Technique/Fingering

[Guest]

Is there a set standard to electric bass fingering? If a person took lessons from different teachers and those teachers used different instruction materials would the fingering method still be identical?

 

The reason i ask is because i'm self taught and i have some books to learn reading and chord/scale theory and i follow the suggested fingering and then redo it my way, and i find it much easier my way. I then ask myself, "Why should i be doing it the other way? What will happen if i don't?"

 

A lot of times i will economize on fingering and plucking by incorporating slides and hops instead of fingering each note. Like, if i do a 4 half-tone walk-up, i might use four fingers playing each note, OR first finger, slide to second note then finger next two, OR play first note with first finger and slide it through all four notes plucking each as i go. Am i bad person?

 

I am primarilly into Rock, Pop, Country, Reggae. So perhaps my method is not too critical. Tell me why i need to do everything right? Also, i am currently playing a short scale bass and use my third finger in all positions, for all three fret spreads.

[musicman1ovation.net]

Originally posted by plastic nut:

Is there a set standard to electric bass fingering?

 

In another era http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/wink.gif, I took trumpet/cornet in the grade school band. Some new students would have this tendency to puff out their cheeks when they played. The band director would get all hot and bothered and tell us all that if we didn't keep out cheeks straight (not-puffed, whatever he called it), we would never be able to play. "Professional trumpet players never puff their cheeks." I didn't know about Dizzy Gillespie at the time, but I certainly remember the first time I saw him. There he was playing some of the most interesting trumpet I had heard, his cheeks filled like bagpipes, and playing that cool trumpet who's bell pointed upwards. And, oh, by the way; we were also told to never lower our heads when playing. So here was this fountain of jazz doing two things we were taught would ruin any chance we had of being "real" players. http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/smile.gif

 

Brass didn't turn out to be my thing (though I still greatly appreciate it and have my horn), so later I was taking up drums. This was mid sixties, and I can tell you for sure that every drum teacher and every drum book had a very specific way for you to hold your sticks. It was a big deal. It was the first thing. Would-be drummers that balked would just have to spend several lessons getting it down (it tends to be a little awkward for most players at first, even those who continue with it forever with great poise). The left hand used one method, and the right another. I recall that some people tended to like to hold the sticks "properly" with the right hand, and the same way with the left, which was improper. Some teachers would have students unlearn their wrong way even if they were fairly advanced. I ended up doing something altogether different, but I was mostly self-taught, so no problem. Rock 'n' roll drummers wee popping up everywhere on TV who were doing it wrong. In time, that stiff rule was relaxed, and there are even some books that teach that wrong way as right. Some just give a choice. I believe the traditional way grew out of military marching snare playing. And it does have some definite advantages there. For some people, it is advantageous in all applications.

 

There are specific ways for piano (curl those fingers) and there are guitar/bass fingerings. As to how adamant it all is, though, I think the conventional wisdom has changed. It goes something like this: when you take up an instrument or decide to read up on or take lessons anew, go ahead and give the taught method a go. Even if it is awkward at first, give it a little time. But, after you've tried the taught method or methods; if you find yourself using an alternate method by which you are playing fluidly, go for it! I can't give a definitive answer as to what most teachers say when it comes to a set standard to electric bass fingering. There might well be two main schools. I sort of doubt it goes beyond that. But I think that if you give the taught method(s) a realistic try, but still find yourself going for your own way, think about this James Taylor song lyric If it feels right, don't think twice. http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/smile.gif

 

I don't say this to discredit the tried and true ways. They are generally traditional for a reason. They are good starting points for virtually everyone, and the will be the way for many... maybe most people, if they are schooled or have followed the books and videos.

 

But Dizzy is the man! And what about blues guitar? Jeff Healey... he's the man!!

 

Since you are trying the methods you see in the books, giving them a good go before concluding that you just play better with the method you've developed, I only have one thing to say:

 

You da man! http://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/wink.gifhttp://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/biggrin.gifhttp://www.musicplayer.com/ubb/smile.gif

 

I am sure others can tell you more specifically about whether a single standard exists for bass fingering.

 

This message has been edited by musicman1@ovation.net on 04-29-2001 at 12:20 PM

[Guest]

Thanks for the reply, musicman1. I do know what you mean. I took drums lessons as a teen and learned underhand/overhand. I can only play this way. I can't do rock grip. Hey, one of the best drummers of all time Buddy Rich played both underhand.

