Robman2 Posted March 1, 2005 Share Posted March 1, 2005 ECB Rules: Your post went straight to the VP's e-mail. We are aware of the differnce a cold to hot solder joint makes and should that failure be occurant, we would send back the shipment and possibly find another build partner, we have very low return rates, unlike (scary brand). In the mix of wire wars the affordable builds, are assembled offshore and I personally have been a champion for some imporovent beyond a pedestrian build...relative to metal ends, field servicable as we like to call it... The Molded versions are still a mainstay and in many cases last as long or longer depending on the user. The newer snakes, which we are now beginning to offer are here: http://www.hosatech.com/hosa/products/CSS-800PRO.html These of course cost more then our past products but the build is no different then Horizon etc. Bryson: You are welcomed to comment as to what you heard, I believe I've addressed this same post once before. The guitar usually relies upon 600ohm impedence. The use of a cut up line level -10 or +4 design may not have been a good choice, for the simple fact that the spiral alignment within a harness, is specifcally done to keep the handeling noise, RFI, EMI to a minimum. Selecting a lead, designed for use with a guitar normally requires a dielectric (insulation) which is thicker and has a robust shield to reduce handeling noise etc. The hotter iron, yes always a good idea. AS I SAID, cables are subjective... Rob Label on the reverb, inside 1973 Ampeg G-212: "Folded Line Reverberation Unit" Manufactured by beautiful girls in Milton WIS. under controlled atmosphere conditions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michelle ggurl Posted March 1, 2005 Share Posted March 1, 2005 I know we're talking mostly about cables in the STUDIO, but can you folks offer expertise regarding cables for live applications? I'm a keyboardist and, in taking stock of my rig for upcoming gig season, I notice I need to replace some cables. Would it be worth it for me to invest in instrument cables of higher caliber than ProCo for live use? The outputs are going to stereo keyboard combo amps with unbalanced inputs (then each amp has a direct XLR out to run to house board, if that matters). Original Latin Jazz CD Baby "I am not certain how original my contribution to music is as I am obviously an amateur." Patti Smith Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ECBRules Posted March 1, 2005 Share Posted March 1, 2005 Originally posted by Robman2: ECB Rules: Your post went straight to the VP's e-mail.uh-oh.. http://www.hosatech.com/hosa/products/CSS-800PRO.html Rob I like the smaller back hole, probably cuts down on rf noise quite a bit. I think it would be a good idea to ship those cables with some kind of hanger, to make the weight of the snake pull elsewhere. I have a few of the molded hosa 8x snakes and a few of the balanced 8x snakes. I dislike the molded variety but I think it is probably good for a budget conscious consumer. I don't mind spending a little more on a better cable. By the ways is that light blue a shrink plastic cover? I'm assuming it goes all the way to the strain relief. If so, that's a much better design. I'm glad to see that you all (HOSA) are working to improve things. --- On a side note, I have a couple adat optical hosa cables that are really fragile because they are so thin. The monster cable optical connectors are too thick to fit on my friend's digi 002. Is there something in-between? Keny http://www.kennyruyter.com/old/cowmix.mp3 <- Cowbell fever REMIX oh damn!!! http://www.eastcoastbands.com aka: ECBRules . thisOLDdude . keny . Scooch Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robman2 Posted March 1, 2005 Share Posted March 1, 2005 Ken/Eleven Shadows: "So yeah, are there cables that sound better? I'd pretty much bet on it. I'll probably get a Mogami 8-cable 3' snake or something similar (not familiar with Zaolla) to connect from the mic preamps to the converters." Mogami are amoung a few who offer 8 paried snakes, with a similar build to Zaolla. Essentially most snakes, Monster, Hosa etc, use hot, cold, ground or drain wire and surround those with a "Mylar" type of foil wrap, under the jacket, in a slow twisted pair all within a common jacket. When constructing a DB 25, it's quicker to just put the ground into the pin (solder cup), then it is to twist a braid to do the same. Mogami, at least