reachjkh Posted May 1, 2003 Share Posted May 1, 2003 From what I've read, Malcom Young from AC/DC has a 400 watt Marshall that he drives 8 4x12s with. 4 for each side of the stage. Already not the biggest due to earlier posts, but definitely honorable mention. Jeff Hey you white boy there Go play that funky music "ok...what's it pay?" first smoke, then silence your very expensive rig dies so gracefully Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fantasticsound Posted May 2, 2003 Share Posted May 2, 2003 Chipotle, you have valid points regarding familiarity with your sound and set, as well as the limitations of many bar PA's. However, you can't hear what's happening in the audience. You can't move all over the room just to gauge the needs in the room. All you can do is set a level and hope it's adequate, but not overbearing. And, as mentioned, sitting or standing in front of such an amp, for the audience, can be excruciating, while the rest of the room struggles to hear individual notes. With all due respect, CMDN, the microphone on a camcorder doesn't accurately represent what is heard in any particular point in the room. That mic reacts nothing like your hearing, and shouldn't be trusted to make decisions regarding sound setup. I have several video tapes that purport to show passable sound at my first few band gigs. But I know better, because I compared what I heard, standing in the audience, with the videotape. Whether it was compression or lack of full frequency response or something else, the video sounded clear and defined where the audience had difficulty hearing lyrics and melodies. (This was when we (my band) were young, green, and didn't know how to use PA properly.) In my experience, there is exactly one band I've encountered that could tell, with consistancy, how to use their amps to fill a room with good sound. That is the Jamie Hartford Band. (Banjo/guitar player, John Hartford's (Gentle On My Mind) son's rock band.) At the time I worked with them, each member had several decades of stage experience, but they were far more attuned to the room, from stage, than any musicians I've met or worked with, before or since. It's easiest to find me on Facebook. Neil Bergman Soundclick fntstcsnd Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dougsthang Posted May 2, 2003 Share Posted May 2, 2003 3 Watts a side of pure Class A sweetness fed through sidefills....heaven.. Miles, did that Rivera rack just get back from the Stampeder's Reunion tour..."Sweet City Woman" at 1600+Watts...it's a guaranteed sell out.. overheard street personality on Venice Beach "Man, that Bullshit is Bulllshhittt...." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chipotle Posted May 2, 2003 Share Posted May 2, 2003 Originally posted by fantasticsound: Chipotle, you have valid points regarding familiarity with your sound and set, as well as the limitations of many bar PA's. However, you can't hear what's happening in the audience. You can't move all over the room just to gauge the needs in the room. All you can do is set a level and hope it's adequate, but not overbearing. And, as mentioned, sitting or standing in front of such an amp, for the audience, can be excruciating, while the rest of the room struggles to hear individual notes. Yes, but standing in front of a PA speaker can be just as excruciating. Both a guitar amp and a PA have the potential to be too loud. I've been to quite a few shows with nice PA's operated by soundmen that have been too loud for my taste. Also, there is no PA which is going to exactly reproduce the instruments. Recording engineers struggle to capture every nuance of a performance in controlled acoustical environments and the audiophiles struggle to reproduce every nuance of a recording. You're just not going to get it with a Mackie in a bar. Part of the appeal of going to see live music is hearing those instruments and performers in person without the mechanical barriers. From a purist standpoint, you must agree that the sound from your amp is going to be more accurate than the sound of your amp through a PA. Sure when you're a big name, large venues with potentially bad acoustics and large PA's are a necessity. However, when you're small, why not enjoy the lack of these extra impediments? If small amps and big PA's work for people that's fine. But, you had better like the sound of that amp close mic'd. Personally, that's not 100% my sound. I'd rather an audience hear the sound develop a bit more. If the venue has a soundman that wants to close mic, I do it. You can mic a high wattage amp, too. I've got small wattage, no master volume amps that I really like, but they wouldn't work for me live or at rehearsal because that magic point on the volume knob is not going to be right for every situation. I don't want to lug around a bunch of extension speakers or speakers of varying efficiency or have to use a distortion box. I want one amp that will work at multiple volumes and it might be over 50 watts. Anyway, I do agree that all you can do is set a level and go. Some will set the wrong level and some will get it right, which goes for bands and soundmen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Bear Jew Posted May 2, 2003 Share Posted May 2, 2003 With all due respect, CMDN, the microphone on a camcorder doesn't accurately represent what is heard in any particular point in the room. That mic reacts nothing like your hearing, and shouldn't be trusted to make decisions regarding sound setup. I have several video tapes that purport to show passable sound at my first few band gigs. But I know better, because I compared what I heard, standing in the audience, with the videotape. Whether it was compression or lack of full frequency response or something else, the video sounded clear and defined where the audience had difficulty hearing lyrics and melodies. (This was when we (my band) were young, green, and didn't know how to use PA properly.) Dude... I agree. The camcorder's mic actually sounds like shit. I just meant that the balance was decent enough for us to do our jobs and create something approximating a decent mix. I'm sure these gigs wouldn't sound amazing to people who actually know how to mix, but the folks who come to DIY shows in warehouses and other shit-holes aren't exactly audiophiles, either. They just want to rock, and hearing some loud-ass guitar and bass is what does it for them. Hence, we have a 100-watt Marshall head with the 4x12 cab and a 500-watt bass rig running through a 2x10 and a 1x15. If we had smaller, nicer rigs, we might sound better technically, but we definitely would not have the volume necessary to truly rock the party correctly. Having said this, when we play "nice" rooms with good PA systems, we use the same rigs, but we don't turn it up as loudly so the soundperson can get a good mix. I guess my overall point is that there are still valid reasons for having a high-wattage amp and a big cabinet, even if you're not playing in arenas. Thank you, drive through. \m/ Erik "To fight and conquer in all your battles is not supreme excellence; supreme excellence consists of breaking the enemy's resistance without fighting." --Sun Tzu Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blue Strat Posted May 2, 2003 Share Posted May 2, 2003 Originally posted by Chipotle: Originally posted by myles111: bluestrat .......... I guess you did not see my above post .... 8 6550's.While we're on the subject of loud, how about wiring a pair of these strange but ridiculously powerful triodes... http://www.svetlanausa.com/index.asp?strType=Content&strPage=3CX300A1 WOW! Way cool! I wonder what they cost for a pair? I'd bet that finding iron to power them and for output would be a bitch though.... The OT alone would probably weigh 30lbs! BlueStrat a.k.a. "El Guapo" ...Better fuzz through science... http://geocities.com/teleman28056/index.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chipotle Posted May 3, 2003 Share Posted May 3, 2003 Originally posted by bluestrat: Originally posted by Chipotle: Originally posted by myles111: bluestrat .......... I guess you did not see my above post .... 8 6550's.While we're on the subject of loud, how about wiring a pair of these strange but ridiculously powerful triodes... http://www.svetlanausa.com/index.asp?strType=Content&strPage=3CX300A1 WOW! Way cool! I wonder what they cost for a pair? I'd bet that finding iron to power them and for output would be a bitch though.... The OT alone would probably weigh 30lbs!How loud can you go? Probably not as loud as the Russian military band. They're cheaper than I thought. This place http://el-tubes.webzone.ru/price/pr_high_end.htm has them for $76.90. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blue Strat Posted May 3, 2003 Share Posted May 3, 2003 Well, another fine idea shot down by my wallet. BlueStrat a.k.a. "El Guapo" ...Better fuzz through science... http://geocities.com/teleman28056/index.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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