rhrocker Posted May 23, 2002 Share Posted May 23, 2002 Guys, being a woodworker by trade, and having some beautiful burled mesquite, I'm wanting to build a bass (but would rather buy a pre-built neck). Have any of you done this? I realize that there is at least one other forum that covers construction, but you guys (and gals) are more like family and I like hearing your input. I thought it would be fun to post pictures during the building process. I'd be interested in a quality parts list and source, plus where to get a diagram for the body routing, etc. I'm wanting to make a 4-string active, and would like to use good quality parts. just makin dem wood chips hea in South Texas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fonz Posted May 23, 2002 Share Posted May 23, 2002 i am currently in the process of putting together a few prototypes for a business i plan on starting. the one thing you will notice fairly quickly is that the $4000 some people charge is not justified. you say you've been a woodworker for some time. if that's the cas, don't bother with a pre made neck. it's way too easy for someone with a little experience, a bandsaw and a bastard cut to do and the satisfaction you get out of looking at that perfect neck is more than worth the half hour or so it's going to take you. parts? it's all about http://www.fatdawg.com this is some crazy cat in san francisco who just has tons of crap lying around in plastic tubs. shipping is cheap via fedex ground, but they only ship once a week or so. they're very loosely organized, but they get the job done and couldn't be friendlier. pretty much anything you need will be there and if they don't have it they advertise that they can order anything from any catalog for 25% over wholesale. other than that it's lumber and i'm sure you know where to get that. for fingerboard material look into some granadillo at http://www.smartwoods.com . it's gobs cheaper than ebony, much prettier and a fantastic tone wood. it doesn't plane the best as it's so hard and has a blister figure, but if you leave it thick and sand it down it's very much worth it. i used a scraper for edge work and it scraped off like chocolate. just make sure you lay out for your neck properly, ala alowing for the saw kerf if you plan on laminating, but i'm sure you know that. for a one piece just try to get the closest to quartersawn as you can. a mesquite bass, eh? will that work? i'm pretty interested. be sure to keep us posted. Eeeeeehhhhhhhhh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mro Posted May 23, 2002 Share Posted May 23, 2002 You could try www.warmoth.com. They have several necks to choose from,if you like the Fender look. They have all the parts too. Carvin will sell you active controls, as well as their neck. They are less expensive but not necessarily less in quality. Good luck and have fun.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ERIC31 Posted May 23, 2002 Share Posted May 23, 2002 FATDAWG.COM is definitely a great place. His shop is called SUBWAY GUITARS and it is the coolest place you'll ever go to. Great service from people that are pros (without a "pro" attitude). Lots of cool stuff in their shop and they are always willing to talk guitars and basses all day long. They have tweaked, fixed, and setup my basses over the years and the service was top notch. I really can't say enough about these guys. The prices are WAY lower than all of those big places (Guitar Center anyone?). SKATE AND DESTROY www.concretedisciples.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fonz Posted May 24, 2002 Share Posted May 24, 2002 Originally posted by mro: Carvin will sell you active controls, as well as their neck. They are less expensive but not necessarily less in quality. another reason to never buy a neck is the price. a premade neck from carvin is $170 plus shipping. everything on it will cost you $20 at a lumberyard. is a half hour of your time worth $150? mine is. Eeeeeehhhhhhhhh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tarsia Posted May 24, 2002 Share Posted May 24, 2002 Originally posted by Bastid E: ]another reason to never buy a neck is the price. a premade neck from carvin is $170 plus shipping. everything on it will cost you $20 at a lumberyard. is a half hour of your time worth $150? mine is.[/QB]Sorry to disagree Bastid, but how do you figure 1/2 an hour? counting installing trussrod, oh yeah how about cutting & carving the neck shape ?, laying up fret positions on fingerboard, cutting and pressing in frets & any inlay ( side markers or fretboard dots ) plus laying out and machining tuner locations & nut , final sanding and finishing etc... IMHO the neck is the most precise and unforgiving part on an electric bass, I would figure at least ummm maybe 12 - 16 hrs. for a novice to create an adequate neck from raw lumber & thats with all the right tools to do so ! Any other opinions out there ? I would Definetly side with buying a pre-fab neck, you can also get them with a blank style headstock to create your own signature look. again just my opinion. I'm Todbass62 on MySpace Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fonz Posted May 24, 2002 