Music Player Network
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Audio output from iOS devices, easy and otherwise
#3037904 04/09/20 10:00 PM
Joined: Jun 2019
Posts: 793
Likes: 58
Gold Member
OP Offline
Gold Member
Joined: Jun 2019
Posts: 793
Likes: 58
In my ongoing efforts to make sure appropriate threads over in KC don't get lost forever, here's a repost of an answer I just gave to someone over there asking how to get audio out of his iPad so he could use it on stage. It's kind of astonishing that the answers he got were essentially my first paragraph below and nobody had suggested anything better, but I guess that's what I'm here for, right? wink

***

By far the simplest solution is a miniplug to dual XLR or 1/4" TS cable from your iPad's headphone jack to your mixer. The converters in Apple devices actually sound pretty darn good, and I use this method of getting audio out of one of my iPads all the time for live shows on the radio from my studio.

If you want to get a little fancier without spending a ton of money, I recommend that you get an Apple Lightning To USB3 Camera Adapter. Anyone and everyone who wants to be serious about iOS-based music should have one of these; at $39.99 or whatever, it's a stupid cheap solution to a lot of problems.

Basically here's how it works: you plug the Lightning jack into your iPad. The other end has two ports. The Lightning port is a passthrough for power; you run your standard Lightning docking cable from that port to any USB-based 5V power supply, like an iPad charger. (Or your Mac.)

The other port is a USB-A port, and you can plug literally any class-compliant audio or MIDI device in the world into it and it will work. iOS uses the same Core Audio and Core MIDI drivers as macOS, so there's no need for special drivers or anything; it just works. I have done this with everything from a 2-channel audio interface to a 32-channel digital mixer, and have never had a failure.

That little dongle lets you do so much with your iPad or iPhone it's not funny. Right now in my studio, I have one iPad plugged into a Novation AudioHub 2x4 which passes MIDI from a Linnstrument from its USB hub, another one plugged into an Alesis Control Hub for audio output and 5-pin MIDI I/O, and another one plugged into a Yamaha AG06 mixer. Note that some of these devices require their own power and will still need to be plugged in, but even then, the Lightning cable will keep your iPad charged throughout your show so you don't have to keep glancing at the battery indicator.

There ARE dongles that have MIDI In or I/O, audio out or I/O, and charging ports (two examples are the IK Multimedia iRig Pro I/O and the Korg plugKEY); those are fine for music use, but the Lightning to USB3 adaptor does way more, from accessing digital cameras to external storage devices like SSDs and USB thumb drives. I have about five of them around my studio and in my backpack.

Oh, and for those of you who think Apple's prices are a ripoff and you can do just as well with a $10 knockoff adapter... For these adapters to continue to work smoothly as iOS advances, there are occasional firmware upgrades to the tiny chip inside the adapter. Once in a while you'll be told that your adapter is being updated, and five seconds later, it's good to go. Imitation adapters don't have this firmware, or it's burned at the factory for a particular version of iOS, and the odds are good that eventually the adapter will simply stop working and require you to buy another one. And another. And another...

I do use headphone cables with my iOS devices that have headphone jacks, but it's so easy to hook up real interfaces and get more robust cabling and better sound, why not?

Last edited by Dr Mike Metlay; 04/09/20 10:02 PM.

Dr. Mike Metlay (PhD in nuclear physics, golly gosh) grin
Janitor and Hall Monitor, Dr. Mike's Studio Workshop

clicky!: more about me ~ my schwag ~ my radio station (and my fam) ~ my local tribe ~ my day job
1 member likes this: Joe Muscara
Dr. Mike Island
Re: Audio output from iOS devices, easy and otherwise
Dr Mike Metlay #3038041 04/10/20 11:40 AM
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 1,204
Likes: 136
Platinum Member
Offline
Platinum Member
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 1,204
Likes: 136
I remember when I first got my Seaboard Block I was going to run all of my sounds for it off of an iPad, and it was actually going to make my rig smaller.

