hitting the high e string on 5th string major bar chords?

[Creamer298]

I've been playing guitar on and off for the past 7 years of my life (mainly on for the past two), and one thing i still cannot pull off is hitting the high E string when i play major chords on the A string (like a D on the 5th fret, etc). I cannot hit the 5th (or A, in the case of the D). My ring finger is always slightly touching the string and there seems to be nothing I can do about it...

 

Does anyone know any stretches or something I can do to remedy this? Or is this even commonly possible? Also I don't have short fingers so that isn't the problem.

[Caevan O’Shite]

OK, I assume that you're barring with your 1st/index-finger across all the strings at the 5th-fret, and your 3rd/ring-finger across the "middle" three strings (2nd, 3rd, & 4th) at the 7th-fret, and that it's touching the 1st-string...

 

Try using your 4th/"pinkie"-finger instead for the latter, it should afford you a little more "breathing room" for the strings for several reasons.

 

Also work towards using as light a pressure with your fretting-hand fingers as possible.

 

From the forearm, slightly roll your 1st/index-finger back so that a little more of its outside-side is pressing against the strings- this requires less muscle-pressure as the bending of the fingers joints is reduced and the finger is automatically stiffer. Picture one of those toy snakes with all the joints that allow it to bend and sway sideways, but remains rigid vertically- your finger is sort of like that.

 

Consider taking a lesson or two with a really top-flight instructor, too- a good guitar instructor should be able to immediately spot what is and isn't working for you in your technique, posture, etc.

[Fingerstyle_Jim]

When I really want that string to ring I play it like this(using D as an example): 1st finger - barre 5th fret, muting the top string with the tip of the 1st finger; 2nd finger - 7th fret, 4th string; 3rd finger - 7th fret, 3rd string; 4th finger(pinky) - 7th fret, 2nd string. It takes some work to get fluid with this but it works. Fans of Rush can latch on to one of Lifesons favorite moves, hinge the first finger upward, still fretting the 5th string but letting the 1st string ring open. This sounds cool at several frets up and down the neck(see "Spirit of Radio).

 

Jim

[A String]

Try holding the chord, more on a diagonal, so the barre is near the 4th fret on the high E and near the fifth fret on the A string. Nothing drastic mind you, but it will afford you a tiny bit more room. Make sure the ring finger is as close to the A string as it can get, without touching it. Lastly, make sure that ring finger is bending at the first knuckle so it's clearing the high E.

 

If you haven't done so already, look into taking lessons, even one or two, just to have a pro help you with your technique.

[Eric Iverson]

I agree that hand position makes a lot of difference. If you can find an efficient way to do things, it makes life a lot easier!

[Caevan O’Shite]

Also...

 

How's the set-up on your guitar? What guitar are you using, and what strings (and gauges)?

[G. A. Donis]

I have the same problem. I deal with it in two ways. Either I just don't worry about it (especially during hard rockin' power chord type songs) or I barre A-E strings with my index finger (5th fret for a D), barre D & G strings with my ring finger (7th fret) and then fret the B string with my pinky (7th fret). I usually only do that when I'm playing something clean or doing arpeggios.

 

I've seen guitarists that could bar with their ring finger and have enough range of motion in their knuckle to get it out of the way but I'm not one of them. I'm also a 3 finger open A chord type. I read an interview with someone who stated that you should never use more than one finger to fret the different strings on the same fret. I don't remember who said that but they must have been double jointed.

[d halfnote]

I think this is something that comes down to a certain flexibility that must be established while young.

I had a friend who could play that 2-finger form well, with his finger bending backward & I could do it for a bit when younger but my fingers, while still adept, have lost that flexibility since I didn't exploit or maintain it.

 

However it is possible to do so if one works at it.

You can do that as an exercise away from the guitar simply by prssing the fingertip against the palm of your hand or your thumb. Think of it as a musicianly "mudra"

Over time the pressure will tend to loosen the joint, though the rapidity of results will correspond to how well you can do the form already.