Share Posted May 24, 2002 they guy who started this thread said he was a woodworker by trade, so i'm assuming he'll work faster than a novice. even so, 16 hours is a long time. i must admit when i started i was a whole bunch concerned with how the necks would turn out, but they are actually the easiest part of the whole job. i'm even making assymetrical necks for added comfort. okay, so a half an hour is optimistic for a one off, but in a procuction run, if your routing jigs are already made, it's a pretty quick job. even with making a jig to rout the truss rod channel, fretting, everything, it shouldn't take more than two or three hours if you have your methods of work established and stick to it. i was finished in no time at all and the neck is the best part of the work i'm doing so far. i still think it's rediculous to pay that much for a finished neck. sure it saves you time and effort, but why bother building if that's the rout you want to take? besides when you realize what the cost is (and i was pricing for the average joe buying a couple of bf at a time from the local lumberyard, not the mbf that carvin's undoubtedly buying in from a mill) and the labor involved in a huge manufacturing process that they have, $170 is really steep. honestly, it's a lot easier than you think. besides, when you consider it's only going to cost you $20 or so (less than a set of strings), why not give it a try? some peices of advice, work metric for the fingerboard. it's muuuuch easier. do ALL your routing before you start cutting for shape and taper otherwise it's a real bitch to keep things straight and it'll kill the clock setting up your guides and jigs. if it's a neck through, do all the bandsaw work prior to glue-up, and the rasp work after. pros probably know all this, but just the same... Eeeeeehhhhhhhhh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tarsia Posted May 24, 2002 Share Posted May 24, 2002 I'm Def. not a Pro, but I do work with N.C. machines daily ( not in Guitar manuf. ), I assumed we were talking about a average woodworker as in cabinet maker/carpenter without the jigs needed and experience to "Whip a neck out" I guess if Fender would let me use their shop & equipment/ N.C. programs etc... I might cut the time (16 hrs.) by more than half! I've built or should I say rebuild a few basses in my time and the finishing alone, if done correctly takes many hours alone much less adding hardware. the last bass body I did a refinish on took me over a week at 1-2 hrs. a night! it came out great ! (Lake placid blue on a P-bass ) I remember sanding, filling, sanding, spraying, sanding - LOL !!! Seriously if you can pop out a quality standard Fender style fretted rosewood neck finished and ready for hardware for under $100 let us know ! I could use a replacement neck ( fretless, so even cheaper right?) for my five string Jazz bass. Cheers ! I'm Todbass62 on MySpace Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fonz Posted May 24, 2002 Share Posted May 24, 2002 the only thing that would bring that anywhere close to $100 would be the rosewood. and i don't use rosewood. i think the granadillo is a far superior wood anyway. it looks, feels, sounds and responds better. as far as i know modulus is the only other maker using it. the lumber for that should cost around $25-$30. a set of gotohs would run you almost $30. the nut is another $1.50. if i were to charge $100 for that, i'd turn a nice profit. enough to make it worthwhile if i had a few to pump out at any rate. one at a time, not so much. two or three and i'm down. Eeeeeehhhhhhhhh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rhrocker Posted May 29, 2002 Author Share Posted May 29, 2002 Fatdawg and Warmoth look good. Lots of parts there at those sites. Have also been checking into Stewmac and Alparts. Starting to get a list of stuff together. Trying to find a template for the body. I think I better use a pre-built neck on my first attempt, but will experiment some for the next one. Thanks for the input guys! Robert just makin dem wood chips hea in South Texas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fonz Posted May 29, 2002 Share Posted May 29, 2002 not to beat a dead horse, but why not build your own neck first, and if it doesn't work out buy a pre-fab. the only hitch would be if it were neck through. for further personal satisfaction, why not design the whole thing yourself, including the body. stew mac is good for stuff you can't find anywhere else. the only problem is they know you can't find a lot of that stuff anywhere else and you pay through the nose for it, especially tools. i will say if you see something that's not in your tool chest in the stew mac catalog that you need, price it at the local hardware first, as it will probably be 25% cheaper if they have it. but their shipping is fast and their service is outstanding. okay, enough of me being a purist jerk. have fun and let us know how it turns out. Eeeeeehhhhhhhhh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turkish Posted May 29, 2002 Share Posted May 29, 2002 one day i was dood;ing on a piece of paper and i wrote down 1-20 down the side and eadg on the top and proceded