How do I MIDI all my things together?

[scottasin]

Its double new synth day for me, I'm about to trade my JD800 for a Proteus 2500 Module, and I've got a Deepmind comin in the mail. With the sequencer on the Proteus, I think I'll finally have the ability to start really syncing up my electronic music gear. However, I've got no idea what I'm doing with MIDI, the farthest I've gotten is just chaining a MIDI controller into a synth module and then that into a drum machine to share start/stop and tempo. I'd like to get everything I have at the very least up to that level, but I'd also like to utilize the Proteus to potentially control multiple outboard devices if possible too. How would you all suggest I hook everything together? Here's the gear, the first five are what I really want working together, the rest would just be nice if I could get it figured out.

 

Alesis VI 49 - MIDI OUT

Roland SE-02 - MIDI IN/OUT

Arturia Drumbrute Impact - MIDI IN/OUT

Behringer Deepmind - MIDI IN/OUT/THRU

EMU Proteus 2500 - MIDI IN/OUT/(OUT/THRU)

Mooer Ocean Machine Delay Pedal - MIDI IN/THRU

Nord Electro 2 - MIDI IN/OUT

Ocean Beach OB1 - 2x MIDI IN/OUT

Casio Privia - MIDI IN/OUT

[JMcS]

Several 4 in / 4 out MIDI to USB adapters to a computer with SoundQuest MIDI Tools MIDI Mapper (https://www.squest.com/Products/SQMidiTools/SQMidiTools.html) to connect all the goezouttas to all the goezinttas and make any signal routings and changes you could want. The Mapper and other tools can make any changes you need so you don't have to mess with the instruments much.

 

As always, IMO, YMMV, Yada Yada Yada.

 

Good luck.

[GRollins]

I bought an Edirol UM-880. It'll do eight in/eight out and can be switched on the fly, which is what sold me on it. The MOTU switcher thingies have to be programmed with a computer to do presets, which is fine if you have certain things locked down, but I like the flexibility of being able to change my mind, poke a button, and have it work.

 

Grey

[hardware]

Buy a Physis K4.

That way you actually use all of them live.

I only use 6 of the 8 MIDI Ports and 7 if the gig is worthy of the mighty Code 8.

 

If you could get a desktop version of the Physis K4 and then pick an 88/noter with your favorite action, I couldnt dream of anything better than that.(

[Sam Mullins]

I bought an Edirol UM-880. It'll do eight in/eight out and can be switched on the fly, which is what sold me on it. The MOTU switcher thingies have to be programmed with a computer to do presets, which is fine if you have certain things locked down, but I like the flexibility of being able to change my mind, poke a button, and have it work.

 

Grey

 

I had a UM550 for many years and liked it for the reasons Grey cites. One caveat worth mentioning: if you want to use it as a computer MIDI interface, it is not supported on Win10. But if you are only using it as a stand alone MIDI router, this doesn't matter.

[Six-string-man]

However, I've got no idea what I'm doing with MIDI, the farthest I've gotten is just chaining a MIDI controller into a synth module and then that into a drum machine to share start/stop and tempo.

 

 

 

You sound like a total expert to me! The furthest I've got is buying some cables.

[Rod S]

I would spend sometime figuring out your workflow. You need to make some decisions, such as

 

- Do you want a static configuration or be able to dynamically change without switching cables?

- Understand your gear. The Proteus you probably will only connect the midi in, the SE-02 you may want to connect in and out IF the internal sequencer sends midi clock (not sure).

- Do you want to be able to adjust your configuration through a computer (and which one) or manually?

- What is controlling what? do you want flexibility? (say having the alesis as your controller and/or the deepmind).

 

If you just want to experiment, than probably something like Grey suggested, hook it all up and experiment with different workflows (albeit with the limitation of using it standalone). Even something like a used Kawai MAV8 (if you can find one) will probably do the trick, and it's simple to use. I still keep mine around. The MOTUs are nice, but you need the computer. I have one.