Fast forward to now, and I've got the iPad plus a Macbook running Mainstage plus an interface and a control surface and USB and MIDI cables and dongles and dozens of modeled and sampled instruments controlled from the Seaboard and the Lumi and my bass pedals and the upper and/or lower manuals of my organ...

I think if I had a more robust iPad (I have a mini) that didn't hit the CPU ceiling so quickly, I might make more of an effort to simplify. As it stands, I've just come to accept that playing with different ways to interface musicmaking with computers is fun, even though sometimes setting up my live rig isn't fun. But I wouldn't be surprised if in the next decade iOS evolves to the point where anything I can do musically on my MacBook is a snap.

Or maybe all human society will collapse and I'll be forced to sing for the entertainment of the local warlord before he sends out his underlings to capture women and gasoline. But hey, life is full of possibilities.


Samuel B. Lupowitz
Composer. Arranger. Musician. Food Enthusiast. Bad Pun Aficionado.
Re: Audio output from iOS devices, easy and otherwise
SamuelBLupowitz #3039941 04/21/20 03:37 PM
Joined: Jun 2019
Posts: 793
Likes: 58
Gold Member
OP Offline
Gold Member
Joined: Jun 2019
Posts: 793
Likes: 58
Originally Posted by samuelblupowitz
I remember when I first got my Seaboard Block I was going to run all of my sounds for it off of an iPad, and it was actually going to make my rig smaller.

Fast forward to now, and I've got the iPad plus a Macbook running Mainstage plus an interface and a control surface and USB and MIDI cables and dongles and dozens of modeled and sampled instruments controlled from the Seaboard and the Lumi and my bass pedals and the upper and/or lower manuals of my organ...

I think if I had a more robust iPad (I have a mini) that didn't hit the CPU ceiling so quickly, I might make more of an effort to simplify. As it stands, I've just come to accept that playing with different ways to interface musicmaking with computers is fun, even though sometimes setting up my live rig isn't fun. But I wouldn't be surprised if in the next decade iOS evolves to the point where anything I can do musically on my MacBook is a snap.

Or maybe all human society will collapse and I'll be forced to sing for the entertainment of the local warlord before he sends out his underlings to capture women and gasoline. But hey, life is full of possibilities.
Samuel, when you say "I have a mini" that's kind of like saying "I have a Mac". grin What KIND of mini do you have? I've worked with all five models and have owned four of them, and there are huge differences.

The first mini was a great starter, but yeah, you'd choke it to death in a hurry. The mini 2 was way better, and I had one in my rig for a very long time. The mini 3 came and went very quickly, superseded by the mini 4, which Apple still actively supports. The mini 5 is the currently sold model.

Anything below a 3 will be mainly good as a MIDI source or a dedicated platform for one or two apps that you always need handy. This is especially good for 32-bit apps that can't run on later iOS versions, as these machines are often capped below iOS 11, and therefore are safe from updates obsoleting your 32-bit stuff. I keep two iPads and an iPod touch specifically to run Alchemy Mobile, which remains my favorite iOS music app and is now gone forever with no chance of return, more's the pity.

The mini 4 is a surprisingly useful rev, and can handle a fair bit of processor load. You can run several powerful VIs and plug-ins before it starts to choke. I did an entire album on an iPad that was processor-equivalent to a mini 4.

However, if you are ever in the market for an iPad that will make your life measurably easier, the mini 5 is an incredible value, one of those sleeper machines that Apple IMO doesn't promote nearly as much. It's the same size and shape as a 4, with the same display and camera and so forth, but under the hood it's running a latest-generation (or nearly so) CPU with significantly increased RAM. This is a completely kickass iPad and can nearly compete with the new USB-C models. On my mini 5, I have used AUM to build entire performance rigs with multiple VIs, each with its own effects, plus MIDI processors, buses and routing, the whole shootin' match, and carried it to gigs with a LinnStrument, and not felt like my music suffered at all.