on their Gold series, uses Hot, cold, foil, a braided shield ground and the jackets. Zaolla also are built to such a specification. The big differnce, we use solid cast or single grain pure, solid silver conductors, Mogami uses drawn copper wire. How much of a differnce that makes at line level is for the users to get into and that pool of former wire skeptic, power users, continues to grow. My opinion really doesn't matter as much. John Fischbach is using Zaolla on the front end and digitally for his Z Systems Detangler He made some comments as to the differnce between both brands when he visted us at AES, better to ask him yourself. You might give him a call before taking the plunge. http://www.pietystreet.com/ Thanks, Rob Label on the reverb, inside 1973 Ampeg G-212: "Folded Line Reverberation Unit" Manufactured by beautiful girls in Milton WIS. under controlled atmosphere conditions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robman2 Posted March 1, 2005 Share Posted March 1, 2005 ECB Rules, There is really no differnce in various plastic "optical" cables, light travels as light, despite the claims some folks like to make. If plastic type cable is properly manufactured, it will transmit the same as another. Glass is better then plastic for longer distance, but single mode glass costs a lot. The head shell on the brand M, is too large for the Digi 002 I know, we do have another version available, the OPM series. Nicer head shell, double jacketed so they are more wear and tear resistant. http://www.hosatech.com/hosa/products/OPM-300.html Not sure as to the fit on 002 but, if you get them and they do not work, I'll guarantee you can send them back. Where do you get your stuff? R Label on the reverb, inside 1973 Ampeg G-212: "Folded Line Reverberation Unit" Manufactured by beautiful girls in Milton WIS. under controlled atmosphere conditions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BP3 Posted March 1, 2005 Share Posted March 1, 2005 http://www.gearslutz.com/board/attachment.php3?s=&postid=281746 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robman2 Posted March 1, 2005 Share Posted March 1, 2005 About live, it's as good as you want it to be. Power compression in the system after about 15 minutes, the room, etc. Now are there folks who use fine cables live, yes, the photos grace the ad's from here to the sixties. The folks using our high-end brand, do it for a couple reasons, the clarity (seperation of the bass and low mids, non-colored highs) plus they are built to last. Hosa, 20% we build here, but we build every Zaolla cable here in Buena Park. Hot joints, silver solder, extra strain relief on the instrument cables, everything one would need for analog, digital or video. Those folks who have made the transition from copper to silver are either tone heads, or gigging professionals who could use any darn cable they want to. Pete Anderson, Johnny Hiland, Leo Kottke, Doyle Dykes, Nick Smith (Stanly Clark's keys person) and a whole bunch of us regular folks as well. Thanks for asking. Rob Label on the reverb, inside 1973 Ampeg G-212: "Folded Line Reverberation Unit" Manufactured by beautiful girls in Milton WIS. under controlled atmosphere conditions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robman2 Posted March 1, 2005 Share Posted March 1, 2005 Nice pic T Arts... Label on the reverb, inside 1973 Ampeg G-212: "Folded Line Reverberation Unit" Manufactured by beautiful girls in Milton WIS. under controlled atmosphere conditions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BP3 Posted March 1, 2005 Share Posted March 1, 2005 Looks like a bunch of Hosa ads by Google. >>>>>>>>>> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
where02190 Posted March 2, 2005 Share Posted March 2, 2005 For live, I strongly recommend that you build your own. QC is nonexistant in cable manufacturing, low/no skilled minimum wage workers making inconsistant cabling from ALL manufacturers. Live cabling needs to be well made to withstand the rigors fo the road, not be guaranteed for life so when it breaks you get a new one, but made not to break except under the most extreme conditions. In addition to being far superior than comercial cabling, there is a considerable cost savings to DYI. Hope this is helpful. NP Recording Studios Analog approach to digital recording. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KenElevenShadows Posted March 2, 2005 Share Posted March 2, 2005 And if someone could find a guitar cable that stops curling up on me after only 2-3 months, I'd be happy... Ken Lee Photography - photos and books Eleven Shadows ambient music The Mercury Seven-cool spacey music Linktree to various sites Instagram Nightaxians Video Podcast Eleven Shadows website Ken Lee Photography Pinterest Page Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Teeth Posted March 2, 2005 Author Share Posted March 2, 2005 Hey, I didnt think this could grow this far. For live I have used planet waves, and proel... very good. I think i will try some Hosa cables. The "top of the line" brand in my country is monster, and they are toooooooooo expensive. In fact today i was looking for a Y cable TRS -> 2 TS and here i found the cheaper monster at $50, which for my pocket is just insane. Chuck Surack here? oh wow, i didnt know. Great store that of yours. I ordered a simple DVD and i was treated like if my order was of a million dollars, Thnaks. Rebuilding My Self Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Teeth Posted March 2, 2005 Author Share Posted March 2, 2005 Any one knows the diferrence in building from hosa to proco. Because there is a significant diference in the price. Rebuilding My Self Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Teeth Posted March 2, 2005 Author Share Posted March 2, 2005 one more thing... its embarassing but i havent never made a single cable. Is there any website with info of building cables? I have used the iron, dont worry about that Rebuilding My Self Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michelle ggurl Posted March 2, 2005 Share Posted March 2, 2005 I'm in the same boat as Dr. Teeth ... so any tips for people who know just enough to get in trouble with a soldering iron to keep them out of it is much appreciated. Original Latin Jazz CD Baby "I am not certain how original my contribution to music is as I am obviously an amateur." Patti Smith Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bryson Posted March 2, 2005 Share Posted March 2, 2005 Originally posted by Dr Teeth: one more thing... its embarassing but i havent never made a single cable. Is there any website with info of building cables? I have used the iron, dont worry about that http://www.dtvprofessional.com/articles/viewarticle.jsp?id=20477 http://www.epemag.wimborne.co.uk/solderfaq.htm http://www.epemag.com/solderfaq/default.htm http://www.geofex.com/Article_Folders/how_to_solder.htm http://www.mediacollege.com/misc/solder/ http://www.me.umn.edu/education/courses/me2011/robot/solder.html http://www.colomar.com/Shavano/soldering.html http://www.kingbass.com/soldering101.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ECBRules Posted March 2, 2005 Share Posted March 2, 2005 Originally posted by Robman2: ECB Rules, There is really no differnce in various plastic "optical" cables, light travels as light, despite the claims some folks like to make. http://www.hosatech.com/hosa/products/OPM-300.html I'm going to show my friend these cables. he said he bought a pair of hosa's after the monster didnt fit and had to roll back the shield on one of them to get it to fit. Where do you get your stuff? R I bought my molded cables from Victor Litz in gaithersburg, Who gets supplied by M&A music, I got the adat opticals from guitar center in rockville, and the RTS snakes from WPS, who also doubles as chuck levin's music center. I live in a really competitive market, and taught at a music store for several years before going out on my own, so I know the business pretty well. http://www.kennyruyter.com/old/cowmix.mp3 <- Cowbell fever REMIX oh damn!!! http://www.eastcoastbands.com aka: ECBRules . thisOLDdude . keny . Scooch Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robman2 Posted March 2, 2005 Share Posted March 2, 2005 Where... At Hosa and ProCo, the employees are long term as in many years, so if it's amoung the 20% of Hosa we sell which we assemble, it's built by very skilled and well paid and insured, and legallly in this country, assemblers. If it's the Zaolla, they require silver solder, hotter iron, and layers of heat shrink and strain relief, and are entirely assembled here in Buena Park, CA. ProCo as well, they have real pros working there. The quality of offshore, mass produced cables, does depend, and in some cases, dealing with smaller shops, is a better way to go, they are more accountable. Building one's own cables is always