 

I see that doing the examples as written could be beneficial. I know my style is somewhat sloppy and lazy, and probably won't help me when i try to tackle some Bach one day. But i *do* think my way adds style and movement which prevents me from sounding sterile. I'll never be a studio musician, that's for sure. But, i am older and that goal is beyond my capabilities anyway. I want to learn theory, become good, and have fun.

[Ed Friedland]

I use a few different fingering systems on electric bass.

1) One finger per fret is good for intricate lines like bebop solos than require dexterity with a position. You sometimes have to pivot to make sure you don't force a stretch in the left hand.

2) The "Box" or as Glenn Letsch calls it, the "Bunch of Bananas". First finger on the root, 4th and b7, 4th finger for the 5th and octave. It saves strain on the left hand as we are often stuck in the R-5-8 position for long periods, using the 3rd finger for the octave is too stressful on the hand.

3) The 1-2-4 for consecutive half steps. This is a hold over from my training on upright. It works great in the lower positions where the frets are further apart. If I need to play F-F#-G on my E string, I'll use 1-2-4, less strain on the hand.

4) Extension fingering puts whole steps between the 1st and third fingers and the 3rd and 4th fingers. It works best in the higher positions, but can be used lower if you pivot. Helpful for large reaches that need to be smooth and quiet.

 

Bottom line is you need to be flexible in your fingering approaches. You need to have more than one way to play something and be able to use it without injury.

 

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www.edfriedland.com

[Guest]

Hi Ed, thank you for the reply and professional advice. I do employ various fingerings depending on the song i am playing. Right now i just jam with CDs and either copy the bassline or embellish. Certain songs i will stay in a 4 fret stretch, others i slide and hop around to add some bounce, and it's just easier/faster. It's not likely i will ever venture far into jazz because i don't understand it so well. I have a hard time distinguishing tones that are so close together. I guess i'm a simpleton... but there is an unending supply of pop/rock/country that i *can* play and i write my own songs too. :-)

 

I just finished jamming with The Hollies greatest hits. Very easy stuff, but it lets you feel you are playin' with the band. No conscious technique, just move with the groove. :-)

[Guest]

Also wanted to mention: Because i am playing 30" scale it is too cramped to play fingers 1 2 4 on the lower positions. When i try out 34" basses in the store i can see why that technique is necessary.

[Guest]

Ugh! When i say 4 fret stretch i mean 4 position which is 3 frets. Sorry.

[dansouth]

The important thing is making the notes sound clean and controlled, even in challenging passages. If some notes sound (unintentionally) muted during technical passages, you may need to alter your fretting technique. Playing with fingertips usually (USUALLY) leads to cleaner results than a sloppy, just hit the note any way you can technique. But there are examples of good bassists who play all different ways. Are you satisfied with your sound when you listen to a recording of yourself? Can you play effectively in the styles you mentioned, or do you feel that technical limitations are holding you back from reaching the level you desire?

[dansouth]

I can think of two additional fingering techniques. One I associate with Latin music, which features legato root-fifth-octave lines. Fret the root with the index finger, the fifth with the ring finger, and the octave with the little finger.

 

The second is the Rocco Prestia muting technique, where he frets most notes with his index finger and uses the other fingers to mute the strings. It's an unusual technique, but he uses it to crank out some amazing bass lines.

[Mr. Wise Man]

Since there's no conservatory method for the bass guitar, it's hard to say what the "standard" technique is. Neverthelss, I would say that the first and fourth of the techniques -- with your thumb on the back of the neck and your fingers slightly arched -- Mr. Friedland describes are pretty close to standard in terms of the number of excellent professional players who use them. Yes, I am also aware of the many excellent professional players who do not play in this manner -- it's not really any different for an instrument with a standard conservatory technique. For what it's worth, I think there's much less uniformity of right hand technique on the bass guitar.

 

The only thing that makes me at all nervous about this is that I'm not a believer in "whatever works" -- that is, there are plenty of ways to hurt your playing and body through poor technique, which makes the lack of a thought-out thoroughly explained and illustrated technique book troublesome. (I am aware of one recent book on technique that has been critically acclaimed; however, I find the right hand techniques illustrated to be not very good, and limited to two-finger playing).

 

musicman1: Dizzy Gillespie did not recommend his trumpet technique to others. I once read a late interview with Mr. Gillespie where, in response to a question about his opinion of Wynton Marsalis, he replied something to the effect of "He could cut me, but only because I learned to play all wrong. If I'd learned to play properly, you wouldn't even bother to mention his name to me."

 

This message has been edited by Mr. Wise Man on 05-04-2001 at 05:28 AM