My Tuesday night shows on RadioSpiral often feature live ambient improvs (I call them "Live Ambient Rants" for reasons I won't go into here) that I work up on the spot, not only melodies / harmonies / atmospheres / backing rhythms / etc. but also AUM setups on the spur of the moment. When I am not in the mood to fire up my entire studio, I will do what I call "slantRants", which only use the devices that fit on my slanted copy shelf at my music/writing workstation. This usually means two or three iPads, one only running Alchemy Mobile, some played from my LinnStrument and some from the touchscreens. Maybe I'll do a slantRant on just my mini 5 tonight, in your honor. smile


Dr. Mike Metlay (PhD in nuclear physics, golly gosh) grin
Janitor and Hall Monitor, Dr. Mike's Studio Workshop

clicky!: more about me ~ my schwag ~ my radio station (and my fam) ~ my local tribe ~ my day job
Re: Audio output from iOS devices, easy and otherwise
Dr Mike Metlay #3040086 04/22/20 01:19 PM
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 1,204
Likes: 136
Platinum Member
Offline
Platinum Member
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 1,204
Likes: 136
Originally Posted by Dr Mike Metlay
Samuel, when you say "I have a mini" that's kind of like saying "I have a Mac". grin What KIND of mini do you have? I've worked with all five models and have owned four of them, and there are huge differences.
A fair point! I have a Mini 4, so perhaps it's my choice of apps rather than the processor abilities... Moog Model D has gotten me into trouble in AUM a few times when I've tried to use that and something else simultaneously.

Of course, the big reason I moved over to the MacBook and Mainstage was so I could create an aggregate device to route separate patches to my main stereo outs and to my talkbox... I think creating separate outputs is still the feature that would make iOS the thing for me!


Samuel B. Lupowitz
Composer. Arranger. Musician. Food Enthusiast. Bad Pun Aficionado.
Re: Audio output from iOS devices, easy and otherwise
Dr Mike Metlay #3041412 04/30/20 05:34 PM
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 1,204
Likes: 136
Platinum Member
Offline
Platinum Member
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 1,204
Likes: 136
I wanted to follow up on this thread as I use some of my QuaranTime to experiment a bit more with an iPad-based rig, and look for ideas about my particular output needs, wants, and fun puzzles.

Here's my situation: the core of my rig is a dual-manual Crumar Mojo XT, which I use for the built-in organ, and as a controller on one or both of the manuals depending on if it's a gig where I want to be carting a stage piano, clavinet, and/or Wurlitzer. I've used the Mojo this way plenty with my Macbook and Mainstage, where I'll supplement the built-in organ with Mainstage instruments (clav, electric piano, synths), plus Pianoteq and Equator. Equator is mostly for the Roli gear that I connect using Bluetooth MIDI to control synths, strings, pitched percussion, and the like. Between Model D, Volt, Noise, bs-16i, M3000, and Geoshred, I've got close to everything I need to cover all of those sounds purely on iOS (though I'm eyeing Neo Soul Keys too).

I do have an interface that I really like for my live rig, a Steinberg UR22mkii, which I chose in part because it works well with iOS (plus it has DIN MIDI, which I didn't know I would need but has come in really handy). It has a useful mix knob that lets me listen to the analog inputs with zero latency while monitoring the iPad audio... but it's a mono mixdown, which isn't ideal for the organ, which I prefer to run in glorious stereo.

So I can run the Mojo through an audio channel in AUM and get the stereo, no problem! But the bummer there is the latency. It's subtle, and close to a non-issue with the buffer set to 512, but that buffer setting takes me up to the lawless borders of CrackleTown, and I can still feel the difference in my playing when I switch between the analog monitoring of the interface and the AUM output. Killer slapback delay when I turn the mix halfway between input and output monitoring, though... wink Turning the wifi off doesn't seem to make too much difference, and I need to keep Bluetooth on for the Seaboard, so I can't go full Airplane mode. Wondering if there are some other things I can do on iOS to manage CPU a little better.

