cendion Posted January 23, 2001 Share Posted January 23, 2001 I just bought the CS2x but I'm thinking of change it to another synth since the MIDI implementation really sucks. I am new to the synth scene but what about a synth that cant be used with a real MIDI sequencer? Anyone that can come up with a better choice? I don´t want it to expensive though.. Maximum cost = $1000-1200. The CS2x is about $750-800. My mission is mainly dance oriented music but I also want good piano sounds (better than on the CS2x anyway) so I can play classical stuff to. Also, what is the easiest way to create cool drumbeats? I havent really cracked that one yet.. is there special programs for this or what? Thanks Johan the Wiking Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 23, 2001 Share Posted January 23, 2001 Originally posted by cendion: I just bought the CS2x but I'm thinking of change it to another synth since the MIDI implementation really sucks. I am new to the synth scene but what about a synth that cant be used with a real MIDI sequencer? Thanks If I understood you correctly you're saying that the cs2x CANNOT be used with a sequencer. why? The implementation should be in par with other entry level synths, which means you should get full functionality with a sequencer. Most synths post mid 90s have a decent midi implementation. Also, if your main concern is for a good piano sound, I would look at a piano module. You should be able to pick up a kurzweil micropiano (is that what's called) for under 250 used. Rod Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
teemudeepone.org Posted January 23, 2001 Share Posted January 23, 2001 I wonder what your real problem is? I have a CS1x and it works fine with a midi sequencer. I don't know what more could you want from it? The pianos are crap though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cendion Posted January 23, 2001 Author Share Posted January 23, 2001 Sorry, should have explained better.. What I mean is that I can´t use more than one "performance" (4 layered sounds) with a sequencer. This is the issue with the CS1x too I think. I think the material voices work in normal midi sequencing although I haven´t really tried that yet (as I belive it sounds cooler when sounds are layered in performances, typical dance stuff). Of course the GM/XG sounds works alright with the sequencer but they are kind of boring.. Anyway, thank you for your input as of now. A module is probably smart buy.. Please, excuse me for bad english, I'm from Sweden.. //Johan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
teemudeepone.org Posted January 23, 2001 Share Posted January 23, 2001 Ah, that one http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/smile.gif Well, you CAN use the material voices but you lose the fx and stuff of course. Setting them up can be a pain but it does work. You only have one set of outputs so it's not that useful though... I use my CS1x for just one part and sample some interesting sounds of it and edit them in my sampler... works for me. It's more or less the same with all synths though. There just aren't that many multitimbral synths out there that would have a separate effects for all sounds. It's something you have to live with, or buy tons of synths so that you don't have to use them for multitimbral work. http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/smile.gif Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Bryce Posted January 23, 2001 Share Posted January 23, 2001 Originally posted by teemu@deepone.org: It's more or less the same with all synths though. There just aren't that many multitimbral synths out there that would have a separate effects for all sounds. It's something you have to live with, or buy tons of synths so that you don't have to use them for multitimbral work. http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/smile.gif Novation Supernova is a noteable exception - it lets you use something like up to 7 effects on each of its 8 mulitimbral channels. As a rule, I am one of those people who prefers the one synth/one sound thing. I don't really like to use synths in multitimbral mode, unless I'm stacking programs. I try to use a different hardware synth on each part, pretty much...for the average tune, I use four, maybe six... If you think that many synths sounds like an expensive proposition, consider this - the used market makes having a bunch of synths pretty easy and affordable, especially if you're into the module thing - it's not unreasonable to expect to be able to buy 4 or 5 used modules and a keyboard for under 2k. dB ==> David Bryce Music • Funky Young Monks <== Professional Affiliations: Royer Labs • Music Player Network Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cendion Posted January 23, 2001 Author Share Posted January 23, 2001 Okay, I'm learning ALOT here, this is good http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/smile.gif Obviously I don´t now much about stuff as I am pretty new to it but is it a stupid question to ask how dancemusic is really made? I mean, listen to for example Astral Projection or Sash, do they really have tons of synths and other "tech stuff" to make their dance music? (ok, dum question, of course they have..) but what I mean is: do I really have to have lots of stuff to make dance music? I thought the more expensive synth the more multimbrality you get!? It MUST be possible to record more than one or two midi channels with effects in a sequencer? Maybe it's different with Workstation Synths? BTW, the Supernova is shurely a cool synth but WAY to expensive for me I think.. Thanks anyway http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/smile.gif Cheers! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dansouth Posted January 24, 2001 Share Posted January 24, 2001 Originally posted by cendion: Okay, I'm learning ALOT here, this is good http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/smile.gif Obviously I don´t now much about stuff as I am pretty new to it but is it a stupid question to ask how dancemusic is really made? I mean, listen to for example Astral Projection or Sash, do they really have tons of synths and other "tech stuff" to make their dance music? (ok, dum question, of course they have..) but what I mean is: do I really have to have lots of stuff to make dance music? I thought the more expensive synth the more multimbrality you get!? It MUST be possible to record more than one or two midi channels with effects in a sequencer? Maybe it's different with Workstation Synths? BTW, the Supernova is shurely a cool synth but WAY to expensive for me I think.. Thanks anyway http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/smile.gif Cheers! Cendion, First, your English is very good. It's not easy to communicate clearly in a forum like this, because the people on the other end cannot indicate immediately whether or not they have understood you. Second, a more expensive synth does not necessarily have more polyphony. The Roland JV-1010 has 64 voices and can play on 16 MIDI channels, and it's cheap. Third, you do NOT need a lot of gear, you need a lot of knowledge and experience. Make some tunes with the equipment you have and compare them to commercial releases. Try to identify what makes their mixes sound different from yours, even if you don't understand why. This will help develop your ear, which is more important than any other piece of gear. Discuss the differences in these forums. There are many experienced people here who can help you. Don't be fooled into thinking that a synthesizer - any synthesizer - is going to give your songs a professional sound. That sound is a combination of good basic sounds, a good arrangement, a good mix, appropriate use of effects like EQ and compression, and finally, the mastering process. There is a lot to learn, but you'll learn quickly if you follow the process that I have described. Good luck!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
