Chip McDonald Posted January 27, 2001 Share Posted January 27, 2001 I've got a VS880... Just wondering if there's any obvious simple upgrade I could do to the preamps? Or if I could hard wire around the built in preamps in some way? Roland has sold enough of those things; seems like it might be a cool subject for an article.. or other VS-880 mods... (if there are any..) http://www.mp3.com/chipmcdonald Guitar Lessons in Augusta Georgia: www.chipmcdonald.com Eccentric blog: https://chipmcdonaldblog.blogspot.com/ / "big ass windbag" - Bruce Swedien Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anderton Posted January 27, 2001 Share Posted January 27, 2001 I don't have any mods, but then again, I've never taken a VS-880 apart. Seems that as the preamps are analog, somewhere there's a place where you can disconnect the output and wire in something else. Sounds risky, though, with something that compact. Craig Anderton Educational site: http://www.craiganderton.org Music: http://www.youtube.com/thecraiganderton Twitter: http://www.twitter.com/craig_anderton Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chip McDonald Posted January 28, 2001 Author Share Posted January 28, 2001 Originally posted by Anderton: I've never taken a VS-880 apart. But you're exactly the Exploratory Electronics Project Guy to venture into it! I bet I'm not the only one here that would be interested in such an article... Seems that as the preamps are analog, somewhere there's a place where you can disconnect the output and wire in something else. Sounds risky, though, with something that compact. Well, I figured that much but I don't know if there is any consideration given internally to shielding, or if the preamp section is hard wired onto a board, or (etc..)? You know, the scary intimidating stuff! I can imagine there's a lot of RF flying around inside because of the nature of the unit; I was thinking of trying to wire around a pair of the preamps to a pair of the 1/4" inputs... but I know it's probably going to be some little amp chip soldered into a board, and I don't want to snip a trace indiscriminantly and just run a lead off of it... or do I? I can probably figure out where, but I'm afraid of being bit by some unknown grounding scheme or buffering thingy and ending up with a bunch of noise because I went around something I didn't grasp electronically fully. Or maybe not. I suppose I know I can figure it out but I'm too chicken since it's the only means of portable recording I have at the moment. There *are* pitfalls to basing everything around a computer recording setup... HOWEVER - I still think there are enough owners of the VS series to make it an interesting pursuit, and I get the feeling they're probably pretty ripe for modifications... Oh well, sorry to waste your time. http://www.mp3.com/chipmcdonald Guitar Lessons in Augusta Georgia: www.chipmcdonald.com Eccentric blog: https://chipmcdonaldblog.blogspot.com/ / "big ass windbag" - Bruce Swedien Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anderton Posted January 28, 2001 Share Posted January 28, 2001 >>HOWEVER - I still think there are enough owners of the VS series to make it an interesting pursuit, and I get the feeling they're probably pretty ripe for modifications... Oh well, sorry to waste your time.<< Not a waste of time at all. Remember the people who did ADAT mods to the original black face models? Maybe someone will read this thread and have the basis of a profitable business!! Craig Anderton Educational site: http://www.craiganderton.org Music: http://www.youtube.com/thecraiganderton Twitter: http://www.twitter.com/craig_anderton Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alndln Posted January 28, 2001 Share Posted January 28, 2001 Unless your going to record 8 tracks at once doesn't the 880 have spdif to which you can connect an external mic pre? "A Robot Playing Trumpet Blows" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chip McDonald Posted January 28, 2001 Author Share Posted January 28, 2001 Originally posted by Alndln@hotmail.com: Unless your going to record 8 tracks at once doesn't the 880 have spdif to which you can connect an external mic pre? Yeah - I take advantage of that to get stuff off of it into my computer, BUT... I'd prefer to not have to invest in a pre with SP/DIF out for the sake of that. Although eventually something really nice like the Apogee Rosetta with something in front of it would be cool, but that's too $$$$ for me at the moment (which will unfortunately be a "long moment of a yet-to-be determined length"...). I briefly considered the DBX 386 because of that but things I've heard done with it are pretty harsh - my next big (relatively speaking) purchase needs to be a Decent All Around pre, excluding concessions to SP/DIF (I'm thinking along the lines of the cheapo Grace, or if I can reach high enough maybe an API module (even further off... ahhhg. Yes, the aristocrats may go ahead and chuckle). I'm sort of in the "Ramen Noodles budgeting" mode. Good thought, though. http://www.mp3.com/chipmcdonald Guitar Lessons in Augusta Georgia: www.chipmcdonald.com Eccentric blog: https://chipmcdonaldblog.blogspot.com/ / "big ass windbag" - Bruce Swedien Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wormhole Posted January 28, 2001 Share Posted January 28, 2001 Yeah i'd love to see a mod on the VS series to get around the preamps. I have a 1680 and would love to bypass them. How could one obtain a schematic to see what chip is in there? Would be interesting to at least know what pin was what and then try and figure it on paper or in a pspice simulation. Maybe David has some input on this topic? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max Ventura Posted January 28, 2001 Share Posted January 28, 2001 I have a 1680 and the best way to bypass its pres is to go in at line level from an external pre. That's all. Even digitally, if your ext pre has that output. On the other hand, though, what is the urgency for doin' that? I mean, it might be a wiser idea to upgrade your whole recording device than spend money to embellish it... This message has been edited by argomax on 01-28-2001 at 03:37 PM Max Ventura, Italy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chip McDonald Posted January 29, 2001 Author Share Posted January 29, 2001 Originally posted by argomax: On the other hand, though, what is the urgency for doin' that? I mean, it might be a wiser idea to upgrade your whole recording device than spend money to embellish it... *My* urgency is A) I already possess the device B) I'm about to get into a process of a project involving location recording a bunch of different drummers, and tearing down my non-roadworthy computer based setup on a regular basis isn't exactly a practical option C) and it seems like it would be a fairly easy and painless thing to go around the VS preamps. I *could* spring for a small DA-38 setup - but I would have to get a converter to get it into my SP/DIF'ed computer - or buy another piece... also I would have to have a small board to allow for monitoring, since I'm using the VS's internal mixer to provide a click/backing track for the drummers to play to... which would cost even more. I don't have enough to do that right now, and the opportunity to work with some good drummers has fallen in my lap suddenly and I want to hear it happen - even if it's not anywhere near "optimum". However - I'd prefer it to be as close to an "apology-free" level of quality as possible, soooo.... The preamps in the VS are weird.... To get a maximum level in the machine, you have to run it way too hot (in my opinion). They run out of headroom before you hit 0 db (it sounds murky well before that). Turning the input all the way down doesn't work, because you still have to nearly clip the frontend to get any level on the machine (I assume Roland did this to prevent any possible measurement of accidental digital overs in tests???)(or is the converters so touchy that you may possibly fry them with the slightest overload?). If I run through my Gina using SP/DIF it's entirely different, tons more headroom, more open, etc.. But like I said, my computer isn't going to handle being torn down that many times.... Not only that, but I'm kind being given handouts by these drummers: dicking around with setting up a computer is kind of counter productive in this situation... I'm trying to take advantage of making it as casual as possible for these guys for maximum feel and "charity". Drummer A might say "hey, I'll be back from Brazil on such and such date, I'll have about 2 hours"... I'd rather be up and running with the VS in 10 minutes than 25 minutes with the computer, in and out bringing parts in, and then waiting for it to boot, fooling with the mouse, etc.. time critical sort of thing, an extra 15 minutes checking mic placement is probably a better move. A small DA38 setup would be cool, but unless someone wants to trade for a VS880EX Signed, Mr. I.M. Poor http://www.mp3.com/chipmcdonald Guitar Lessons in Augusta Georgia: www.chipmcdonald.com Eccentric blog: https://chipmcdonaldblog.blogspot.com/ / "big ass windbag" - Bruce Swedien Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wormhole Posted January 29, 2001 Share Posted January 29, 2001 I hear ya Chip and the real point is why get something else when you can make what you have work. i like my 1680 but the preamps in it are shit. I hate these things but hey I won this thing in a contest and have more wants than means. So i am trying to find a way to jump the pre and just do it out board. hell my Mackie pres sound better than these things. Turning it down is pointless since if you're not using them then why go through the circuitry. Wouled love it if Roland had some kind of support email but haven't found one yet. Really just need to know the output voltage or part number of that chip. I posted a link to this on Davds forum so maybe he'll help out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
virtual.rayprodigy.net Posted January 29, 2001 Share Posted January 29, 2001 If you can live with doing 2 tracks at a time max,I've found the M Audio Flying Calf 24 bit A/D converter to be a noticeable improvement for a small investment.I've got a VS880EX and I just plug my mic pre/guitar pre into it and go into the VS via S/PDIF and set the VS's clock to "DigIN 1" and it works great. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hiraga8whotmail.com Posted January 29, 2001 Share Posted January 29, 2001 Greetings.. I have complete modification plans for the Roland VS1680. You can also use the mod plans as a guideline for upgrading the VS880. If you have any other questions regarding the circuits of the VS1680, I can answer those too. Drop me a note, of@dltaps.dk, and I'll send you my DIY manual. Kindest regards Ole Frost Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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