For now, with the Steinberg, as I see it, I could settle for four lines to the mixer instead of two, or settle for mono organ, or put up with a little bit of latency on the organ stuff.

But wait, there's also my talkbox to consider! When running Mainstage on my Macbook, I leave the talkbox on all the time, and route talkbox patches out of the built-in headphone port on the Macbook rather than the interface. That way, I don't have the talkbox anywhere in the chain of my regular stereo output, because if I were comping on organ while taking a talkbox solo, I would be sending one side of the stereo signal through the talkbox as well, and that's not what you want.

Now, all that said: are the iConnect Audio products the thing to look into if I decide to step up my game here? It seems like those can deal with iOS and/or desktops, mix audio inputs directly (bypassing connected devices), and custom route to multiple outputs. Or is there a simpler solution to any or all of this that I'm overlooking in my quest to play around with gear? I leave it to you good people!


Samuel B. Lupowitz
Composer. Arranger. Musician. Food Enthusiast. Bad Pun Aficionado.
Re: Audio output from iOS devices, easy and otherwise
SamuelBLupowitz #3043638 05/14/20 12:36 AM
Joined: Jun 2019
Posts: 793
Likes: 58
Gold Member
OP Offline
Gold Member
Joined: Jun 2019
Posts: 793
Likes: 58
Originally Posted by samuelblupowitz
the bummer there is the latency. It's subtle, and close to a non-issue with the buffer set to 512, but that buffer setting takes me up to the lawless borders of CrackleTown, and I can still feel the difference in my playing when I switch between the analog monitoring of the interface and the AUM output. Killer slapback delay when I turn the mix halfway between input and output monitoring, though... wink Turning the wifi off doesn't seem to make too much difference, and I need to keep Bluetooth on for the Seaboard, so I can't go full Airplane mode. Wondering if there are some other things I can do on iOS to manage CPU a little better.

For now, with the Steinberg, as I see it, I could settle for four lines to the mixer instead of two, or settle for mono organ, or put up with a little bit of latency on the organ stuff.

But wait, there's also my talkbox to consider! When running Mainstage on my Macbook, I leave the talkbox on all the time, and route talkbox patches out of the built-in headphone port on the Macbook rather than the interface. That way, I don't have the talkbox anywhere in the chain of my regular stereo output, because if I were comping on organ while taking a talkbox solo, I would be sending one side of the stereo signal through the talkbox as well, and that's not what you want.

Now, all that said: are the iConnect Audio products the thing to look into if I decide to step up my game here? It seems like those can deal with iOS and/or desktops, mix audio inputs directly (bypassing connected devices), and custom route to multiple outputs. Or is there a simpler solution to any or all of this that I'm overlooking in my quest to play around with gear? I leave it to you good people!

Sam, sorry for the long delay in answering. This Hydrasynth thing has been occupying a big chunk of my MPN time for weeks now.

First of all, I am surprised that you're skirting crackle territory on your Mini 4 with those apps at a 512 buffer. Maybe I've been working with the 5 for too long, but I sit at 256 running way more apps than that and never have issues. Well, hardly ever. grin

As for separate outputs being supported, AUM will happily talk to as many inputs and outputs as your hardware will offer. Why don't you just buy a little USB audio interface with its own power supply and more I/O? You could get one with four or eight of each and AUM would happily talk to them all. If you want to loop stuff back into the iPad from the analog world and then out again, I am not sure what your latency will be like. I have been meaning to look into running apps at high sample rates; if the CPU can handle that, latency drops dramatically. (Remember that buffer size is in samples, not seconds. If you sample twice as fast, the same buffer has half the latency. That alone is why a lot of folks work at 96 kHz.)

Finally, the iConnectivity boxes: I have to be careful when recommending those.