russreign Posted January 24, 2001 Share Posted January 24, 2001 <<< the used market makes having a bunch of synths pretty easy and affordable, especially if you're into the module thing - it's not unreasonable to expect to be able to buy 4 or 5 used modules and a keyboard for under 2k.>>> Hey Dave what can I get for under 2h? LOL Music Is The Answer! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Bryce Posted January 24, 2001 Share Posted January 24, 2001 Originally posted by russreign: Hey Dave what can I get for under 2h? LOL Under $200? You'd be surprised, Russ. About 10 years ago, you could've gotten a TB-303 for that much. I know someone who bought a Sequential Pro-1 for $75 in 1993, and recently resold it for quite a bit more. I paid $140 for my D-550 in 1996. Right now, analog is obviously still hot, but I'll bet you could find a few synths from 5-10 years back that would fall into that category. For example, I'd guess that you could get a JV-880 module, or one of the original Emu Proteus modules for around that price. It's just a matter of research, patience and timing. BTW, you and Dr. Anderton rocked the roof off of the MPN party at NAMM - excellent job, my brother! http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/cool.gif dB ==> David Bryce Music • Funky Young Monks <== Professional Affiliations: Royer Labs • Music Player Network Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
russreign Posted January 25, 2001 Share Posted January 25, 2001 Dave - yea patience is a virtue I guess http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/smile.gif And thanks for the compliment on the show, I had a good time spinning with Craig... Next time you gotta get "Andy" up there and join us http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/smile.gif Music Is The Answer! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Bryce Posted January 25, 2001 Share Posted January 25, 2001 Originally posted by russreign: Next time you gotta get "Andy" up there and join us http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/smile.gif I would love to... dB ==> David Bryce Music • Funky Young Monks <== Professional Affiliations: Royer Labs • Music Player Network Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DOS Posted January 25, 2001 Share Posted January 25, 2001 In response to your question about if you really need that many synths to make dance music, I don't mean to be an underdog, but personally I think Astral Projection or Sash or any other cheesy dance act like that sucks--but that's just my opinion. Here's what I've found--generally, many dance acts with dozens of modern, expensive synths tend to lack musicianship. I compare their songs to those of Britney Spears because each song may sound different, but when you break it down, it's the same song with a different layer on top--understand what I mean? With the new technology now in synths, you can literally write a basic song in 2 minutes whether you're good at composing or not. In the words of my favorite musician of all time, Liam Howlett, "It's becoming easier to write music, but not necessarily GOOD music." Anyway, all I'm saying is that it all depends on your effort, passion, and talent to compose. If you feel you need an expensive, modern synth, than by all means, go for it ONLY IF YOU FEEL IT'S LIMITING YOUR POTENTIAL. If not, than just get a popular used synth (preferable from the 80s). I've been writing electronic music for about a year now and to be honest, I have yet to touch a real synth. You just have to get these crazy ideas and experiment, experiment, experiment! I recommend using software synths to get started and if you're smart, you'll try and *[cough]* pirate *[cough]* as many of them as possible. Just to give you an idea, I'll give you my webpage so you can listen to my SECOND called "Trace Sucks." The reason I want you to listen to it is because it is completely sample free and composed only of software synths and editors. Good luck! Mike www.mp3.com/deathofsound Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Bryce Posted January 25, 2001 Share Posted January 25, 2001 Originally posted by DOS: if you're smart, you'll try and *[cough]* pirate *[cough]* as many of them as possible. I'm actually one of those people who's not a real big fan of software piracy. I tend to see it as stealing the work of people who rely upon the revenue that sales of their software is supposed to bring in order that they might be able to continue to develop new even cooler software, and I would greatly appreciate it if it was not encouraged on this forum. Thanks, dB ==> David Bryce Music • Funky Young Monks <== Professional Affiliations: Royer Labs • Music Player Network Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 25, 2001 Share Posted January 25, 2001 Regarding the original subject of this forum, the Cs1/2x, I agree that its implementation can get very confusing.. they tried simplifying some aspects of multi-timbral synths and failed, thus the CS6x is a completely different design. A much better implementation is found on several rack modules, most of which you can get used. I'm partial to the Yamaha MU series, as an owner of an MU90r. It's very easy to understand where all the signals go and how the effects are implemented, as the unit is mostly set up multi-timbral mode, though there is a performance mode too. The LCD is very graphic and very clear, set up kind of like a mixer. There's a lot you can do with it and it's much easier to understand the CS series. The current version of this synth is the MU128 which offers a plug-in slot for Yamaha's excellent synth boards. Other comparable (new) rack modules are: the Emu Proteus 2000 series, Roland's SC-880 and Korg's NS64. For used racks you could look for an Ultraproteus, or a JV-1080/2080. The Roland JV's are at a nice price point right now and provide a pro-level box that's just a touch out of date. It's not quite as easy to use as a Proteus or a Yamaha MU, but many people swear by them. As far as (new) $1,000 keyboards go, there's basically the Roland XP30 which has lots of cool sounds in it and is easier to use than its little brother the XP10, and the Korg N5ex which is also very easy to use and comes with a rebate and some cool software. Its piano is a bit iffy though.. I hope this information helps.. sorry if it's a bit convoluted but there's a lot of info to cover. Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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