the assurance of a job well done BTW. I don't do it for myself any longer but I was military trained as far as technique goes. R Label on the reverb, inside 1973 Ampeg G-212: "Folded Line Reverberation Unit" Manufactured by beautiful girls in Milton WIS. under controlled atmosphere conditions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave The Rave Posted March 2, 2005 Share Posted March 2, 2005 Just a small point, but you don't want your soldering iron to be HOTTER (higher temperature), you want it to be MORE POWERFUL (more WATTS). You could have a 15W iron that operates at 900 degF but it won't help you. You need to use a good quality 50 to 150W iron IMO. I use Weller temperature controlled irons myself. Set the temperature to about 730 degF, tin the contacts and the wire ends first, then complete the joint quickly, ensuring you hold the cable/connector steady until the solder cools below transition temperature again and hardens cleanly. I've made my own cables for years now (I was trained by to do mil-spec work too Robman2). I have noticed a steady decline in the quality of the connectors themselves. All I seem to be able to buy these days are crappo-jacks made with super-thin steel that don't take solder very well at all. Also, the joints between the barrel and the solder tags is terrible (loose). I know there are good quality parts out there somewhere, but finding them locally is nigh-on impossible. :DTR Cambrian Guitars Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chuck Surack Posted March 2, 2005 Share Posted March 2, 2005 Originally posted by Robman2: Where... At Hosa and ProCo, the employees are long term as in many years, so if it's amoung the 20% of Hosa we sell which we assemble, it's built by very skilled and well paid and insured, and legallly in this country, assemblers. ...... ProCo as well, they have real pros working there. R Rob, I just wanted to say, you made a very classy post to go out of your way to "complement" ProCo, a competitor. That is way cool! This is one of many reasons I love selling Hosa products....Great products, incredible value and you guys are a total class act all the time! You have to be one of the easiest and best companies I do business with. Congrats and thanks, Chuck Surack Sweetwater Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chuck Surack Posted March 2, 2005 Share Posted March 2, 2005 Originally posted by Dr Teeth: Chuck Surack here? oh wow, i didnt know. Great store that of yours. I ordered a simple DVD and i was treated like if my order was of a million dollars, Thnaks. Dr Teeth, Yes, I am here. I'm hooked, I've been here for many, many years. I come here every day, in fact many times a day. I start and end EVERY day with the forums. I tend to stay in the background a lot. I am always careful to not say too much...I don't want it to be misinterpreted as spam or trolling. I tend to come out of my cave only if my name or company name is invoked . I just love coming here because I am a gear an music nut and I learn a lot from all these smart people! Thanks for the very kind words about Sweetwater. I really appreciate them. We all try really hard around here to truly make a difference and it is so gratifying when a customer notices. Sincerely, Chuck Surack Sweetwater Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KenElevenShadows Posted March 2, 2005 Share Posted March 2, 2005 Sweetwater has consistently excellent customer service, and Chuck is very generous at NAMM dinners. Ken Lee Photography - photos and books Eleven Shadows ambient music The Mercury Seven-cool spacey music Linktree to various sites Instagram Nightaxians Video Podcast Eleven Shadows website Ken Lee Photography Pinterest Page Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeT156 Posted March 2, 2005 Share Posted March 2, 2005 I think my time is better spent on playing the music than soldering cables. I have some cables that are over 20 years old and they still work fine. My only problem with some of them is I bought a bunch of cables that are 25 ft. long. I have some stereo volume pedals and with that set up, I have 50 ft of cable between my KB and the mixer, this is not good. I will be buying some shorter cables, and have begun using CV volume pedals as I buy new KB's. Other than that, the ProCo cables I got from Sweetwater work great and they're not terribly expensive. I'd rather buy cables from a reputable mfg. and just plug them in. You guys can solder away if you like, I'll pass. Mike T. Yamaha Motif ES8, Alesis Ion, Prophet 5 Rev 3.2, 1979 Rhodes Mark 1 Suitcase 73 Piano, Arp Odyssey Md III, Roland R-70 Drum Machine, Digitech Vocalist Live Pro. Roland Boss Chorus Ensemble CE-1. