SUGGESTIONS . . .

[shniggens]

Allright,

 

I am learning to play in a band setting. We currently have a basic 5 piece band setup with guitar, bass, drums, singer, and keys. We have worked out a few decent covers - Magic Carpet Ride, Little Green Bag, Every Little Thing She does is Magic, some Elton, Little Feat, etc.

 

These pieces are pretty straight forward and mostly just use plain piano, and/or organ sounds. I am comfortable playing piano and organ, and usually resort to trying to play piano.

 

But when it comes to the more harder, distorted guitar oriented rock/alternative sound, I can never figure out what patch to pick for rhythm backup, or even lead. Piano sounds OK sometimes for more of an ornamental effect. Guitar sounds on the keyboard are terrible (except for acoustic), and organ gets old.

 

So what would you pros suggest? I have an Alesis QS8 with stock sounds only. I don't have an expression or wah pedal. Should I invest in these? What kind of sound/style do you play in this type of setting?

 

I'm used to playing solo, so this whole band thing is going to be quite the learning process.

 

Much appreciated.

[schmoron13]

I've had that problem for a couple of years since my college rock days...How do you help the sound and not just "get in the way?" One solution is to use a stereo clav sound, and even add some distortion (if it's avail.) though a lot of those tunes have organ or string cues if you want to go the "synth" route (some pianists avoid this like the plague though I feel song contribution is song contribution) Realistically, since you're doing covers, mostly just stay out of the way and try to hit any cues (like the piano and string parts in drops of jupiter)...hope this helps

[shniggens]

Thanks, good suggestion.

 

How about synth patches for rhythm guitar?

[Botch.]

I second schmoron's suggestion of clav, it fits in many places. One key is to experiment, I find a buzzy mono synth line on my Nord Lead fits well on some tunes (ZZ Top genre) while something as unlikely as strings works well on "Blurry" by Puddle of Mudd. We're also learning a tune right now by Creed that I simply have not yet found a decent-sounding patch for; there's no harm in simply leaving the stage for one song and dancing with your honey (or better yet, the bass player's honey ) or walking over to the sound man to critique him until he's mad at you

[Tusker]

Originally posted by shniggens:

But when it comes to the more harder, distorted guitar oriented rock/alternative sound, I can never figure out what patch to pick for rhythm backup, or even lead. Piano sounds OK sometimes for more of an ornamental effect. Guitar sounds on the keyboard are terrible (except for acoustic), and organ gets old.

If the guitars are carrying all the rhythm:

 

- Organ, but not typical rock organ (B3 with leslie). I run the thing through the distortion in the synth. Then I play it as a pad. It floats around the distorted guitar and adds a ton of weight to the band. If the guitarist is playing clean it adds a certain agression without getting chunky. I double the bass sometimes, play sustained notes in the mid-register a lot, and at moments of emotional peak I (subtly) play high register distorted sounds to add shimmer on top of the guitars' mid-range... enveloping the background vox if any. The band still sounds like a guitar band ... but smoother and more authoritative. The guitarists like this because it covers their rough spots.

 

- I use sustaining synth sounds with resonant filter sweeps running into fuzz. By moving the cutoff I can highlight different overtones, squeal and grunt to complement the guitar's comp pattern. I am usually playing only one note in the mid-range for this. The guitarists don't like this because they have to leave room in the mid-range for this game to work.

 

To compliment or carry the rhythm:

 

Usually clav or something similar. Ideally it has a sharp attack and the ability to control timbre and accent through velocity and staccato. Compressed piano, distorted piano, distorted e-piano, even a regular e-piano as long as it barks well.

 

I sometimes play repeated notes in a narrow range so as to sound guitaristic. I might set up zones with identical but (octave) offset patches so I can play identical sounding notes with my left hand and right hand. Then I play repeated notes LRLLRLLR, etc. Paraddidles and other drum patterns are really useful for this kind of guitaristic comping. Since the notes are repeated I use some (footpedal) control over timbre (usually the filter cutoff but other stuff works too) to create the emotional range.

 

Originally posted by shniggens:

So what would you pros suggest? I have an Alesis QS8 with stock sounds only. I don't have an expression or wah pedal. Should I invest in these? What kind of sound/style do you play in this type of setting?

You can likely control the onboard wah effect (I assume there is one in the QS ) with a midi-pedal, wheel or slider and see if it works for you. I am a big fan of wah (or resonant filter) sweeps going into distortion. Dunno if the Alesis supports serial effects.

 

BTW, I am not a pro, but I play live weekly and these ideas have worked well in guitar bands of the sort you describe.

 

Jerry

[shniggens]

Originally posted by iBotch:

simply leaving the stage for one song and dancing with your honey (or better yet, the bass player's honey)

Now that's the best advice I've heard in a while!

 

Seriously, great ideas guys! I really appreciate it. I can't wait to go home and try this stuff out.

 

Thanks for helping a rookie out . . .

[kybdwackr]

i like to do some kind of sustained b3 type pads on stuff like zz top..ill do that and double the bass line with the bassman in the group(oddly enough we get along okay..usually bass players hate that(buy him a jagermeister to bribe him mebe)..dont be afraid to back off on the volume slider either if your strictly doing a quazi rythym part..and ya..most keyboard guit patches byte...

[Dave Pierce]

I play in a classic rock cover band, with one guitarist. For songs that are primarily "guitar-rock" songs, I find of the these two patches let me fill in the sound you'd get from a rhythm guitar. I don't know the Alesis, but find something similar:

 

Hammond, 888000440, no Leslie, heavy distortion.

 

Generic Rhodes sound run through a stomp-box distortion effect.

 

Remember to stay away from thirds a lot. I find V-I chords work real well, with thirds just tossed in occasionally for a bit of spice. And when I do toss in the third, it's a V-I-III, not the primary triad.

 

--Dave