 

As Caevan suggests, there may be ceratin setups or guitars that make this easier, e.g., it's harder on a guitar with a flatter, classical-style neck or high action than one with a pronounced radius, etc.

[Caevan O’Shite]

"...there may be certain setups or guitars that make this easier, e.g., it's harder on a guitar with a flatter, classical-style neck or high action than one with a pronounced radius, etc."

 

Yhup! A fretboard with a curvier, smaller radius and the higher strings set to match will allow more elbow-room there, as the fret- and the string- arcs downward and away towards the side.

 

That also makes it easier to fret barres in general, with less pressure required in the middle of the fretboard.

[Scott Fraser]

When I really want that string to ring I play it like this(using D as an example): 1st finger - barre 5th fret, muting the top string with the tip of the 1st finger; 2nd finger - 7th fret, 4th string; 3rd finger - 7th fret, 3rd string; 4th finger(pinky) - 7th fret, 2nd string. It takes some work to get fluid with this but it works.

Jim

 

This is what works for me, since my ring finger last joint doesn't bend backwards at all. Often, though, I just do the ring finger barre & leave off the high E string, since the fifth is already in the chord an octave lower. The real harmonic interest in any chord is going to be in the 3rds, 6ths, 7ths, & 9ths anyway, not the 5th. A variation on this voicing is to play the third in root position with your ring finger & a barre with the first finger. So for the D major it's 3rd finger 9th fret on the A string with the first finger barring the 7th fret, leaving off the high E. It's just a little harmonically richer than the power chord version.

 

Scott Fraser

[d halfnote]

If it's really difficult one could perhaps develop another specialty tuning [5-1-5-1-3-5] & work from there...

[02R96]

As another person who as trouble with barr chords, I was wondering...

 

Would the best neck then be one with a small radius (say 9.5), tall frets and low action?

 

 

[Caevan O’Shite]

As another person who as trouble with barr chords, I was wondering...

 

Would the best neck then be one with a small radius (say 9.5), tall frets and low action?

 

 

I kinda think that it's too subjective to say either way, "YMMV" and all! Too many variables to say one way's best. But in general, some radius seems to work better for chording for most folks.

 

I really, REALLY like a conical or "compound" radius, where things start out at the nut/1st-fret with a smaller radius for a more pronounced curvature, and progressively get flatter and flatter with larger and larger radii as you go up the fretboard. This not only puts a rounder radius where you want it the most, in the lower frets, it makes for cleaner bending as the higher frets above the bend are flatter in the middle, allowing for more clearance for the bent string. And on top of that, the radius presented to the picking-hand by the arc described by the strings near the bridge is flatter yet- a little more like that of a classical style design, and particularly nice for fingerstyle. The only drawback that I could foresee might be that some slide players might prefer a uniform radius along the entire length.

[d halfnote]

I think the relevant point here has to do with the arc of the baord & strings allowing a little more space for that 3rd finger to rise above the 1st string in this particular situation but my personal opinion is that some degree of arc to the fretboard makes the hand's grip of the guitar more relaxed...& that's a good thing.

 

Commenting on Caevan's remark about slide...

Everyone has their tastes (I'm already the odd man out with my prefference for standard tuning) but I like an arc to the strings for slide; it makes it easier to play selected strings & the degree of pressure to get several at once is neglegible enough that it doesn't cause any intonation problems.

[Fingerstyle_Jim]

Some days I jump from a twelve-string to a classical to various solid body electrics and a few dreadnoughts and find I can play these barre chords the way I described in my earlier post on all of these guitars. It's just taking the time to learn to play them, some tedious and boring practise, but it pays off. If you ever want to play "Pinball Wizard", or several other Who tunes this is the way to go.

 

Jim

[Caevan O’Shite]

Hey, I was foolin' around with this stuff on my guitar last night; I find that the lower the guitar is, whether sitting or standing, the more drastically the wrist must be bent in order to best position the fretting-hand for barre-chords.

