More frets and/or more strings (and other things) -- the world of extended range bass

[g.]

Dee Arggh!

 

Check out the [triple course] Vox Humana Eighteen:

http://www.12stringbass.net/custom4x2.jpghttp://www.12stringbass.net/18x1.jpg

 

Now, that headstock alone is worthy of a doctorate! ; } - It's good to see people taking old themes to new places : }

[g.]

Dee Argh UU { ; }

 

Also check out Al Caldwell's Be-You-tiful single-cut chambered Nine, from Benavante:

 

http://www.thelowend.net/gallery/images/benavente/al/ben%20soul.jpg

 

Multiple pictures of every aspect during and after construction at THE LOW END - as well as more of Al, and some great MP3s of Al's BLACK HILLBILLY BAND etc etc.

[wraub]

Greenie, that Benevente is just stunning, and I don't even like singlecuts.

Dig the bookmatched fingerboard...

That Modulus looks both inviting and daunting.

Walnut?

 

Peace,

 

wraub

[g.]

wraaub, looks like I misattributed the bass. I was doing a poor job of reconnoitering 12stringbass.net at http://12stringbass.net/master.htm?http://12stringbass.net/custom15.htm {must have stared too hard at the "12 String Bass After Hours" section ; }

 

Anyway, I think the bass is from Vox Humana in the Netherlands . But after seeing their atrociaous website layout I gave up on looking for more detailed information. Someone needs to train a webmaster!

[Fred TBP]

A different point of view...

 

In the past year I've been more concerned with writing lines that weave between counterpoint and melody. I found the 5 much more comfortable (I also do 4, 6, and 8) in writing, especially on fretless.

 

The other reasoning has to do with my carpal tunnel surgery about 8 years ago. I found the Korean 6s (Ibanez, Hohner, Washburn) more comfortable in my hand and it allowed me to voice chords across 3-4 strings without undue left hand stress. Onstage I like playing 6 when I expect to do chord and extended soloing. But I've done well enough on 5s.

 

As for the others: 8 is simply 4 root/4 octave, so it's like playing 4 string. A 12 (4 root/8 octave strings) gets hard to EQ properly because you can't separate the octaves. 7 is nice if you plan to cross over octaves a lot, but if I were going to do that I'd play guitar. I bought a straight-8 (with a low F#) Galveston and went through frustration trying to get the F# to voice properly, and all I got was percussion plus some left hand cramps. So these just don't work for me.

 

My preferences for 5s and 6s address that I think of myself more as a songwriter or a support player rather than a straight soloist. I've seriously considered the synth option, but it's a bit out of my price range at the moment.

 

My best analogy is with preferences in autos. Some people need to go 7-25 MPH over the speed limit, but that involves a focused level of control behind the wheel to keep from cracking up. The rest of us do fine with occasional bursts over the speed limit because we just leave earlier or show up later at our destination.

 

Perhaps I'll change my mind once I go synth...

[g.]

Sheesh, Al Caldwell has some good examples of the "bass and guitar all on a single neck" approach to his incredible Benavante instrument in those mostly scratch-track mp3! Notice he uses separate pickup for the upper strings (I'm betting this feeds a guitar rig while the other pickups feed an Accugroove setup). I really get off on NIGHTCAP especially; I think Al has a real idea about what Jaco can mean to a ERBer today!

 

It's apparent he's got some great bass skillz, some great jazz guitar comping and solo skills (I can sure hear the chambering on that jazz big box stuff!), some great electric guitar shredding (all from that ONE INSTRUMENT!)... and I'm growing fond of his TRAVELLING BLACK HILLBILLIES website too. Check out that picture of Bootsy in the HONORARY HILLBILLIES section, wearing Axisboldaslove rags. Awesome!

 

I think Al is IT!

 

EDIT: On the Jaco thing, he's got the connection there on No Punks too. Frantic ; }

[g.]

Fred, essentially the same reason I avoid wide spacing.

[...]

Those are some fine-looking fishes, for sure.

 

Nice to see you around again, brother.

[g.]

Shalini Chatterjee Interview

 

http://12stringbass.net/shalini7x.jpg

[g.]

Wow, found this Carruthers 8 string headless on the Schroeder Cabinets USED page .

 

http://www.schroedercabinets.com/images/forsale/CARRUTHERSFRONTCLOSE.jpg

 

Too bad the picture itself isn't so good (though better than the typical Wish-bass-with-a-Mexican-poncho pic). The bass itself could really be cool. J pickups used like P (though I'm wondering about the overlap in the middle strings - lots of potential for phase difference affecting the tone of those strings). Headless! - That solves one of the problems for ERB right there - balancing the weight.

[alexclaber]

Originally posted by   :

Headless! - That solves one of the problems for ERB right there - balancing the weight.

Interesting - they've used a pair of Steinberger bridges with the inner edge cut off each one. Cunning...

 

Alex

[g.]

Looks like the spacing is 19 mm too - which makes for an incredibly wide neck when there are that many strings.

[g.]

http://12stringbass.net/Adam4x.jpg

Cool article on converting an OLP MM 5-string into a 12-string .

 

http://12stringbass.net/hammer5x.jpg

 

Also, a well-written review on what must be a very good 10-string bass indeed, the Dean Edge HAMMER .

[_Sweet Willie_]

That OLP is definitely sah-weet. Diggin' it, diggin' it, and diggin' it well.

 

Peace.

--SW

[g.]

Conklin.

 

http://www.luthiersaccessgroup.com/images/instock/conklin_fullfront.jpg

http://www.luthiersaccessgroup.com/images/instock/conklin_front.jpg

http://www.luthiersaccessgroup.com/images/instock/conklin_back.jpg

[g.]

