Mixer and audiointerface for mixing keys and playback of backing tracks via iPad

[erik_nie]

I hope someone can help me with the issues I'm having with my setup.

My current setup is:
- Nord Piano 3-73

- Nord Stage 3

- iPad 6 mini for sheets and playback of Backing tracks (left audio, right click) and send program changes to Nords

- el-cheapo USB audio interface from china (USB stick size)
- Self made Mixer (see: Mixer)

 

I checked the audio interface against several others, sound quality is great and similar to audio out of my macbook air M1.
 

What I want:

- Single device attached to my synth, no 19-inch rack or complicated setup where I need a computer
- Mix the synths
- Add the audio (mono) part of the iPad backing track to the stereo output to FOH 

- Output Click track to FOH
- USB output from iPad to both Nords to change patches from iPad

- Ability to live change volume of synths and backing tracks (not always consistent in output level of patches and backing tracks)

- Power the iPad via a USB-bub with power-input

- Make a headphone mix with adjustable mix:

  - My FOH audio-mix
  - Click
  - FOH stereo return aux (for rest of band)

 

This works with my current setup. All the boxes are ticked.
I have 2 issues at the moment:
- After adding the USB to both Nords, some static noise is added (not much, barely acceptable).
- some balanced output would be nice (audio out, click out, aux-in)

I tried different solutions:
- changed USB cables. no changes

- changed power-adapter (from Mixer and iPad), no change

- Added an audio isolator, this solved the issue, but introduced strong crosstalk between audio and click

- use seperate audio interface (tried a few, made it a little better but adds another adapter, cables, etc)

- Audio4c as a full solution, this works but volumes can only be changed by attaching a computer. There is no way to use a midi-controller to change only the volume of the back-track audio), great device to have the iPad powered. With some software updates this could me a great device. But the changes this might be done on short term are pretty low

 

Possible other solutions might be:
- K-mix from Keith McMillen
- Play backing-tracks from seperate device (With midi-selectable tracks because I control that from the iPad):
  - BlueBox from 1010 (perhaps also to play backing tracks there)
  - LP16 (But most people say it is not very stable)

Another solution is to add a Laptop (MacBook) and a dedicated Audio interface. This will tick all the boxes, except many cables, long setups and my previous set consisted of an audio laptop where updating and backing up is a terrible thing to maintain.

Using the iPad gives me a simple backup: My older iPad that I use to control the FOH MR18

There must be a simple solution for this...

Any help is appreciated!!!!
 

[ElmerJFudd]

This sounds like an easy job for the Radial Key Largo  

 

1/4” audio outs from the two Nords to analogue inputs on the Key Largo.  You can gain stage and adjust volume at the keyboards or at the face of the Key Largo.  
 

Class compliant USB audio from the iPad to Key Largo.  Again, you can gain stage your level at the iPad and the USB volume knob on the face of the Key Largo.  
 

It has 1/4” monitor outs on the rear to your local amplification or in-ears.   And it has balanced XLR to FOH.  There is also an FX send out (and return) you may make use of creatively.  
 

You likely need a USB hub for the iPad to add a midi interface to the two Nords for program change messages.  Some USB hubs also offer a 3.5mm audio out for iPad which may be helpful for sending your click track somewhere else.  I think this depends how flexible your backing track software is.  
 

There are many audio file playback devices, inexpensive for backing tracks if you went that route.  Most playback MP3 from SD card.  But a 320kbs MP3 is very hard to distinguish from wav.  You could also do it from your phone. 
 

[erik_nie]

Thanks for the response. I would really want to use the key largo, but this will output the click track left right into the FOH.

Many devices exist like this. The trouble is to get left with audio to left+right FOH (mono) and right with click to seperate output and in ear mix.

 

Seems like an option that many keyboard players want to use. Perhaps also drummers

 

Perhaps there is an option in the Key Large that I missed, I read the manual to check this out.

 

Regards, Erik

[stoken6]

I can't help feeling you need an iPad dock that will output audio (analogue, two-channel, so you can route audio separately from click), and give you a USB socket for MIDI in/out, and power delivery into the iPad. Then you need a conventional mixer with the ability to set up a headphone/monitor mix and an independent FoH mix. (Your homebrew mixer might be all you need there).

 

There are other threads on iPad docks here. I seem to recall a Startech model that looked good, but can't find it again now.

 

Cheers, Mike.

[ElmerJFudd]

39 minutes ago, erik_nie said:

Thanks for the response. I would really want to use the key largo, but this will output the click track left right into the FOH.

Many devices exist like this. The trouble is to get left with audio to left+right FOH (mono) and right with click to seperate output and in ear mix.

 

Seems like an option that many keyboard players want to use. Perhaps also drummers

 

Perhaps there is an option in the Key Large that I missed, I read the manual to check this out.

 

Regards, Erik

I would imagine there may be an App that does this on iOS.  I’ll take peak, but definitely worth investigating.  What are you using for audio playback now on the iPad? 

[erik_nie]

I build my own app (see my footer). It plays an .mp3 or .wav file from iCloud. That works great and is very stable.

The stereo file has click on the left and audio on the right (or swapped...)

When played via a USB mixer (Like a mackie, Behringer, Key Largo) it outputs this as a stereo file to the FOH mix. Thus playing the audio on one side and click on the other.
Using an stereo aux (if present), I could output this and feed it back into the mixer with a splitter cable. Then the outputs are taken up and there is no option for a FOH mix and a in-ear mix

 

With more advanced audio-interfaces like the RME UCX,  or audio4c from iConnectivity, it is possible to split the audio and click and distribute this over the FOH mix and in-ear mix with internal mixer/routing. With the RME there is an iPad app to control the mix, with the audio4c only a mac/windows app. As I use the iPad to display chords, it is not an easy step to swap apps to change the volume of the backing-track during performance.

I hope there is a small, not too expensive, solution for this

[analogika]

I was going to recommend the iConnectivity AUDIO4c — but for the lack of Auracle for iPad. 😕 

 

The RME may fit the bill. 

 

Switching between recent apps on iPad is just a four-finger swipe left or right across the screen, so that might be pretty manageable even during a show…? Worth a try, methinks. 

[ElmerJFudd]

18 hours ago, erik_nie said:

I build my own app (see my footer). It plays an .mp3 or .wav file from iCloud. That works great and is very stable.

The stereo file has click on the left and audio on the right (or swapped...)

When played via a USB mixer (Like a mackie, Behringer, Key Largo) it outputs this as a stereo file to the FOH mix. Thus playing the audio on one side and click on the other.
Using an stereo aux (if present), I could output this and feed it back into the mixer with a splitter cable. Then the outputs are taken up and there is no option for a FOH mix and a in-ear mix

 

With more advanced audio-interfaces like the RME UCX,  or audio4c from iConnectivity, it is possible to split the audio and click and distribute this over the FOH mix and in-ear mix with internal mixer/routing. With the RME there is an iPad app to control the mix, with the audio4c only a mac/windows app. As I use the iPad to display chords, it is not an easy step to swap apps to change the volume of the backing-track during performance.

I hope there is a small, not too expensive, solution for this

There's at least a few reasons I wish Apple would make the Mac Book Air a convertible laptop/tablet.   Being able to run macOS apps is foremost followed by not needing to also carry an iPad.  Other things that come to mind are having a few ports without needing a dock or hub.