 

Honestly, I would experiment a bit, see what works and understand your gear first.

 

 

[David Emm]

Alesis VI 49 - MIDI OUT

Roland SE-02 - MIDI IN/OUT

Arturia Drumbrute Impact - MIDI IN/OUT

Behringer Deepmind - MIDI IN/OUT/THRU

EMU Proteus 2500 - MIDI IN/OUT/(OUT/THRU)

Mooer Ocean Machine Delay Pedal - MIDI IN/THRU

Nord Electro 2 - MIDI IN/OUT

Ocean Beach OB1 - 2x MIDI IN/OUT

Casio Privia - MIDI IN/OUT

 

After some consideration, I'd say trying to hook ALL of that together with the 2500 driving everything is a road to near-madness. I owned several hardware Proteii and loved them, but menu-diving on those things sucked fiercely after a while. If you can suss it and become fluid at using it as your sequencer, cool, but its a meaningful amount of musical weight to heft. For example, if you add much in the way of CC control gestures like pitch bends, you could easily experience a lot of note-choking and go batty trying to track down the knot in things. This is part of why your KC Synth Elders are grey.

 

As you are new to this, don't overload yourself. I've wrestled a few rigs, so I understand how MIDI Spaghetti can make you cross-eyed. I suggest dividing all of that into TWO systems, with the Deepmind and Nord as master keys. Lean one side towards the Drumbrute and percussive or FX sounds. Lean the other towards more melodic places, such as sustaining chords and leads. Either play the SE-02 from the Alesis or split the Nord and maybe trigger it in the top two octaves there. Start like that and you'll be better able to build your way towards your Best Rig, with the routing means you seem to desire.

 

Above all, try this: plug just THREE devices into the Proteus as slave units. Try out different configurations. Learn where they need an internal switch to be flipped so things suddenly sync up. Example: many synths have a place deeper in the menu for setting the +/- polarity of pedals. It takes a while to learn the small steps, but they can be critical. You have an interesting mix of gear, so stop and become more familiar with their manuals. The index/glossary area is where you find the MIDI capabilities described. You'll need that information to map things properly.

You're a brave soul to take this route. Sooner or later, you'll probably see why so many of your Synth Elders route things in a computer. It cuts down on the frequency and amplitude of their screams.

 

[GRollins]

...if you want to use it as a computer MIDI interface, it is not supported on Win10.

 

There's a hack for that. I ran into it on the web--don't remember the details as I've never worried about trying to program it via computer; I'm quite content with it as a standalone unit. Besides, I've got several older machines available w/XP and 7, should I want to go that route.

 

Grey

[scottasin]

Alesis VI 49 - MIDI OUT

Roland SE-02 - MIDI IN/OUT

Arturia Drumbrute Impact - MIDI IN/OUT

Behringer Deepmind - MIDI IN/OUT/THRU

EMU Proteus 2500 - MIDI IN/OUT/(OUT/THRU)

Mooer Ocean Machine Delay Pedal - MIDI IN/THRU

Nord Electro 2 - MIDI IN/OUT

Ocean Beach OB1 - 2x MIDI IN/OUT

Casio Privia - MIDI IN/OUT

 

After some consideration, I'd say trying to hook ALL of that together with the 2500 driving everything is a road to near-madness. I owned several hardware Proteii and loved them, but menu-diving on those things sucked fiercely after a while. If you can suss it and become fluid at using it as your sequencer, cool, but its a meaningful amount of musical weight to heft. For example, if you add much in the way of CC control gestures like pitch bends, you could easily experience a lot of note-choking and go batty trying to track down the knot in things. This is part of why your KC Synth Elders are grey.

 

As you are new to this, don't overload yourself. I've wrestled a few rigs, so I understand how MIDI Spaghetti can make you cross-eyed. I suggest dividing all of that into TWO systems, with the Deepmind and Nord as master keys. Lean one side towards the Drumbrute and percussive or FX sounds. Lean the other towards more melodic places, such as sustaining chords and leads. Either play the SE-02 from the Alesis or split the Nord and maybe trigger it in the top two octaves there. Start like that and you'll be better able to build your way towards your Best Rig, with the routing means you seem to desire.