First of all, full disclosure, the head of Marketing for that firm is an old and dear friend, who has been very helpful to me over the years with the various iConnectivity boxes I have reviewed and/or purchased. So I am not unbiased.

I have an iConnectAUDIO4+ on one of my studio machines. I have it there mainly to explore (in my copious free time, har har) the capabilities of practical operation with two computers at once. For those of you who aren't familiar with these boxes, they have the unprecedented ability to talk to two computers at once, fooling each one into thinking that the other one is a USB peripheral with audio ins and outs. You can route, mix, filter, and process MIDI and audio signals until the cows come home, and the audio quality is quite good. Added benefits include not only two USB-B ports for the two computers, but a USB-A port where you can connect a powered USB hub, where you can connect up to eight USB MIDI devices at once.

I have friends who use all of this stuff at once, and who love it to pieces. However, the learning curve for this box is very steep, and isn't likely to get any better any time soon. The problem is the control software.

Right now iConnectivity offers two different software apps to work with the hardware. One is called Auracle. It is trivially easy to use and will get you up and running in no time. However, it does that by significantly dumbing down the box's capabilities; you can have two computers attached, but only one will be active as "master" at a time, and MIDI channelizing and filtering is there but very primitive. The other one is iConnect, which gives you the keys to the kingdom and is easily one of the ugliest, most impenetrable pieces of software I have ever used. You can do everything, once you figure out exactly how to do ANYTHING. Arguably this would be a good use of quarantine time, if you don't end up hiding in a corner playing melodica to yourself and whimpering.


Dr. Mike Metlay (PhD in nuclear physics, golly gosh) grin
Janitor and Hall Monitor, Dr. Mike's Studio Workshop

clicky!: more about me ~ my schwag ~ my radio station (and my fam) ~ my local tribe ~ my day job
Re: Audio output from iOS devices, easy and otherwise
Dr Mike Metlay #3043711 05/14/20 03:32 PM
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 1,204
Likes: 136
Platinum Member
Offline
Platinum Member
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 1,204
Likes: 136
Originally Posted by Dr Mike Metlay
Arguably this would be a good use of quarantine time, if you don't end up hiding in a corner playing melodica to yourself and whimpering.
How do you think I've been spending my quarantine time already? wink

On a more serious note, I'm learning about how to get around some of the idiosyncrasies of the iOS platform for audio. Being used to Mainstage, I figured it made more sense to streamline by loading as many apps into AUM as I could, but I find that I hit the CPU ceiling much, much sooner loading up big AUM sessions than opening each app individually. That also reduces the latency for an analog audio pass-through.

Is that a typical experience? I've always found AUM handy, but I'm learning just how useful some of its MIDI features are for forcing certain apps to respond to program changes when they normally wouldn't (here's looking at you, Noise). It would be preferable to load up a single AUM session containing all the apps I need for a certain gig instead of opening them one by one, but we all have to make compromises from time to time.

Good to know about the iConnect gear; that confirms much of what I've heard about it. Something to keep in mind.

I did discover a fun alternate solution to my "separate output just for talkbox" quandry... I starting using the ModWheels app on my iPhone for some of the synth parts I've been tracking for people lately, since it turns out I only have one board in my collection with pitch and mod wheels, and it's not class compliant, so using it as a synth controller isn't nearly as convenient as it should be. But using the MidiMittr app to connect the pitch and mod wheels over Bluetooth allows me to not only wirelessly send pitch bend and modulation signals to my MacBook or iPad, but also to route MIDI to my iPhone at my discretion (using KeyStage, I can select specific song sections during which to do this, and therefore leave the talkbox itself active at all times). My iPhone 7 isn't up to the task of hardcore performance apps, but for a simple unfiltered sawtooth wave and an LFO for vibrato, it's an easy external, talkbox-only module until the day comes that I get an interface for live use with more outputs.

And no sweat about taking awhile to respond; I know this is your forum, but it's not your personal help desk... and lord knows if I had the Hydrasynth in my possession I'd be plenty distracted.