to write all the notes down on the finger board and i thought chouldn't a guitar be tuned EADGCF instead of EADGBE, if you're going up perfect fourths wouldn't that make more sense? if you can't cut it on four, don't touch five Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KikkyMonk Posted May 29, 2002 Share Posted May 29, 2002 but then barre chords would be oh so hard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rhrocker Posted May 29, 2002 Author Share Posted May 29, 2002 Now dang-it Bastid E, just when I get my mind made up, you get me thinking about going another direction all over again Do you have any info on a source for the exact measurments of the fingerboard itself, and of course the fret spacing? If I go this route I'll use a through neck, probably maple? just makin dem wood chips hea in South Texas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fonz Posted May 29, 2002 Share Posted May 29, 2002 ha ha ha! sorry man. it does sound like a lot more fun to do the whole damn thing yourself, doesn't it? trust me, you'll be a lot happier with the results. plus you can impress your friends with "nope, did everything myself." we do have our limitations though. someone once told me "you didn't build it youself unless you wound your own pickups." anyway fret spacing depends on scale. the constant is 17.817. to find the distance to the next fret divide the remaining distance by 17.817. for example, on a 34" scale instrument the distance from the nut to the first fret would be 34"/17.817 which is 1.908" this leaves you with 32.192" which youagain divide by 17.817 to get 1.801" and so on and so on. this where my hint to work metric comes in handy. it's a lot easier to work with decimals when you work metric. if this is all too much math for you, stew mac sells a book called "make your own electric guitar" by melvin hiscock. it's helpful and it has all these measurements worked out for you for the standard scales. best bet? get it at your local library and save yourself the $25. give it a quick read and photocopy the fret distance part. the guitar theory is helpful to read but the majority of it is geared towards people with minimal to no woodshop experiencce making it moot to a pro. Eeeeeehhhhhhhhh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rhrocker Posted May 30, 2002 Author Share Posted May 30, 2002 I'll get that book Bastid E, I need it here in the shop anyway. One thing I'm trying to figure out is what/which electronics to use. I'm wanting active, but don't really care to have 20 knobs all over the place. Maybe I should start a new topic and see what electronics all the guys would buy if they were building from scratch. just makin dem wood chips hea in South Texas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rhrocker Posted June 1, 2002 Author Share Posted June 1, 2002 Just got the book "Building Your Own Electric Guitar" by Melvyn Hiscock. Seems to pretty much cover all the basses (!) Thinking about Seymour Duncans, but don't know which ones, there's lots on the website. Any suggestions? just makin dem wood chips hea in South Texas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
surfjunkie Posted June 1, 2002 Share Posted June 1, 2002 hey Bastid- how much do you charge for a 4-string neck? i need one wager47@hotmail.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
surfjunkie Posted June 1, 2002 Share Posted June 1, 2002 oh, and thanks for the fatdawg tip!!! i've already got a big shopping list going, and it'll way under $200. all my extra bass parts may soon become working basses! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wraub Posted June 2, 2002 Share Posted June 2, 2002 Hey there Wager... wraub here for Bastid E. Questions... What types of woods are you looking for? Scale length? Number of frets (fretless?) Number of strings? You want tuners with that? : ) Just let us know... Peace, wraub "I'm a lot more like I am now than I was when I got here." I'm a lot more like I am now than I was when I got here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill C from Nashvegas Posted June 3, 2002 Share Posted June 3, 2002 OK, let's say I make my own neck, spending let's say 75 bucks for parts and raw materials. Let's assune buying one costs 175, which means building one saves $100. If it takes 20 hrs of my time to order the parts, plan, and make the neck, that means my 20 hrs of time is worth (100/20) = 5 dollars per hr. Even if I can make the thing in 10 hrs, that's only 10 dollars per hour...from an economic point of view, it wouldn't be worth it to me. If I made my own it'd only be for the "I-made-it-myself" enjoyment factor, but that's my own opinion...