 

Above all, try this: plug just THREE devices into the Proteus as slave units. Try out different configurations. Learn where they need an internal switch to be flipped so things suddenly sync up. Example: many synths have a place deeper in the menu for setting the +/- polarity of pedals. It takes a while to learn the small steps, but they can be critical. You have an interesting mix of gear, so stop and become more familiar with their manuals. The index/glossary area is where you find the MIDI capabilities described. You'll need that information to map things properly.

You're a brave soul to take this route. Sooner or later, you'll probably see why so many of your Synth Elders route things in a computer. It cuts down on the frequency and amplitude of their screams.

so, plain and simple, here's a step one for me... I can record my first sequence loop on the Proteus just fine, but as soon as I switch to 'track 2' to add another layer I lose the original track's sound. I'm not sure if it goes to another output as that routing is fairly complex, or... what? The manual to me is pretty much clear as mud. This is an illustration of my level of knowledge, but I know if I dig in I can figure it out.

 

My initial thought process started with the Alesis into the Proteus and through to the SE-02. The other out of the Proteus would go to the Deepmind, from where the through would go to the Drumbrute. But that's the bare bones setup and I'm not sure if I could actually route the Proteus' 32 channels to effectively work with even that. In my dream world, since the Proteus has 32 channels of output from the sequencer, I could send note value and velocity to 16 instruments in theory, right? However, I'm not sure if thats at all possible in a live workflow.

 

Why do you put the Nord and Deepmind as the masters? Where does the Alesis fit in that setup? I know there are a lot of ways to approach this, and I'd be very interested in seeing what different people would do and why.

 

As far as bringing a computer into it goes I'm quite reluctant... Its not really workable with my current computer, and although I'll get a new one sooner or later, I don't think I'll really focus it on music performance, nor am I necessarily interested in getting into live DAW work. But, if it's genuinely a simpler way, I've got an open mind. I've just never owned a computer that was good enough not to have latency issues with one channel of MIDI, let alone a whole collaborations worth. Also, I've seen the new Novation SL MKIII and wonder if it could take the theoretical MIDI sequencer master role that I Imagine for the Proteus.

[Rod S]

Hopefully someone will post a better explanation, but some stuff to consider.

 

Based on your 1st paragraph. I'm assuming you're using the sequencer in the proteus. You can set it to drive internal sounds or external. So you could have channel 1 and 2 to drive internal sounds, and set channel 3 to external, if you set the se02 to respond to channel 3.

 

The setup you mention on the 2nd paragraph should work, just keep track of your midi channels. The alesis would be your controller, and You would be using the deepmind only as as module in this case, and the nord. If you want to be able to use the Alesis, the deepmind and the nord all as controllers than you will need a patchbay or a computer. I would stick to the alesis just to keep it simple until you have your setup working.

 

How do you have the audio connected in this setup? Do you have a mixer where all the audio inputs go in?

 

 

[Markyboard]

so, plain and simple, here's a step one for me... I can record my first sequence loop on the Proteus just fine, but as soon as I switch to 'track 2' to add another layer I lose the original track's sound. I'm not sure if it goes to another output as that routing is fairly complex, or... what? The manual to me is pretty much clear as mud. This is an illustration of my level of knowledge, but I know if I dig in I can figure it out.

 

Just quickly glancing at the manual(page 58) here's a possibility:

 

 

23.A pattern must be SAVED or it will be erased when you change the pattern. See Save Pattern on page 263.You can continue to add up to 16 tracks. If you need more than this, keep in mind that you can add up to 16 channels of data to each track! Normally, its simpler to use just one channel per track.

To setup a track for multichannel playback see Channel Assign on page 84.

 

There's direction on saving a pattern further down on the same page.