Last edited by samuelblupowitz; 05/14/20 03:54 PM.

Samuel B. Lupowitz
Composer. Arranger. Musician. Food Enthusiast. Bad Pun Aficionado.
Re: Audio output from iOS devices, easy and otherwise
SamuelBLupowitz #3043774 05/14/20 09:02 PM
Joined: Jun 2019
Posts: 793
Likes: 58
Gold Member
OP Offline
Gold Member
Joined: Jun 2019
Posts: 793
Likes: 58
I need to test that "all at once vs. individual loading" thing; I have never seen that much of an obvious effect in my experience.

Also, thanks for the pointer to MidiMittr, it may end up a very handy addition to my rig. I also grabbed ModWheels to see how it compares to Weeel!, which I adore but doesn't do certain things I need yet.

Mozaic looks fascinating, but I am going to have to research what's available for it in terms of programs that already work. I'm running out of time as it is. smile


Dr. Mike Metlay (PhD in nuclear physics, golly gosh) grin
Janitor and Hall Monitor, Dr. Mike's Studio Workshop

clicky!: more about me ~ my schwag ~ my radio station (and my fam) ~ my local tribe ~ my day job
Re: Audio output from iOS devices, easy and otherwise
Dr Mike Metlay #3043881 05/15/20 04:05 PM
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 1,204
Likes: 136
Platinum Member
Offline
Platinum Member
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 1,204
Likes: 136
Originally Posted by Dr Mike Metlay
I need to test that "all at once vs. individual loading" thing; I have never seen that much of an obvious effect in my experience.
Definitely interested in what you find! Again, it might just be a matter of various idiosyncrasies of my setup, but it's good to get outside my own head about it.

Originally Posted by Dr Mike Metlay
Also, thanks for the pointer to MidiMittr, it may end up a very handy addition to my rig. I also grabbed ModWheels to see how it compares to Weeel!, which I adore but doesn't do certain things I need yet.
Yes, can't beat "free" for easy Bluetooth MIDI routing. Interested in your comparison with ModWheels and Weeel; without having tried both, I get the sense that Weeel is more flexible, but since KeyStage already offers a programmable X/Y surface, I went with the one that was more blatantly "swipe here for pitch, swipe here for mod."


Samuel B. Lupowitz
Composer. Arranger. Musician. Food Enthusiast. Bad Pun Aficionado.
Re: Audio output from iOS devices, easy and otherwise
Dr Mike Metlay #3048940 06/15/20 03:10 AM
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 6,364
Likes: 15
MP Hall of Fame Member
Offline
MP Hall of Fame Member
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 6,364
Likes: 15
Elektron's Digitone can now function as a class-compliant USB audio interface. Several members of the Elektron user community have already verified the functionality.



Digitakt is also now USB class compliant, but its audio inputs are not routed to main, so I hesitate to call it a full-on audio interface. It can route audio coming through USB from an IOS device to its outputs. It can route internally generated audio to the IOS device via USB. But it can't route audio from its inputs to the IOS device.

Last edited by GovernorSilver; 06/15/20 03:13 AM.
Re: Audio output from iOS devices, easy and otherwise
Dr Mike Metlay #3049445 06/17/20 10:56 PM
Joined: Jun 2019
Posts: 793
Likes: 58
Gold Member
OP Offline
Gold Member
Joined: Jun 2019
Posts: 793
Likes: 58
The concept of using a Digitone as an iOS dongle tickles me for some reason. You can please the iPad geeks and the Elektron cultists in the audience at the same time!


Dr. Mike Metlay (PhD in nuclear physics, golly gosh) grin
Janitor and Hall Monitor, Dr. Mike's Studio Workshop

clicky!: more about me ~ my schwag ~ my radio station (and my fam) ~ my local tribe ~ my day job
Re: Audio output from iOS devices, easy and otherwise
Dr Mike Metlay #3049479 06/18/20 02:28 AM
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 6,364
Likes: 15
MP Hall of Fame Member
Offline
MP Hall of Fame Member
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 6,364
Likes: 15
Originally Posted by Dr Mike Metlay
The concept of using a Digitone as an iOS dongle tickles me for some reason. You can please the iPad geeks and the Elektron cultists in the audience at the same time!

