Max Ventura Posted February 13, 2004 Share Posted February 13, 2004 last night I watched the Grammys for the first time, and I expected to see a super-produced mega-show, technically worthy of the enormous budget that probably has been vomited into it, but instead I observed a badly sewn-together, rough-running, almost amateurish display of lack of experience in TV production. As a former TV and roadshow tecnician and producer, I immediately noticed the absurd lack of cohesion between presentations, performances, and everything in between. They were as such: -A show like that CANNOT be without a head-presenter, an out-of-field voice won't do. A presenter keeps the show running and ties everything together. Learn from the MTV Awards. -Some of the celebrities (!) presenting awards were so obviously uncomfortable with a microphone and an audience that was almost embarassing. They were stiff, over-rehearsed, and unnatural. Some of them couldn't wait to be outta there. -the handling of microphones was technically amateurish. Think of Beck: he picks up his mic and first it blasts and distorts, then gets heavily ducked and limited, then comes back to audible level. Ridiculous. -Audience reaction was heavily under-miked. It almost sounded like the presenters were addressing an empty hall, and pauses were heavy with...nothingness. -Speaking of pauses, what was all that about? You can't leave an audience alone for even 5 seconds, let alone minutes; For example, when that idiot from Outkast receives his Grammy and walks away with a meager "thanks" because he thinks he's the new bad boy in town, there's an embarassing moment: everybody seems to be running away from stage lest they are recognized... a presenter would have bandaged the things back in shape. -The lighting design was astonishing, no doubt about that, and the broadcast sound as well - except microphoning. Also, the positioning of the podium mic was unappropriate, forcing average-height people to heavily stoop toward it. Were two mics out of budget for the Grammys? I think there are no technical, excuses for the faults I here described. To think that this is the 46th Grammy show, it's unfathomable for me. Something else: The nominations for Best Rap Album were a bit strange: apart from Missy Elliot and one other, the Outkast and the Roots only claim to Rap-ness was being black. The Roots sound just like The Clash, and Outkast is a wanna-be Prince-meets-british Electro. Bah. Kudos for Dave Matthews, i'm not familiar with his music but he seems a sturdy, honest and serious performer, kinda like Springsteeen 20 years ago. Kudos for Beyonce' as well, I don't like black music in general and much less I like heavily-trumpeted performers, but honestly speaking she earns all the money she's getting for the sheer amount of work she does. Max Ventura, Italy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kylen Posted February 13, 2004 Share Posted February 13, 2004 I don't like black music in general He He - where are you comin from...what music do you like as a reference point for this post Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max Ventura Posted February 13, 2004 Author Share Posted February 13, 2004 MY POST WASN'T ABOUT THE MUSIC AT ALL - IT'S ABOUT THE WAY THEY RAN THAT SHOW. Max Ventura, Italy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kylen Posted February 13, 2004 Share Posted February 13, 2004 OK FINE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BP3 Posted February 13, 2004 Share Posted February 13, 2004 MAX, WHY SO ANGRY? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coyote Posted February 13, 2004 Share Posted February 13, 2004 THANK YOU FOR EMPHASIZING THAT POINT. Sounds like you oughta be the producer for next year's telecast! I used to think I was Libertarian. Until I saw their platform; now I know I'm no more Libertarian than I am RepubliCrat or neoCON or Liberal or Socialist. This ain't no track meet; this is football. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FoxTick Posted February 13, 2004 Share Posted February 13, 2004 I like black music, it's the red music I don't like. I used to feel the same way about green music but I've changed my ways. 0096 2251 2110 8105 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doc taz Posted February 13, 2004 Share Posted February 13, 2004 At least you have to credit Max with making a detailed, critical, and honest analysis of what he thought of the show. Sometimes attention to detail does matter. sevenstring.org profile my flickr page Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super 8 Posted February 13, 2004 Share Posted February 13, 2004 Is anybody going to actually respond to Max's post, or are you just going to make smart-ass comments? I didn't see the Grammys, so I can't really say I agree or I disagree. Super 8 Hear my stuff here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doc taz Posted February 13, 2004 Share Posted February 13, 2004 I think Max did hit on a lot of points here, which is why I responded like I did. I bet the naysayers couldn't even write a meaningful speech to save their hides. sevenstring.org profile my flickr page Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meccajay Posted February 13, 2004 Share Posted February 13, 2004 Originally posted by Super 8: Is anybody going to actually respond to Max's post, or are you just going to make smart-ass comments?Ok I was, but well, the "OutKast", "Roots" & "Black Music" portions of the post pretty much demand we make smart ass comments for a while... TROLL . . . ish. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doc taz Posted February 13, 2004 Share Posted February 13, 2004 Originally posted by meccajay: Originally posted by Super 8: Is anybody going to actually respond to Max's post, or are you just going to make smart-ass comments?Ok I was, but well, the "OutKast", "Roots" & "Black Music" portions of the post pretty much demand we make smart ass comments for a while... He did keep them to the point, though. No elaboration needed here. Y'all can pick your brains all day long, but I'd think it best to leave it as it is. If you want to fight, go ahead, but it's silly. Can't we just learn to disagree respectfully? sevenstring.org profile my flickr page Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EXAGON Posted February 13, 2004 Share Posted February 13, 2004 During the last years, the show business has... collapsed Features Are Not An Opinion. (John Hope, 2003) http://johnhope.blogspot.com/ Addresse: UIPLPPICDSS Ufficio Internazionale Per La Presa Per Il Culo Dei Sbruffoni Statunitensi Att. Tua Sorella Codice Mavapigliatelindomo Pirla Chi Legge Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fantasticsound Posted February 13, 2004 Share Posted February 13, 2004 I can't verify this as the current way that NARAS runs the Grammy Awards show, but in the past the president of NARAS and other heavy hitters used their influence to peddle audio and production jobs for the show to their friends in the industry. Trouble was, they were in the wrong industry. Instead of having tried and true television savvy and experienced personnel run the show, they give it up to studio engineers and record producers. Year after year they haven't figured out that these are NOT people who understand audio in a broadcast context. Even post-production studio people don't necessarily know what it is to run a live broadcast or produce an awards show. This is just the latest in a long spectacle of embarrassing Grammy Awards shows. You'd think a show representing the music business and recording industries would be run with more sense. Next year maybe they'll hire professional broadcasters instead of practicing nepotism to their friends in the industry. BTW - You can search for threads about previous Grammy awards and read exactly the same comments, just different celebrities onstage. It's easiest to find me on Facebook. Neil Bergman Soundclick fntstcsnd Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salyphus Posted February 13, 2004 Share Posted February 13, 2004 Take it to the Grammies forum Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fantasticsound Posted February 13, 2004 Share Posted February 13, 2004 Originally posted by SaloSicle: Take it to the Grammies forum Why?!?!? It's clear NARAS has no intention of cleaning up their act where awards and awards shows are concerned. This ain't new, Sal. Hell, a group acknowledged by many as the greatest rock band of all time never won a grammy... What does that say about the history of this organization. Also, the acronym is National Association of Recording Arts & Sciences... yet somehow it took them 40 years to recognize more than 2 engineering and 2 producting awards, while artists received awards for pop, rock, jazz, r&b, rap, blues, spoken word and other categories. I have little respect for NARAS beyond the educational endowments they give and the educational programs they run. The main thrust of NARAS is a bad joke. It's easiest to find me on Facebook. Neil Bergman Soundclick fntstcsnd Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salyphus Posted February 13, 2004 Share Posted February 13, 2004 I was talking to the OP! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salyphus Posted February 13, 2004 Share Posted February 13, 2004 BTW Neil I agree with you completely that the Grammies are and have been a joke. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
not Cereal Posted February 13, 2004 Share Posted February 13, 2004 sal needs some antibiotics to kill the bowling ball that crawled up his ass today Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salyphus Posted February 13, 2004 Share Posted February 13, 2004 Grrrrrrr Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fantasticsound Posted February 13, 2004 Share Posted February 13, 2004 Sal.... It's easiest to find me on Facebook. Neil Bergman Soundclick fntstcsnd Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
schmoron13 Posted February 14, 2004 Share Posted February 14, 2004 first for max's comments on outkast, the roots and black music: outkast is a rap group. Sure, Andre sings mainly on his half of the album, but to dissalow singing in rap is ludicrous. Missy sings on EVERY track. Plus, "i like the way you move" definitely qualifies as a rap song. As for the roots, it's a lil more vague. Though they have singers in the band, and the band backs up a lot of other artists, if you listen to Phrenelogy (their latest album), every song ERRR track has "rap" on it. Just because they play live instruments doesn't mean it's not rap....case in point, Black Eyed Peas. I get the feeling that you complained that eminem won last year (or whenever) cause he's immitating "them der blackies" It all depends on how YOU define rap. if it's solely about some thug rapping about bling-blinging, and all the hoe's he's scored, all the while rapping over some lame 808/909 drums or a sample, then obviously Outcast/Black Eyed Peas/the Roots, ain't gonna fall in that genre. However, when you view rap as being social commentary, in a poetic verse with a mix of western and non-western music idioms, then it adheres to the notion of this being a rap's rennaisance. As far as the "Black music" issue, coming from a European background, I understand that race sensitivity is not so politically correct around the world, but since you're commentating HERE, you have to be a little careful with your word choices. First off, what is black music? Is it rap? hip-hop? r&b? jazz? rock and roll? I assume you mean hip-hop and rap, but generalizing "black music" is akin to someone saying, "gee I don't like country or polka...yeah, I hate white music." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Franknputer Posted February 14, 2004 Share Posted February 14, 2004 Boy, somebody stepped in it... I think we can give Max a teeny break here. He's entitled to his tastes, and it's looking like people are starting to read stuff into his comments. Notice, for instance: Shmoron13: As far as the "Black music" issue... First off, what is black music? Is it rap? hip-hop? r&b? jazz? rock and roll? I assume you mean hip-hop and rap...But look at what Max actually said: Max: Kudos for Beyonce' as well, I don't like black music in general and much less I like heavily-trumpeted performers, but honestly speaking she earns all the money she's getting for the sheer amount of work she does. Now, that's not exactly dissin' somebody. He's saying that she reached him, even though he doesn't care for her style of music. Maybe his language was overly broad, but it doesn't seem like we should jump down his throat about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
schmoron13 Posted February 14, 2004 Share Posted February 14, 2004 ...but if we can't decontextualize others' comments and then give diatribes on completely esoteric tangents, what's the point of this forum?!!! and I got that he wasn't TRYING to come off as racist, but still... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Archer Posted February 14, 2004 Share Posted February 14, 2004 Originally posted by schmoron13: social commentary, in a poetic verse with a mix of western and non-western music idiomswell, um, doesn't that kinda describe about 90% of all pop music? Me and my two dogs, Remington and Winchester Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fantasticsound Posted February 14, 2004 Share Posted February 14, 2004 Originally posted by Christopher Kemp: Boy, somebody stepped in it... I think we can give Max a teeny break here. He's entitled to his tastes, and it's looking like people are starting to read stuff into his comments. Notice, for instance: Shmoron13: As far as the "Black music" issue... First off, what is black music? Is it rap? hip-hop? r&b? jazz? rock and roll? I assume you mean hip-hop and rap...But look at what Max actually said: Max: Kudos for Beyonce' as well, I don't like black music in general and much less I like heavily-trumpeted performers, but honestly speaking she earns all the money she's getting for the sheer amount of work she does. Now, that's not exactly dissin' somebody. He's saying that she reached him, even though he doesn't care for her style of music. Maybe his language was overly broad, but it doesn't seem like we should jump down his throat about it.Originally posted by schmoron13: ...but if we can't decontextualize others' comments and then give diatribes on completely esoteric tangents, what's the point of this forum?!!! and I got that he wasn't TRYING to come off as racist, but still... Which is why I stuck to commenting on something all of us can agree on. The Grammy broadcast sucked, and it was pretty typical of previous Grammy broadcasts. It's easiest to find me on Facebook. Neil Bergman Soundclick fntstcsnd Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ani Posted February 14, 2004 Share Posted February 14, 2004 sal needs some antibiotics to kill the bowling ball that crawled up his ass today And where's that Jeebus at???? He's the bowling expert in these parts. [Ani ducks and runs for cover ] Back to the topic: Cut Rate Labor, Cut Rate Productions!!!! The less they spend on production, the more the stuff in their greedy pockets. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DWBass Posted February 14, 2004 Share Posted February 14, 2004 Dude, I was with you until this.......... Originally posted by Max Ventura: The nominations for Best Rap Album were a bit strange: apart from Missy Elliot and one other, the Outkast and the Roots only claim to Rap-ness was being black. The Roots sound just like The Clash, and Outkast is a wanna-be Prince-meets-british Electro. Kudos for Beyonce' as well, I don't like black music in general and much less I like heavily-trumpeted performers, but honestly speaking she earns all the money she's getting for the sheer amount of work she does.....er..um..sounds like an underlying agenda or sumthin'! Maybe that's why you're a former tv tech/producer? Your attitude maybe? www.myspace.com/thefunkfather Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Henchman Posted February 14, 2004 Share Posted February 14, 2004 Wll, I thought Dave Matthews was pathetic. The guy shoudln't be allowed to get close to a microphone. And Beyonce was the most annoyin vocalist of thr evening. Notice Ididn't call her a singer, because doing vocal excersises to music is not singing. IMDB Credit list President George Washington: "The government of the United States is in no sense founded on the Christian Religion." President Abraham Lincoln: "The Bible is not my book, nor Christianity my religion." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DWBass Posted February 14, 2004 Share Posted February 14, 2004 Originally posted by Henchman: Well, I thought Dave Matthews was pathetic. The guy shoudln't be allowed to get close to a microphone. And Beyonce' was the most annoying vocalist of the evening. Notice I didn't call her a singer, because doing vocal excersises to music is not singing.OK....so what entertains you?? I guess the few million folks who bought her record don't dig her vocal style either?! www.myspace.com/thefunkfather Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.