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fonz Posted June 3, 2002 Share Posted June 3, 2002 yes, very true. if it's going to take you 10-20 hours to make a neck it probably isn't worth your time other than for the enjoyment factor. if you are planning on building a bass to play yourself and to say you did, then that's what you're building it for: enjoyment and satisfaction. if it takes you 10-20 hours to build a neck then you have no business doing it professioinally anyway. Eeeeeehhhhhhhhh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fonz Posted June 3, 2002 Share Posted June 3, 2002 actually, a question. how long has it taken you guys to build necks in the past? here's how time broke down for me to go from a rough slab of log to a finished neck: plaining/jointing: 1/2 hour sawing a blank: 5 min layout: 1/2 hour (being REALLY anal) routing truss rod cavity/cutting fillet: 15 min bandsawing to dimensions: 10 min rasping to basic shape: 1 hour finish sanding: 15 min fret layout/slotting: 45 min cambering fingerboard: 1/2 hour fretting and dressing: 1 hour that's 5 hours. and i can probably shave some time off that once i'm working at it more regularly. 100 bucks for 5 hours of your time? that works out to $20 an hour which i doubt you would turn your nose up at. unless of course you mean waiting for glue to dry, but if you can't find something to do while the glue dries it's going to take you a realy long time to finish everything. anyone on here that's worked with wood beyond plywood and 2x4 should be able to pull this off rather quickly. even if you haven't IT IS NOT THAT DIFFICULT TO FIGURE OUT. most of these tasks are very basic skills that you probably learned in wood shop in high school. if you are thinking about doing this for some spare cash you need to invest the time to make jigs and templates. once you've done that this is a really quick operation when you actually get down to the lumber. Eeeeeehhhhhhhhh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tarsia Posted June 3, 2002 Share Posted June 3, 2002 Originally posted by Bastid E: actually, a question. how long has it taken you guys to build necks in the past? here's how time broke down for me to go from a rough slab of log to a finished neck: plaining/jointing: 1/2 hour sawing a blank: 5 min layout: 1/2 hour (being REALLY anal) routing truss rod cavity/cutting fillet: 15 min bandsawing to dimensions: 10 min rasping to basic shape: 1 hour finish sanding: 15 min fret layout/slotting: 45 min cambering fingerboard: 1/2 hour fretting and dressing: 1 hour that's 5 hours. and i can probably shave some time off that once i'm working at it more regularly. 100 bucks for 5 hours of your time? that works out to $20 an hour which i doubt you would turn your nose up at. unless of course you mean waiting for glue to dry, but if you can't find something to do while the glue dries it's going to take you a realy long time to finish everything. anyone on here that's worked with wood beyond plywood and 2x4 should be able to pull this off rather quickly. even if you haven't IT IS NOT THAT DIFFICULT TO FIGURE OUT. most of these tasks are very basic skills that you probably learned in wood shop in high school. if you are thinking about doing this for some spare cash you need to invest the time to make jigs and templates. once you've done that this is a really quick operation when you actually get down to the lumber.Sorry Dude I tried to hold back ............. You originally stated that it would only take 1/2 hr. to build a neck from raw lumber - seems to me that you're now at 5 hrs. before finishing on a good day ! seems you were off by about a times ten ratio - no ? Thats with the right tools and the right knowledge & experience -- I believe the person who started this was experienced with woodwork but not guitars COME ON cut us some slack !! I'm not one to Flame but at least admit it ! oh yeah I didn't see anything about any inlay of fret markers or layout & machining on tuning peg holes. Do you have any pic's of your completed work to post??? Coz I'd like to see ......... I'm Todbass62 on MySpace Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fonz Posted June 3, 2002 Share Posted June 3, 2002 Originally posted by tarsia: Sorry Dude I tried to hold back ............. You originally stated that it would only take 1/2 hr. to build a neck from raw lumber - seems to me that you're now at 5 hrs. before finishing on a good day ! seems you were off by about a times ten ratio - no ? Thats with the right tools and the right knowledge & experience -- I believe the person who started this was experienced with woodwork but not guitars COME ON cut us some slack !! I'm not one to Flame but at least admit it ! oh yeah I didn't see anything about any inlay of fret markers or layout & machining on tuning peg holes. Do you have any pic's of your completed work to post??? Coz I'd like to see .........machining tuning peg holes? you consider this time consuming? do you understand the physics behind a drill press? do you know how to guage depth and recenter a bit? popping a few holes on a mark and then centerboring is not exactly rocket science. none of this is. drilling and machining are two VERY different things. and inlay? we're not talking about marquetry here, they're little pieces of round plastic. a quarter turn from your brace and bit will be sufficient. how long does layout take you? all you need to lay out for inlays are a ruler and a scratch all. you can even sub a straight scrap cut for the ruler. that is of course provided it doesn't take you too long to lay out a straight line. as far as 1/2 an hour is concerned i'm allowed to illustrate to