 

If you position the guitar higher, and over the leg closest to the neck (the left-leg, if you're right-handed), more like a classical or jazz guitarist would, adjusting the strap to raise it, you can push forward with your forearm and get more clearance and slightly roll the index-barre the way I described earlier, with less bending at the wrist.

 

This allows for more clearance of the 1st-string when fretting those 5th-string-root/"A"-shape barre chords, and it also lightens up on muscle-tension, and tendon problems that can lead to carpal-tunnel and tendinitis.

[A String]

Hey, I was foolin' around with this stuff on my guitar last night; I find that the lower the guitar is, whether sitting or standing, the more drastically the wrist must be bent in order to best position the fretting-hand for barre-chords.

 

If you position the guitar higher, and over the leg closest to the neck (the left-leg, if you're right-handed), more like a classical or jazz guitarist would, adjusting the strap to raise it, you can push forward with your forearm and get more clearance and slightly roll the index-barre the way I described earlier, with less bending at the wrist.

 

This allows for more clearance of the 1st-string when fretting those 5th-string-root/"A"-shape barre chords, and it also lightens up on muscle-tension, and tendon problems that can lead to carpal-tunnel and tendinitis.

 

Great point Caev!

 

Yeah, the thing is, we really can't see how you are holding your guitar or how you are fretting the strings. From here, we can just guess. You really do need to get a pro to look at you play a bit and see if you can get some pointers on holding the guitar correctly.

[Caevan O’Shite]

Yeah, even just one or two lessons with a really good instructor could make a huge difference for you.

 

Kinda like when people go on a chartered fishing boat trip for the day with pros out on the Gulf. Only cheaper!

[d halfnote]

Hey, I was foolin' around with this stuff on my guitar last night; I find that the lower the guitar is, whether sitting or standing, the more drastically the wrist must be bent in order to best position the fretting-hand for barre-chords.

 

If you position the guitar higher, and over the leg closest to the neck (the left-leg, if you're right-handed), more like a classical or jazz guitarist would, adjusting the strap to raise it, you can push forward with your forearm and get more clearance and slightly roll the index-barre the way I described earlier, with less bending at the wrist.

 

This allows for more clearance of the 1st-string when fretting those 5th-string-root/"A"-shape barre chords, and it also lightens up on muscle-tension, and tendon problems that can lead to carpal-tunnel and tendinitis.

 

That's a great observation in regard to this particular situation, Caevan!

 

Also, for the reasons that you mention in your last paragraph (& despite Jimmy Page, Johnny Ramone, Blank 182, et al) that's how we should all be holding the guitar anyway.

[Eric Iverson]

On acoustic guitar, I sometimes find it difficult to play those "A" form barre chords and get all notes clean, because the second joint of my third finger falls in JUST the wrong place. So I barre those notes with my little finger, and it sounds good, and no one has ever complained.

On electric it's not a problem.

But I'm not a huge fan of regular barre chords anyway, so I find other ways to do things (chord voicings) on acoustic, and I think it actually sounds better! Especially in a band with keyboard, bass and maybe another guitarist - you don't have to hit ALL those notes!

[Scott Fraser]

Hey, I was foolin' around with this stuff on my guitar last night; I find that the lower the guitar is, whether sitting or standing, the more drastically the wrist must be bent in order to best position the fretting-hand for barre-chords.

If you position the guitar higher, and over the leg closest to the neck (the left-leg, if you're right-handed), more like a classical or jazz guitarist would, adjusting the strap to raise it, you can push forward with your forearm and get more clearance and slightly roll the index-barre the way I described earlier, with less bending at the wrist.

This allows for more clearance of the 1st-string when fretting those 5th-string-root/"A"-shape barre chords, and it also lightens up on muscle-tension, and tendon problems that can lead to carpal-tunnel and tendinitis.

 

This is how John Stowell holds the guitar, very high, with the neck almost vertical, so his fretting hand is almost in a cello fingering configuration. This makes it possible for him to hit those incredibly gnarly voicings he's known for, voicings which most normal hands in normal position just can't stretch to. Doesn't look sexy on stage but allows for greater playability.

 

Scott Fraser