazz add-on, as B.F.D. may not be as convenient as Vienna Instruments for something as expressive as jazz drums, where you often will move from the centre of a drum head to the outer rim. In other words, jazz drums behave more like instruments and like a rock kit, which is hot B.F.D. is set up. I expect these to be the best jazz drums available, but will know for sure once I hear them. I am extremely disappointed in the Jazz & Funk expansion kit for B.F.D., but haven't put a lot of time into trying to make it work yet. So far it just doesn't seem to give me what I'm looking for, for jazz. But it might work well for funk; I haven't tried it for that yet. Eugenio Upright, 60th Anniversary P-Bass, USA Geddy Lee J-Bass, Yamaha BBP35, D'angelico SS Bari, EXL1, Select Strat, 70th Anniversary Esquire, LP 57, Eastman T486, T64, Ibanez PM2, Hammond XK4, Moog Voyager Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Schmieder Posted November 18, 2008 Share Posted November 18, 2008 The east/west stuff is wet and Hollywood, which I hate. I have a lot of their products (like RA, Goliath, and Gypsy, for starters), and like them (when they work), but their symphonic stuff is pre-produced and doesn't fit into my contexts. Vienna is dark and dry, but also warm (warm and dark are not mutually exclusive terms). Very European, which I prefer to American when it comes to symphonic instruments. Easier to work with in a mix, in terms of timbre. Many people prefer EWQLSO as it is pre-produced, so they don't bother with EQ, reverb, etc. It can be awfully hard to mix with other stuff though. I prefer having more control, with raw sound. And also, their stuff doesn't have as realistic articulation -- especially regarding legato. Eugenio Upright, 60th Anniversary P-Bass, USA Geddy Lee J-Bass, Yamaha BBP35, D'angelico SS Bari, EXL1, Select Strat, 70th Anniversary Esquire, LP 57, Eastman T486, T64, Ibanez PM2, Hammond XK4, Moog Voyager Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jazz+ Posted November 18, 2008 Author Share Posted November 18, 2008 Thanks, Mark! Just what I wanted to know. Harry Likas was the Technical Editor of Mark Levine's "The Jazz Theory Book" and helped develop "The Jazz Piano Book." Find 700 of Harry’s piano arrangements of standards for educational purposes and jazz piano tutorials at www.Patreon.com/HarryLikas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Schmieder Posted November 18, 2008 Share Posted November 18, 2008 Careful with the Chris Hein stuff, as the demos took a LOT of work and disguise some of the libraries' flaws. I am stuck with Chris Hein Guitars, which cost $600 and can't be resold. Buyer beware. Chris is a good guy, and many aspects of his libraries are unique and well-done, but there are some basic sampling flaws that can't be worked around in programming. It is a comprehensive library and it is nice that it covers different string types for the upright (this is unique), but in the end, I don't need that :-). The main thing is you'll get more fluidity for string bass using Vienna Instruments, and for bass guitar using Scarbee or Pettinhouse (or a combination thereof). Chris Hein's forte is horns, and those libraries are truly excellent and don't have obvious sampling flaws (such as playing bass notes on the wrong string in terms of how a bassist would phrase things -- though in honesty, the average listener wouldn't notice such details like a true bassist would). Some of those are included in Kontakt 3, and I use them as placeholders quite a bit, as my G4 iMac can't handle my better sound sources for jazz and big band horns. Chris Hein Bass is a pretty good product, but extremely pricey and can't be resold. Therefore, proceed with caution. To get any usefulness out of his products, you really need to load the most sophisticated Kontakt Instruments vs. the simpler ones. My computer can't handle those, so perhaps I've been a bit unfair to the product range. Even so, I'm not happy with the samples themselves, which is what it comes down to. I have found that they do not sit well in a mix and require massive EQ. Eugenio Upright, 60th Anniversary P-Bass, USA Geddy Lee J-Bass, Yamaha BBP35, D'angelico SS Bari, EXL1, Select Strat, 70th Anniversary Esquire, LP 57, Eastman T486, T64, Ibanez PM2, Hammond XK4, Moog Voyager Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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