Guest Posted February 6, 2001 Share Posted February 6, 2001 This one has really come up as a spin off from Tedsters ego topic. Guitarplayer said that when everyone else was partying he was practicing. BK then went on to say that he took some real hassles from school over the self same fact... So did I. The consistent you're a geek , why do you spend your life in your bedroom playing your guitar you freak, kinda comments....... Pretty hurtful on the whole. What were your experiences and how were you treated by your peers and what did your parents make of you spending your time playing rather than doing the things that are 'normal' for kids? And if you made it to a full time carreer what were their thoughts then and what do the peeps that called you geek think of you now? Simon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sbrock1san.rr.com Posted February 7, 2001 Share Posted February 7, 2001 My experience being a guitar player in high school was a positive one. It gave me an identity and a sense of confidence that was invaluable. My parents always encouraged me to play music and bought me a Les Paul Standard (goldtop) for my sixteenth birthday. It's still my main guitar at age 41. It needs some fret work but sounds great. I did hole up in my room playing and listening to music a lot, but it was my sanctuary. My friends got way too into drugs and I used music to distance myself from them. Even though I learned tons of other peoples songs, Led Zep, REO Speedwagon, Neil Young, and Rush, more importantly I could improvise my own tunes and that's what impressed people. I wasn't impressed with me because it came natural, and I knew just enough theory to play. I still remember the very week that I was actually able to play lead after learning the minor and major scales a year earlier. It felt like I had just discovered penicillin or something, I could actually put down some rhythm tracks on a cassette recorder and jam over the top of them. If I would have learned the tuba or some "geeky" instrument, I really don't think I would have gotten the self-esteem boost that this shy boy needed. Guitars were cool then and they are still cool today. Just not as cool as scratching on a turntable. http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/cool.gif Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lee Flier Posted February 7, 2001 Share Posted February 7, 2001 Hoooo boy, great topic! And boy do I relate. Definitely, I was the geek who practiced instead of partied, and I didn't do drugs either which everybody at my school and even most everybody I played with did. 'Course, honestly I had never really "fit in" at school anyway, and everyone used to make fun of me for being "different". So guitar actually improved my social life some. There were other kids at school who were learning, and a few were actually pretty good at it, so we had something in common. The rest I didn't particularly want to talk to anyway, because I would be practicing out on the PE field during lunch and kids would just come up and ask me to play "Stairway to Heaven". Which I refused to do. http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/biggrin.gif The main thing that I considered suffering for my art was school and parents. My parents actually supported the idea of me playing music, they never really gave me the "you're gonna have to get a REAL job" thing (at least not until I got older....LOL), but for one thing, it took me forever to get them to buy me a guitar in the first place. This pissed me off because I had consistently proven that I was serious about my interests and not the kind of kid who would play with a new toy for a week and then it wound up collecting dust. So I had to borrow guitars or play at music stores for about a year. Then, once I got the guitar it became a serious obsession. That's about all I did was practice. This upset my parents because I'd always hated school anyway and now my schoolwork was really suffering. So they started this "program" where if my grades weren't where they wanted them to be, they'd take the guitar away for 2 weeks. You can imagine how that felt for me. I knew they had it in their closet, so when they went out I would go and get it out of the closet and play and just bawl my eyes out the whole time. Needless to say, this didn't help my grades much either. Somewhere along the line they stopped taking away the guitar because they could see it was only making things worse. Then a couple of years later I wanted to join a band. I'd been in a couple of little bands with schoolmates, but I had some older musician friends that I related to much better and who told me I was good enough to be in a "real" band. This did not go over well with my parents either. For a young girl such as myself (I was about 15) to be playing with a bunch of guys in their 20's who were probably on drugs, and to be staying out all night playing gigs so I'd be tired in school the next day, didn't sound like their idea of something I should be doing. Luckily, I had a couple of friends in high school who sympathized with my position, and little did my parents know that when I said I was sleeping over at one of their houses, I was sneaking off to jam with all these