show that it won't take the three days of constant work that you are expecting. tell you what. i have a scrap chunk of maple slated to be a replacement neck for a friends ibanez five string. it's already cut to 3' by 3" and milled square. i will take it into the shop and record the process of making this neck. i'll let you lay out the rules as to what you need to prove that it's the same piece of wood and we'll see how long it takes. Eeeeeehhhhhhhhh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tarsia Posted June 4, 2002 Share Posted June 4, 2002 Bastid E - first of all, "PEACE" brother bass player - I'm not trying to push buttons & cause alarm ! I have no doubt that you have the skills & experience to design & build a good instrument. from your comments & hints I'm sure you have acquired more expertise than I probably will ever have on this subject, this is not the main topic I was refering too, I was just thinking that a novice (i.e. 1st time builder) would have their hands full with other things building the 1st instrument& would do better buying a pre-fab neck , I know I would ! So that said - I made my responses after talking to a local well known luither (Rich Beck, check out his website...) he commented that to build a handmade - hand shaped fender style neck would take 20 plus hrs. before finishing, and of course next to no time if a N.C. routing machine were used instead. I believed that rhrocker most likely did not have this equip. And by the way I do know how to use some but not all machining equipment, if a piece of stock is put in a mill - precision drill or lathe it is considered being "machined" & I would take the time to layout with precision, even the tuning peg holes, most likely not with a drill press. I'm a Electronic Tech. by trade and barely a novice in the guitar building arena. Peace Out - T I'm Todbass62 on MySpace Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rhrocker Posted June 7, 2002 Author Share Posted June 7, 2002 Off and running! Got the parts ordered for the fingerboard, and have started on the neck. (my through-neck verson will probably take a week of evenings, we'll see how that unfolds). The through-neck blank is glued up (mesquite and walnut laminates), and the wings are shaped, and ready for attachment to the neck. I'll put the fingerboard on first however. Also, Have ordered the Seymour-Duncans, I got the APB-1's, and the kit comes with all the wiring, pots, jack, battery clip, etc. Seymour Duncan has a wiring diagram on-line also for the APB-1's. QUESTION: Gold (colored)tuner and bridge. What say ye guys? The Schallers look nice, and although pricey, I'm spending a little extra on this thing since it's going to be in my stable for a while. What would you guys use? I'm taking digitals of all the steps, and iwll post them shortly on my website in case anyone wants to see how well I can mess things up. just makin dem wood chips hea in South Texas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Capasso Posted June 7, 2002 Share Posted June 7, 2002 Glad to hear that things are progressing well !! Along with neck/fingerboard work, I guess you have to route the back of the wing for the control cavity. What are you going to cover it with? As to the gold, I think gold looks good if you are going for a natural wood color. For other colors, I don't care for it as much (I ordered black hardware with my red Kinal). As to the expense, that's up to you. If you like the look, why not? Make a few extra chairs to cover it !! I'm thinking about a rocker that has the sides made of a "thin" bass - you rock on the bottom of the basses, attach the back between the two necks... Tom (time to quote the Pixies again - "where is my mind") www.stoneflyrocks.com Acoustic Color Be practical as well as generous in your ideals. Keep your eyes on the stars and keep your feet on the ground. - Theodore Roosevelt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
polyt Posted June 7, 2002 Share Posted June 7, 2002 As to the gold, I think gold looks good if you are going for a natural wood color. For other colors, I don't care for it as much... I second that. Gold hardware is very tasteful when combined with a natural finish but it would be my last choice in any other setting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rhrocker Posted June 7, 2002 Author Share Posted June 7, 2002 Tom, I bought a cover plate from StewMac, however I may make a 1/8" plate from mesquite. That's still several days off. I also bought a battery compartment, but I'm not sure I like the idea of a plastic cover on the bass. I like the idea of the BassRocker! May make one for my den. I'll need both left and right handed basses for the sides. You could sit in the rocker with your hands dangling down the sides playing all you wanted. To show you how sick I am, I'm considering making a mesquite bass with the body in the shape of Texas. Can be part of my "Tacky Texan" Series. Actually the design works on the drawing board, and may just be gaudy enough to be sellable. just makin dem wood chips hea in South Texas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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