That's a semi-hollow chambered bass by the way - not one that's been left outdoors, exposed to woodpeckers.

[knuckle_head]

Is the lower bout on that Conklin an open chamber as well?

 

Great idea, putting the resonator holes on the back of the horn!

[g.]

Hey, K_H, don't think so - not much room for one with all the electronics, unless it crosses over under the strings and is faily small one in the lower horn - which would be a possibility...

[g.]

Luthier Siggi Abramzik 's latest tap-style extended range bass/guitar:

 

http://www.tapguitar.com/miscpix/siggi17string.jpg

http://www.tapguitar.com/miscpix/siggi17stringhead.jpg

 

This was commissioned by apparently very experienced touch-style player Wolfgang Daiss and I think it's still currently tuned with a LOW B string in the center, with mirror-image fourths tuning radiating outwards in both directions.

 

http://www.tapguitar.com/pics2003/9560wolfie.jpg

 

Maybe that's one to lust after, zedniner ; } - I'm kinda thinking the Wolfgang music could be crazy involved too...

[alexclaber]

Originally posted by   :

Conklin.

I can see myself playing one of these in the future!

 

Originally posted by :

Luthier Siggi Abramzik 's latest tap-style extended range bass/guitar

But this really makes my head hurt! I suppose if you're tapping it's not as confusing as trying to get both hands working together for conventional fingerstyle, but still...

 

Alex

[alexclaber]

Originally posted by Sweet Willie:

Yo C-Phunk!

 

Can you try some nice ones built on your side of the proverbial pond?

My exposure to many-stringed-basses has unfortunately been rather limited. So far I've tried Modulus, Ken Smith, Fodera, Alembic, Yamaha and Hohner sixes, which is a rather unimpressive list. They're so hard to find here... I've been to Martin Petersen's place in Camden and spent a good few hours in bass heaven but I didn't try any Sei basses IIRC. The most recent fancy bit of luthiery I've test driven was a 4-string GB bass - nice feel and totally crazy onboard electronics:

 

http://www.druidmedia.co.uk/gbguitars4/images/electronics.jpg

 

I've never played a bass that can warp its personality to such an extent with the twist of a few knobs. Not my bag though - a bit too pretty jazz-funk. Tried it through an EBS rig which was ok but rather lacking in bottom - not as bad as the Markbass combo I tried recently though which was awful! I won't believe a word Bass Player writes having read their positive review. Way less bottom than the EBS, harsh top and a distinct lack of oomph. D- Must try harder...

 

Alex

 

P.S. I'm normally easily satisfied with bass rigs - the Hartke 3500 into old skool 2x12" that I tried the Hohner 6 through sounded way better than that Markbass and at a fraction of the cost.

[Tim Skelly Cason]

I have built several basses in my life and completely understand what you mean. The trade-off for extended range basses create wider necks thus heavier and less ballanced. My solution has been to extend the top 'horn' on the body to offset the weight of the neck.

 

This problem is also compounded by the type of woods used for necks. The more dense woods are most often of the heavier variety but create smooth, warm tone and sustain.

 

As you will see by the image below, the best design I've come up with for the extended range is the 12 string. Different from the original 12 design of the 60's, where you have E A D G, in multiples of 3, (2 higher octaves and 1 lower) this 12 is E A D G B E, and tuned as a 12 string guitar would be, rather an octave lower.

 

This obviously doesn't extend lower, only higher, but the effect is exactly like that of a 12 string guitar vs. a 6 string guitar, VERY full and warm. Not recommeded for power rock or punk, but excellent for smooth jazz, soft pop etc.

I'm a heavy player by instinct, but the design of the 12 string is a welcome change.

 

You can check out my other basses on my site if you wish.

Thanks.

Tim Skelly Cason

 

http://crippleneedcane.com/12Str.jpg

[g.]

Hey TSC,

 

I think I'd probably like your bass(es), but youre website needs better and more pictures and less gimmicks. Just show me da stuff and not a lot of mouseover sound effects. It's about the bass, yes no?

[hags2k]

TSC,

 

That's a pretty wicked looking instrument. Have any samples featuring it? I'd love to hear how it sounds!

[Tim Skelly Cason]

Actually the site is not jsut about the basses, but I'm workin' on one that is, or at least a part of that site that's simpler.

 

I just started using Flash and built the site about 6 months ago. There's lot of extras stuff because I was experimenting.

 

For hags2k, I'm going to be posting some 12 string tracks in about 6 weeks. I'm "in the studio" (my living room) now creating some new stuff. I'll post when it's ready.

Thanks.

TSC

[Nicklab]

So I went to Scam Cash yesterday to find some sheet music for this session I'm playing next weekend. I find the music I'm looking for, so I decide to check out the basses. What do they have? A 12 string bass for $400. Egad, the G.A.S. pains!

[getz out]

Good basses for cheap... I wish it was like that when I started!

 

Hey Nick, what type of session you playing?

[Nicklab]

Playing a rock version of a jazz standard, some pizz style electric upright on another cut, and some bowed bass on the third track. It should be cool.

[bassarama19]

check this out, guitar extending into a bass range with a longer scale length and fanned frets. And some absolute wankery.

 

http://www.rustycooley.com/videos/RustySolo8-1.wmv

[g.]

Haven't checked out Rusty Cooley's gear list yet. But the dual scale doesn't look like it's longer component is even past standard baritone guitar length. And tonally he is NOT playing bass - even the few times he hits a lower string I think it's pretty obvious that he is in guitar range with guitar tonal characteristics, via amp/rig and string choice.