guys. http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/biggrin.gif I ended up dropping out of school and joining a band that was making pretty good money playing private parties and military bases. At that point neither my parents nor anybody in school who'd called me a "geek" could say much, because I was making more money than anybody who was still in high school. So that was some pretty good payback I guess. Later on though, I quit doing the cover band thing and that was when things got tough, everybody doubted me and questioned that decision. I didn't ever regret the decision, but it was still hard to deal with. Sigh... don't know why people have to define you by what you do for a living! --Lee Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fet Posted February 7, 2001 Share Posted February 7, 2001 In the late 70s I was fired from two different rock cover bands because I wasn't good-looking enough - or more precisely, because I was unable to attain the "look" they wanted. I tried to buy the right clothes, etc.; apparently my face was wrong. This caused me severe mental anguish, because my guitar playing was light-years better than that of the guys who replaced me. But they sure looked good. Later I realized that I should hang with the "sound first, image second" style of musicians, and life and music have been a lot better ever since - I haven't been fired from a band since 1978. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fet Posted February 7, 2001 Share Posted February 7, 2001 Addition to previous post: it took me many years to realize that these looks-obsessed bands were RIGHT to fire me. I was good at guitar playing, but poor at the style of "entertainment" they were trying to sell. It still stung like a m___f____, though... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stanner Posted February 7, 2001 Share Posted February 7, 2001 hey steve rb-i learned to play tuba(sousaphone!)in high school and it never did anything bad to me...btw what is self esteem http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/smile.gif i did do some sufferin tho just totin that thang around to county bands,district bands,state band shows,back in the day- AMPSSOUNDBETTERLOUDER Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BK_dup2 Posted February 7, 2001 Share Posted February 7, 2001 Sounds like Lee and Fet have dealt with their share of crap. I am sure that only scratches the surface to some of the things they and a lot of us have gone through to live our lives the way we choose. For myself the biggest thing that I have had to deal with is the "what the hell are you doing with your life" attitude from not only family but people who have no business giving me their opinion. I have worked every shitty job from A to B (the worst of which was Delivering Washer and Dryers in the Texas Heat). I even have a four year college degree / but I never wanted to get to comfortable in a well paying corporate job. From one crap job to another the one thing that kept my sanity was the guitar and my belief that I know nothing else. Some of these Comments come to mind I am sure you have heard them: 1) Statement: When are you gunna grow up and find a real job. retort: This is my real job - Ass-head 2) Statement: All musicians are Flakes and on Drugs retort: Then why is my business flourishing and my mind broadening. 3) Statement: What about the security - what happens if you are forty and never "Make It" and are broke. retort: First of all I'm not lazy so I will not be broke, Second I would rather live the way I choose and take risks then have a midlife crisis at 32. Dont get me wrong, anyone who is passioniate about what they do (doesn't matter what vocation) is the goods in my book. So that begs the question "Making It" what does that mean. -- Success has all kinds of faces. This year will be my best yet. I am 31 years old. I get to travel the world, I am no Rock Star but that doesn't matter. I play and compose for a living that's all that matters to me. If I would have listened to all of the Nay sayers from the word go, I never would have gotten this far. So after talking it out. I guess people who are jealous of what you do and try to put a negative spin on everything have got to go. My parents have finally come to realization after 16 years of playing that this is what I do for a living. They still have a hard time understanding that I get paid for something that produces no tangible necessity. They are very old school. I am sure my Indian name to some would be "Dances with Girls" because I haven't suffered enough. I admit it "I ain't from the Hood". I had a pretty good Childhood. Some say you need to have a jacked up childhood to have the fire. "Bullshit I say". So to all who have been told they couldn't for whatever reason (your hair isn't long enough, you suck, etc.) Keep your toes tappin' and your shit-together and the worm will turn Baby!!! BK Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted February 7, 2001 Share Posted February 7, 2001 I can honestly say that I can't ever remember "suffering for my art". My older brothers both played guitar, so it was a "no brainer". The younger brother always wants to be just like the older brother.