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KenElevenShadows Posted March 2, 2005 Share Posted March 2, 2005 I don't know how to solder either. I'm okay with purchasing cables. I can't do everything, I can't make everything. I stopped working on my car, too. I don't find that enjoyable at all. I like playing and recording music, and the less peripheral stuff I have to do, the happier I am. However, I have so much admiration for people who can fix and solder and put together stuff. I'm just not someone who enjoys it. And also, I've been lucky. Whether it's Hosa, ProCo, Belden, Canare, or whatever, I've had very few cables go bad, and if they do, they usually last for at least ten years before going kabloooey. Ken Lee Photography - photos and books Eleven Shadows ambient music The Mercury Seven-cool spacey music Linktree to various sites Instagram Nightaxians Video Podcast Eleven Shadows website Ken Lee Photography Pinterest Page Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Teeth Posted March 2, 2005 Author Share Posted March 2, 2005 Thanks to the guy who posted the links about soldering. I am a computer science student i have used the iron pretty much, i even made a pci interface with a protoboard. Is there a site with instructions like that but on how to connecct the wires, kinds of wires, and types of conectors? Well mr surack, that is one of the things that i like the most of this forums, i have the opportunity to "be close" to peopple like you, bruce, craig, and gus lozada from nuestro foro that i consider my mentor, and i had the privilege to meet when he came here. The only one thing that i would suggest for sweetwater, is to give more options of shipping for international customers, because you only have one type of fedex shipping for now, and its too expensive, otherwise, you are the perfect music dealer. Paul Rowan was my sales engeneer, i would recommend him for all of you. Rebuilding My Self Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeT156 Posted March 3, 2005 Share Posted March 3, 2005 Dr. Teeth: I suggest that you don't call Chuck Surack MR. Surack, he's a lot more approachable than anyone I ever called "Mr". Mike T. Yamaha Motif ES8, Alesis Ion, Prophet 5 Rev 3.2, 1979 Rhodes Mark 1 Suitcase 73 Piano, Arp Odyssey Md III, Roland R-70 Drum Machine, Digitech Vocalist Live Pro. Roland Boss Chorus Ensemble CE-1. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Teeth Posted March 3, 2005 Author Share Posted March 3, 2005 Originally posted by MikeT156: Dr. Teeth: I suggest that you don't call Chuck Surack MR. Surack, he's a lot more approachable than anyone I ever called "Mr". Mike T. Yeah? oh ok Rebuilding My Self Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chuck Surack Posted March 3, 2005 Share Posted March 3, 2005 Originally posted by Dr Teeth: Originally posted by MikeT156: Dr. Teeth: I suggest that you don't call Chuck Surack MR. Surack, he's a lot more approachable than anyone I ever called "Mr". Mike T. Yeah? oh ok Thanks, I agree..I am too young to be a "Mister"..that's my dad or grandpa or something.. Dr. Teeth (and others) I appreciate the respect, but please feel free to just call me Chuck. Thanks, Chuck Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Philip OKeefe Posted March 3, 2005 Share Posted March 3, 2005 Whatever you say Mr. Chuck Sir! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robman2 Posted March 3, 2005 Share Posted March 3, 2005 Davein'ravin...My use of hotter is incorrect, wattage yes, mea culpa... If you wish, send me a PM and I'll send you a pair of plugs for review, ours may be robust enough, or not. Chuck, you are too kind, very much appreciated and et tu for you and the staff at Sweetwater. Also hats off to Gerry Schrader, our friend and your rep, for making sure the wheels of commerce keep on turning. Also Chuck is a very talented player (sax) and has a standing gig in the Fort Wayne area... Rob Label on the reverb, inside 1973 Ampeg G-212: "Folded Line Reverberation Unit" Manufactured by beautiful girls in Milton WIS. under controlled atmosphere conditions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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