Ross Brown Posted July 25, 2006 Share Posted July 25, 2006 We had our first rehearsal on Saturday night. It consisted of me and two guitarists from my previous band. We are auditioning a drummer this weekend that has years of experience and played with our lead guitarist about ten years ago. From what I hear, he sounds like he will fit in well. An interesting thing occurred to me while we were playing on Saturday without a drummer, my role as a bass player is very different when there is no drummer. I felt like I had to back off a little (a lot) or the music became strange and filled with holes. Perhaps I just normally suck but when playing with a drummer, no one (including myself) can notice. I hope not, but I like to keep an open mind. How do you more experienced players adjust your playing with and without a drummer? "When I take a stroll down Jackass Lane it is usually to see someone that is already there" Mrs. Brown Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moot Posted July 25, 2006 Share Posted July 25, 2006 Originally posted by Ross Brown: How do you more experienced players adjust your playing with and without a drummer? I absolutly loath playing without a drummer and vill avoid it at all costs. I find myself plunking the root note rather than "playing" andI can stand about 10 minutes of it. With the drummer though? As a 3 piece it's my job to lock in with him and at the same time compliment the guitarist. Our drummer is a monster BTW so I love the interaction. If he does a roll or pulls off some weird fill I am right there for the most part and it is a huge challenge. What could replace that? Now if your talking about acoustic stuff around a campfire with some frosty ones? Ya know, the kind where by the end of the night you're singing and laughing too loud and trying to fathom where all the beer went? Well, of course that's different. "He is to music what Stevie Wonder is to photography." getz76 I have nothing nice to say so . . . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ross Brown Posted July 25, 2006 Author Share Posted July 25, 2006 No acoustic stuff. Laughing is good, though. "When I take a stroll down Jackass Lane it is usually to see someone that is already there" Mrs. Brown Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ross Brown Posted July 25, 2006 Author Share Posted July 25, 2006 Back in the early 80s I played in a band with no drummer. That was fun, but too long ago to remember and hopefully I am better now. I didn't really like playing without a drummer Saturday. "When I take a stroll down Jackass Lane it is usually to see someone that is already there" Mrs. Brown Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wraub Posted July 25, 2006 Share Posted July 25, 2006 Two things occurred to me reading this thread: What I play is usually dictated by the song. If I have a part written for the song, it's usually a pretty supportive part, and I will usually play the same part with or without a drummer present. Unless, of sourse, one of the remaining players needs more of a time underpinning than my part gives them, and then I can adapt. But I try to serve the song first. That said, I find that I play differently, to some extent, with every drummer I work. It's a conversation, right? Things sometimes just get said the same in different ways. Peace, wraub I'm a lot more like I am now than I was when I got here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tnb Posted July 25, 2006 Share Posted July 25, 2006 What Wraub said. Wait a minute. I take that back. I play even simpler lines with no drummer. Why play a bunch of cute stuff that would only make the job hard to the people who feel that it isn't their job to keep time anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ross Brown Posted July 25, 2006 Author Share Posted July 25, 2006 Yep, my lines were definately simpler without a drummer. "When I take a stroll down Jackass Lane it is usually to see someone that is already there" Mrs. Brown Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danthaman Posted July 25, 2006 Share Posted July 25, 2006 Makes sense doesn't it? As a bassplayer you in fact ad a layer over the beats of a drummer, like the icing on a cake! What is icing without a cake? So if a drummer lacks you have lay down more of a cake yourself. Do i make any sense?... Coffee? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexclaber Posted July 25, 2006 Share Posted July 25, 2006 Playing without a drummer would be fine if the rest of the band could keep time without one. Unfortunately that is rarely the case! Alex Barefaced Ltd - ultra lightweight, high ouput, toneful bass cabs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moot Posted July 25, 2006 Share Posted July 25, 2006 Originally posted by tnb: What Wraub said. Wait a minute. I take that back. I play even simpler lines with no drummer. Why play a bunch of cute stuff that would only make the job hard to the people who feel that it isn't their job to keep time anyway. Yep - what I'm sayin'. Plunkin' on the root note "He is to music what Stevie Wonder is to photography." getz76 I have nothing nice to say so . . . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