(at least if he's cool). So from the time I was eleven that was who I was. As the hero worship faded, it was replaced by a true love for playing. I never really gave a second thought to what anybody said, because I was too busy doing what I wanted to do to hear it. Besides, nothing drowns out a dissenting opinion quit like a Marshall Stack. (all knobs cranked to "11") http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/biggrin.gif Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chip McDonald Posted February 7, 2001 Share Posted February 7, 2001 Originally posted by nrgmusic@oemdigital.co.uk: Guitarplayer said that when everyone else was partying he was practicing. BK then went on to say that he took some real hassles from school over the self same fact... Here's the irony in my case: I didn't want to party, but I didn't want to be a geek either. Discovering I had a whole lot of natural ability on guitar both kept me from permanent geekdom: I got to hang with the "cool" kids, but they left me alone out of respect for my ability. The downside - I was never *completely* accepted by any one particular social group because of it. Which in a way was a good thing, because I learned a lot about objectively viewing your relationship to your peer group and their tastes. The ultimate truth in that: *no one* is completely cool to everyone at the same time. So did I. The consistent you're a geek , why do you spend your life in your bedroom playing your guitar you freak, kinda comments....... Pretty That's funny - for me it was the exact opposite. I instantly was constantly invited to parties, hung out with girls I wouldn't have stood a chance with otherwise, etc... The problem was I didn't realize at the time that the party-aspect was supposedly the reward; I never considered any of that. I picked up the guitar the moment I woke up in the morning before school, played while eating breakfast... later I played at school after being invited to play in jazz band... played the moment I got home until I went to bed, sometimes in bed. Never missed a thing, never thought "gee, this is horrible, I'm missing out on the prime of my life". I think it was when I was about 25-26 and I ran out of different musics to learn about, came to a brick wall realization that there hasn't ever been a "bolt from the blue" musician without predecessors, that it occurred to me "hey... you stepped out of life for about 10 years there!"... >hurtful on the whole. What were your experiences and how were you treated I was treated like royalty almost immediately. I went from one week being the hyper-smart guy that could draw real well to the next week something like "The Legend". It was great, but I'm an oddball case - I pretty much instantly could play, which pretty much freaked everyone out in town. The duality helped me out a lot. I'm a scrawny guy, I got into fights a lot when I was younger from guys picking on me; becoming the guitar hero made my life 100% better from a psychological standpoint. In fact, I distinctly remember thinking "man.. this guy wouldn't have given me the time of day last semester, and now he think's I'm cool"... My habits of disappearing into the library at lunch to read went from being "ah man, he's just being a geeky weirdo" to probably something akin to "the scientist is up to something"... People that were hitting on me to write reports for them suddenly were wanting me to come play guitar at their parties, asking me what I thought of their car, etc... It was great. The downside: I was supposed to be Mr. Graphic Arts Savior for my HS. I was the teacher's pet in graphic arts, had all this natural skill in composition and visual arts, etc... Suddenly, the band director is bragging about me, I'm sort of cool all of a sudden; I am now known as the Music Genius Guy; the "wrong" crowd likes me (not that I suddenly shunned the "right" crowd or anything...); I was suddenly reading nothing buy music theory textbooks and so forth... long story short, the graphic arts teacher freaked out and tried to get me kicked out of school on a weird technicality... Strange. >by your peers and what did your parents make of you spending your time My parents were great. Probably realized I had more friends because of it, but I was still staying home and out of trouble. Used to let my first bands practice in the garage; likewise, every pro musician in town will sing praises about my mother's sweet tea.... Without them leaving me alone and allowing my bands to have a place to practice, I wouldn't have been able to gain the experience I got at such an accelerated rate. They didn't fear anything, since I think they pretty much trusted my intelligence enough to realize there is a separation between music and lifestyle. While I knew some really, ermmm.... "sketchy" people I wouldn't let that interfere with music. No problems. you made it to a full time carreer what were their thoughts then and I don't know. They're too nice to let on I think. I gave up a number of possible careers: photographer, graphic artist, programmer - to do music. Quite college after one year. My only regret isn't that I'm dirt poor now, but that I'm not making enough to help them out more. It probably no doubt sucks that they have to tell