As an Octatrack-carrying member of the cult I approve of this message.

Seriously though my GAS for Digitone was reignited by this latest news. iOS device + Digitone is a nice compact rig that will work for some folks.

Some folks who have been looking for a way to integrate IOS apps into their hardware synth/sampler signal chain went with mixers that double as USB audio interfaces with support for 2 or more channels, like the Soundcraft MTK series or KMI KMix. Mixers such as those might still be the best choice for some. But those who want a minimalist setup and are already Elektron fans are all about this Digitone update of course.

This pedal has been on the market for the guitarist crowd for a while but I haven't seen much mention of it among my fellow cultists:
https://www.xsonic.cc/

Re: Audio output from iOS devices, easy and otherwise
GovernorSilver #3052753 07/05/20 09:53 PM
Joined: Jun 2019
Posts: 793
Likes: 58
Gold Member
OP Offline
Gold Member
Joined: Jun 2019
Posts: 793
Likes: 58
Originally Posted by GovernorSilver
Originally Posted by Dr Mike Metlay
The concept of using a Digitone as an iOS dongle tickles me for some reason. You can please the iPad geeks and the Elektron cultists in the audience at the same time!

As an Octatrack-carrying member of the cult I approve of this message.

Seriously though my GAS for Digitone was reignited by this latest news. iOS device + Digitone is a nice compact rig that will work for some folks.

Some folks who have been looking for a way to integrate IOS apps into their hardware synth/sampler signal chain went with mixers that double as USB audio interfaces with support for 2 or more channels, like the Soundcraft MTK series or KMI KMix. Mixers such as those might still be the best choice for some. But those who want a minimalist setup and are already Elektron fans are all about this Digitone update of course.

This pedal has been on the market for the guitarist crowd for a while but I haven't seen much mention of it among my fellow cultists:
https://www.xsonic.cc/

I can't tell, is that box mono?

Also: the K-Mix, like many KMI products, looks great on paper... and it sounds very good!... but I find the touch-surface controls to be a bit anxiety-inducing at times. I got rid of mine, but YMMV.


Dr. Mike Metlay (PhD in nuclear physics, golly gosh) grin
Janitor and Hall Monitor, Dr. Mike's Studio Workshop

clicky!: more about me ~ my schwag ~ my radio station (and my fam) ~ my local tribe ~ my day job
Re: Audio output from iOS devices, easy and otherwise
Dr Mike Metlay #3052956 07/07/20 01:43 AM
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 6,364
Likes: 15
MP Hall of Fame Member
Offline
MP Hall of Fame Member
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 6,364
Likes: 15
Originally Posted by Dr Mike Metlay
Originally Posted by GovernorSilver
Originally Posted by Dr Mike Metlay
The concept of using a Digitone as an iOS dongle tickles me for some reason. You can please the iPad geeks and the Elektron cultists in the audience at the same time!

As an Octatrack-carrying member of the cult I approve of this message.

Seriously though my GAS for Digitone was reignited by this latest news. iOS device + Digitone is a nice compact rig that will work for some folks.

Some folks who have been looking for a way to integrate IOS apps into their hardware synth/sampler signal chain went with mixers that double as USB audio interfaces with support for 2 or more channels, like the Soundcraft MTK series or KMI KMix. Mixers such as those might still be the best choice for some. But those who want a minimalist setup and are already Elektron fans are all about this Digitone update of course.

This pedal has been on the market for the guitarist crowd for a while but I haven't seen much mention of it among my fellow cultists:
https://www.xsonic.cc/

I can't tell, is that box mono?