picker Posted July 25, 2006 Share Posted July 25, 2006 You might suck, but I doubt it, really. Changing the instrumentation in any band is gonna necessarily change the way the remaining instruments sound and play together. If you hear holes where the drummer used to be, that's a good thing. It means that you normally leave space for him to play in. Nothing is worse to my ear than a band where everybody just flails away without any regard what the others are playing, and everyone is just playing wall-to-wall. A little space, some dynamics, these thing add class to music. IT sounds ro me like you are doing things the way you should to work with a drummer. Always remember that you are unique. Just like everyone else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fred TBP Posted July 25, 2006 Share Posted July 25, 2006 Playing reggae-based parts is interesting when there's no drummer around. You not only get to check your own sense of timing but you find out if the others really know the song or are just floating through it waiting for their solo moments. I would say the foot-tapping helps, but I've known people who can't even foot-tap in time, which is such a shame. I'm afraid "all of God's children got rhythm" has its exceptions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moot Posted July 25, 2006 Share Posted July 25, 2006 Originally posted by Ross Brown: Perhaps I just normally suck but when playing with a drummer, no one (including myself) can notice. I hope not, but I like to keep an open mind. At a recent recording session They isolated my bass track for EQing and boy howdy, it was painful. A virtual suck-o-rama no open mind could ever help. All I could do was shake my head - but bring up even the drums and I totally rock! "He is to music what Stevie Wonder is to photography." getz76 I have nothing nice to say so . . . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ross Brown Posted July 25, 2006 Author Share Posted July 25, 2006 Originally posted by mattulator: Originally posted by Ross Brown: Perhaps I just normally suck but when playing with a drummer, no one (including myself) can notice. I hope not, but I like to keep an open mind. At a recent recording session They isolated my bass track for EQing and boy howdy, it was painful. A virtual suck-o-rama no open mind could ever help. All I could do was shake my head - but bring up even the drums and I totally rock! This is one of my fears of heading to the studio. Everyone will hear my sucking outloud all by myself. No hiding. I am glad to hear your experience, makes me feel better. I laughed outloud at my computer screen. Now I am a wierdo too. "When I take a stroll down Jackass Lane it is usually to see someone that is already there" Mrs. Brown Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EddiePlaysBass Posted July 25, 2006 Share Posted July 25, 2006 Originally posted by Danthaman: Makes sense doesn't it? As a bassplayer you in fact ad a layer over the beats of a drummer, like the icing on a cake! What is icing without a cake? So if a drummer lacks you have lay down more of a cake yourself. Do i make any sense?... Nope, but I sure could go for a piece of cake ... "I'm a work in progress." Micky Barnes The Ross Brown Shirt World Tour Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aldena Posted July 25, 2006 Share Posted July 25, 2006 Originally posted by EddiePlaysBass: Originally posted by Danthaman: Makes sense doesn't it? As a bassplayer you in fact ad a layer over the beats of a drummer, like the icing on a cake! What is icing without a cake? So if a drummer lacks you have lay down more of a cake yourself. Do i make any sense?... Nope, but I sure could go for a piece of cake ... As long as it's good cake. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EddiePlaysBass Posted July 25, 2006 Share Posted July 25, 2006 Originally posted by Aldena: As long as it's good cake. With icing on top "I'm a work in progress." Micky Barnes The Ross Brown Shirt World Tour Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmrunning3 Posted July 25, 2006 Share Posted July 25, 2006 I'm an icing junkie. Keep the cake...MmmMmmm -- Joe -- "If you think you're too old, then you are." --Lemmy Kilmister "I have not seen a man who is not god already." --Austin Osman Spare Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shandobass Posted July 25, 2006 Share Posted July 25, 2006 The only person in the band you can rely on for time is yourself. It is a lot easier with the support of you band members, but half the time you cannot rely on the drummer. Just stare them down and remind them why you are there (pulse, groove, time, etc.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bruiser_dup2 Posted July 26, 2006 Share Posted July 26, 2006 I had a REALLY GOOD piece of cake today-- it was the project manager's birthday, and somebody brought in a carrot cake with pineapple in it, and cream cheese icing. Hmmm. . . Oh, yeah, playing without a drummer-- my current lineup has no drummer, because I got fed up with drummers. Just acoustic guitar, ABG, and vocals. I like it. It forces me to play a bit more rhythmically, to keep the groove moving. And it allows us to be a bit more subtle with the dynamics. We can actually play quietly, if we want. What a novel idea! Ed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeremy c Posted July 26, 2006 Share Posted July 26, 2006 I enjoy playing without a drummer and I enjoy playing with a good drummer. I don't enjoy playing with a not-so-good drummer. One combination that I often play in is guitar-bass-flute. It's great. I get to be a timekeeper,a soloist, and an accompanist. I am fortunate in that I rarely have to play with people who don't have good time. Free download of my cd!. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bottomgottem Posted July 26, 2006 Share Posted July 26, 2006 I play more than half my gigs without a drummer. Love it. LOVE IT! There is just me and a guitarist/vocalist. We used to have a drummer. He was what I would call a "busy" player, which was fine because the guitarist and I knew when to play hot and when to back off. He left a few months ago to seek his fortune in Nashville and we have yet to put much effort into replacing him. We're having too good of a time exploring this new line-up. Like I said, the guitarist and I work pretty well together. I try to fill in a little more without a drummer, so I'm a little busier. That is unless the guitar part is very intricate and the attention needs to be focused there. Or the vocals are the main focus. And the guitar solo, if there is one, is definitely the time to lay back. But overall, I think that you have to work a little harder to fill in the gaps if you are working without percussion. Just take care not to be obnoxious about it. And you had better have dead-on, perfect time (which is something I have to work on constantly.) My whole trick is to keep the tune well out in front. If I play Tchaikovsky, I play his melodies and skip his spiritual struggle. ~Liberace Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davo-London Posted July 26, 2006 Share Posted July 26, 2006 When we play without a drummer, my bass playing changes. it's a more difficult role. On slower tracks, which are often the hardest, I try to give aural clues to the singers to keep time. This equates to playing 4th or 4 1/2 beat sometimes a semitone below the next bar's chord root note. Davo "We will make you bob your head whether you want to or not". - David Sisk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jcadmus Posted July 26, 2006 Share Posted July 26, 2006 I absolutely hate playing without a drummer. For me, it's like hitting a tennis ball against a wall -- without the wall. "Tours widely in the southwestern tip of Kentucky" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moe Monsarrat Posted July 26, 2006 Share Posted July 26, 2006 I agree with Davo. It changes the way I play. I have to be much more assertive & more militant about the time. Superfilous fills are discarded because the role of the bass changes. You (& I) may not enjoy it as much as playing with a drummer, but playing without drums will make you a much better bassist. I am the lead singer & bassist for two bands. One is original C&W(Stop The Truck) The other is a roots reggae band(The Mau Mau Chaplains). The members for both bands are the same. Sometimes we get hired to play small parties or places where drums are inappropriate. You wanna try something hard to do? Try singing lead while playing a contrasting melodic bass line that has nothing to do with the non-existant bass drum beat. Thank God for the rhythym guitarist. Mine is an absolute rock. Without him I'd be in real trouble. As for soloing up your studio bass tracks,it's another learning tool.I used to just sit in dispair over the string noises & timing errors & sloppiness. It made me get better because it was embarassing to listen to. If you think that sucks, wait till they solo up your vocal tracks. "Shoot low, most of 'em are ridin' ponies" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ross Brown Posted July 26, 2006 Author Share Posted July 26, 2006 For fun, Last night I tried playing bass lines while my wife sang "I shot the Sherrif" and "Hotel California". Just me and her. It was a really cool exercise for the both of us. I like having a drummer, I like have the rest of the band. "When I take a stroll down Jackass Lane it is usually to see someone that is already there" Mrs. Brown Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salvador Posted July 26, 2006 Share Posted July 26, 2006 I play with a conga player and a guiro player instead of a drummer, and it's a completely different game, but they are very good at it( by the way, the conga player is only 10)and what works best is playing the groove. When they are not around,it's me and the guitar player, and I still play the groove, but I found that playing in a high register in those cases sounds better, since I am playing within the range of the guitar, and since he plays mostly rythm, it fits well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danthaman Posted July 26, 2006 Share Posted July 26, 2006 Originally posted by jcadmus: For me, it's like hitting a tennis ball against a wall -- without the wall. That's deep.... Coffee? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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