everyone their son is still the crazy musician instead of the successful programmer, etc... >what do the peeps that called you geek think of you now? No one called me a geek after I started playing guitar - although I remember those who picked on me before.... What sucks is that everyone expects me to have "made it" now, whatever that means - and I have nothing to say for them. Those that knew me before I played - they expect me to be a research scientist or some such - which is even worse. So..... I've often thought I wish I could hook up with a decent documentary film maker; Spheeris' "Decline of Western Civilization" was interesting in the respect that it told the tale of people trying to make it, but there's sooooo many people who have gone that route in a much more mundane fashion. Or something along those lines: there's a good film to be made in there some where... http://www.mp3.com/chipmcdonald Guitar Lessons in Augusta Georgia: www.chipmcdonald.com Eccentric blog: https://chipmcdonaldblog.blogspot.com/ / "big ass windbag" - Bruce Swedien Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tedster Posted February 7, 2001 Share Posted February 7, 2001 >>In the late 70s I was fired from two different rock cover bands because I wasn't good-looking enough - or more precisely, because I was unable to attain the "look" they wanted. I tried to buy the right clothes, etc.; apparently my face was wrong. This caused me severe mental anguish, because my guitar playing was light-years better than that of the guys who replaced me. But they sure looked good. Hey, Fet, You've got yourself a soul brutha right here. I was always a bit on the chunky side (even chunkier now haha) and I didn't fit in at all when the spandex and big hair were in vogue. I didn't have "the look" either, so I got passed by. And there were plenty of good bands in the 70s whose members would never have been offered a chance to model for GQ http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/biggrin.gif Even though it's not rock, I loved John Fahey's take on that...he said he picked up guitar 'cause all the good lookin' cowboys would play and have women hanging all over them. Fahey said he never got many women, on the other hand, he learned a helluva lot about playing guitar http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/biggrin.gif My suffering for my art came from the fact that my Mother was much older than most moms of kids my age, and her music was really from another generation. She detested rock and roll, couldn't hear any purpose to it, and never wanted to spring for an instrument. Another way I suffered for my music is by liking too broad a variety of styles, especially regarding originals. I was always hampered by fellow musicians who were into one "bag", and they'd say "That tune isn't metalloid enough/southern rock enough/blues enough/what-have-you enough". It really hindered my creative development, and forced me to put ideas on "the back burner" for too long. I think that I should have moved into a bigger area, than trying to make something happen with the same cast of morons. Finally, I'm a family dude, and I work rotating shifts. Nuff said? "Cisco Kid, was a friend of mine" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alphajerk Posted February 7, 2001 Share Posted February 7, 2001 i suffered through the 80's more than i ever have for my art, GAWD that was a weird decade. what were people on? http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/biggrin.gif alphajerk FATcompilation "if god is truly just, i tremble for the fate of my country" -thomas jefferson Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted February 7, 2001 Share Posted February 7, 2001 Maybe it was Reaganomics http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/biggrin.gif Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sbrock1san.rr.com Posted February 7, 2001 Share Posted February 7, 2001 , This message has been edited by SteveRB on 02-07-2001 at 01:34 PM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrhappy_dup1 Posted February 7, 2001 Share Posted February 7, 2001 Had to eat toast for dinner many a time! Bandmates all lived together and would pool money to buy a couple loaves of bread! Yikes! No wonder I can't fit into those old jeans anymore! Ahh...yes...The good ol' days. Still have a warm spot for a good loaf of Italian. ------------------ MH MH Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted February 7, 2001 Share Posted February 7, 2001 Hey Alpha I think we had Thatchernomics over here!!! and Gawd certainly did't help us!! http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/rolleyes.gif Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted February 9, 2001 Share Posted February 9, 2001 Hi guys! just a quick note to thank everyone for taking the time to respond.... as ever much learned much treasured.... Thanks Simon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nrg music Posted February 14, 2001 Share Posted February 14, 2001 Hi Everyone Thought I'd share this with you. Suffering took on a whole new meaning today. I had to do some variations on guitar on Bachs Partita 3 and Air on a G string...... Man this was the hardest day of my life so