Also: the K-Mix, like many KMI products, looks great on paper... and it sounds very good!... but I find the touch-surface controls to be a bit anxiety-inducing at times. I got rid of mine, but YMMV.

The Xtone Pro has stereo outputs. Not sure about the inputs
https://www.xsonic.cc/XTONEPRO

I've only known one person who played live with a K-Mix. She seemed quite satisfied with hers.

Re: Audio output from iOS devices, easy and otherwise
Dr Mike Metlay #3053244 07/08/20 06:03 PM
Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 176
Likes: 2
Senior Member
Offline
Senior Member
Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 176
Likes: 2
Originally Posted by Dr Mike Metlay
I have been meaning to look into running apps at high sample rates; if the CPU can handle that, latency drops dramatically. (Remember that buffer size is in samples, not seconds. If you sample twice as fast, the same buffer has half the latency. That alone is why a lot of folks work at 96 kHz.)
Slightly off topic - or maybe not - I've been trying to wrap my head around this. Wouldn't it be that sampling half as fast (with half the buffer size) would mean you'd be getting the same latency but with less CPU hit, since the CPU only has to process half as many samples per second ?

- Jimbo


"It's called an expression pedal for a reason: It's not a volume pedal." -- Dr. Lonnie Smith
Re: Audio output from iOS devices, easy and otherwise
JimboKeys #3053280 07/08/20 10:31 PM
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 620
Likes: 18
MPN Advisory Board
Gold Member
Offline
MPN Advisory Board
Gold Member
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 620
Likes: 18
Originally Posted by JimboKeys
Wouldn't it be that sampling half as fast (with half the buffer size) would mean you'd be getting the same latency but with less CPU hit, since the CPU only has to process half as many samples per second ?

As The Good Dr. Mike said, Increasing the sample rate does indeed reduce latency, but doubling the sample rate doesn't cut the latency in half. There are other latencies involved, and with modern A/D and D/A chips, sample rate isn't as big a part of the total latency as it used to be. The connection between the audio interface and the computer might be the major bottleneck, but Thunderbolt reduced that (versus USB 2 and Firewire, the other contenders) substantially, allowing the buffer for that data transfer be smaller.

Re: Audio output from iOS devices, easy and otherwise
GovernorSilver #3054522 07/16/20 09:17 PM
Joined: Jun 2019
Posts: 793
Likes: 58
Gold Member
OP Offline
Gold Member
Joined: Jun 2019
Posts: 793
Likes: 58
Originally Posted by GovernorSilver
Originally Posted by Dr Mike Metlay
Also: the K-Mix, like many KMI products, looks great on paper... and it sounds very good!... but I find the touch-surface controls to be a bit anxiety-inducing at times. I got rid of mine, but YMMV.

I've only known one person who played live with a K-Mix. She seemed quite satisfied with hers.

I've played live with one as well. When I had to fly to Europe for a concert and could only have the gear that fit in my backpack, it was brilliant: no moving parts to break off, solid, great-sounding. My complaint with it is the same complaint I've had with a lot of the KMI devices that rely heavily on his fabric-based touch sensors: unless a huge amount of time and effort is put into very precise calibration (e.g. the K-Board Pro 4, which has a very nice response), the individual sensing units are not always consistent in their response to touch and pressure.

Learning to use the K-Mix's faders and "dials" was actually a bit of a trick, and each one would have a slightly different response, at least on my unit. I would strongly consider getting another one if I could be sure that these issues were addressed properly, but I don't know how feasible that is once the construction process and materials are locked in. The QuNeo has this issue... on paper, a fantastically powerful and compact control surface, and in practice, a very uneven experience that is more frustrating than fun.


Dr. Mike Metlay (PhD in nuclear physics, golly gosh) grin
Janitor and Hall Monitor, Dr. Mike's Studio Workshop

clicky!: more about me ~ my schwag ~ my radio station (and my fam) ~ my local tribe ~ my day job

Moderated by  Dr Mike Metlay 

Link Copied to Clipboard
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.4