far.. These classical bods i've been working with are worse than any rock/pop producer i've ever worked with. It was made worse by the fact that I don't read dots so I was kinda busking along the thing. They just didn't run in record all the time like I do and keep the best stuff they were in bloody rehearsal mode so I ended up having to learn my parts when I thought I had finished and re record the whole f*****ng lot all over again. Hard days night or what? I'll never say these classical types have an easy time ever again...... Mind you the positive side of this session was I think ( he says lighting about the 60th ciggarette of the day ) they might just have learned a trick or two themselves. My revenge comes tomorrow when I make the viola player work without score....He he he he he Simon http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/mad.gif ...remember there is absolutely no point in talking about someone behind their back unless they get to hear about it... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michael saulnier Posted February 14, 2001 Share Posted February 14, 2001 I think most non-guitar players underestimate what your average bar-band guitarist goes through on a typical night. First, it's a real "long day" you've got to set-up early, deal with the inevitable last minute setup and equipment problems, do a sound check, play 3 to 5 sets with vitality, deal with the demands of the audience, and then... when it's all over and the "fans" have gone home to their beds... you're the last to leave at night after tearing down and packing out your own equipment. Don't forget collecting your night's fee... Add in the various unanticipated issues... no parking nearby, steep stairs, freezing cold nights... all par for the course. So I say, every "working class" guitar player "suffers for his or her art" just by showing up and doing their basic gig. But I bet the majority would say they love doing it... and the suffering... well it's a badge of honor. guitplayer I'm still "guitplayer"! Check out my music if you like... http://www.michaelsaulnier.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nrg music Posted February 14, 2001 Share Posted February 14, 2001 quote: originally posted by Guitarplayer ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- So I say, every "working class" guitar player "suffers for his or her art" just by showing up and doing their basic gig. But I bet the majority would say they love doing it... and the suffering... well it's a badge of honor. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Hey Guitarplayer You da man!!! Simon ...remember there is absolutely no point in talking about someone behind their back unless they get to hear about it... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JP_dup5 Posted February 14, 2001 Share Posted February 14, 2001 I agree with most of you about being holed up in your room learning chops and riffs while everybody else is out getting drunk and having sex. except that I always played it like a martyr... almost an emotional scar. It cost me some social skills for a while..blah blah blah...It didn't take long to get over that. I remember playing the moose club in Albany Ga. Saturday night gig. They played bingo until seven, and then, not only did we have to start setting up at seven and be playing by eight, we had to stop at twelve, and be out by one. The other gig I remember, is playing a club called the radio ranch in moultrie Ga, a farm community full of illegals. you couldn't get into the club if you didn't have a green card (that is, if you looked mexican). So, at the end of the night when we would leave, the parking lot was full of illegals, thousands it seemed. It always reminded me of that hitchcock movie, the birds. At the end, when they had to walk through the birds and hope they didn't piss any of them off. needless to say, we never got hassled, but it was a trip. jp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stratman_dup1 Posted February 14, 2001 Share Posted February 14, 2001 Originally posted by guitplayer: So I say, every "working class" guitar player "suffers for his or her art" just by showing up and doing their basic gig. But I bet the majority would say they love doing it... and the suffering... well it's a badge of honor. guitplayer Here Here, Preach it brotha Guitplayer!!! The fridgid nights and the stairs aside, I KNOW my wallet and family have suffered for my art. I can't complain though, seeing as how I wasn't a musician when I got married my wife has been great about it. She really understands how much music means to me, even if she does get a bit jealus of how much time I spend practicing and gigging, not to mention the list of gear purchases http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/biggrin.gif . Love ya Babe!!! and let's not forget my so... I mean my dog. I think he's more jealus than anybody. I'm always afraid I'm gonna come home to find the door to my music room battered down (Rottweiler you understand) and find my guitars and computer in pieces!!! This message has been edited by Stratman on 02-14-2001 at 12:03 AM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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