StoneinaPond Posted September 4, 2003 Share Posted September 4, 2003 [quote] I figured out the Dems agenda, they are stacking Amendments(Pork) on the "No child left behind" bill. Then turning around publicly and saying that the Republicans wont pass the bill because their "Evil" [/quote]Stop knee-jerk reacting. It's boring. The reason Democrats are loading the bill is to prevent its passage because they think it is a bad bill. Many states with large rural populations will get into trouble if this bill is passed. So much so, that several have reluctantly confessed that at some point they will have to sue the government if the bill is enacted. My understanding of the bill is cursory at best, but from my perspective the whole issue smacks of the same inept, ideology-laden bungling that characterized our excursion into Iraq. Yorik Stone In A Pond "Man will occasionally stumble over the truth, but most of the time he will pick himself up and continue on." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pantonality Posted September 4, 2003 Share Posted September 4, 2003 I sell to education so I know a bit about the No Child Left Behind issue. The problem with no child left behind is the same with many of Bush's initiatives. It's an unfunded mandate. It mandates testing, administration of testing, record keeping, and a whole slew of administrative actions, but provides far too little funding for those activities. If passed school districts will have to face yet more difficult choices, because it will necessitate fewer teachers and more administrators. Is that really what Republicans want? It will necessitate teaching the test or as has already happened reducing the acceptable score. Is this really what Republicans want? I cover two rural states. It's not that teachers don't want to do a better job. It's just that they don't want to waste precious resources filling out MORE paperwork for Washington. They're dealing with limited local budgets, falling enrollments, contracting districts and no funding to pay for the extra requirements from the Feds. That's typical of Bush, force local governments to raise taxes to pay for stuff required by the Feds. And you thought Bush gave you a tax CUT!!! HAHAHA. Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wow Posted September 5, 2003 Share Posted September 5, 2003 [quote] The reason Democrats are loading the bill is to prevent its passage because they think it is a bad bill [/quote]Exsqueeze me ? Kennedy wrote the bill. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Griffinator Posted September 5, 2003 Share Posted September 5, 2003 Most Dems, contrary to popular belief, hate Ted Kennedy as much as you do, Wow... A bunch of loud, obnoxious music I USED to make with friends. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wow Posted September 5, 2003 Share Posted September 5, 2003 [quote] Most Dems, contrary to popular belief, hate Ted Kennedy as much as you do, Wow... [/quote]I dont hate Kennedy, I FEAR Kennedy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dogfur Posted September 5, 2003 Share Posted September 5, 2003 [b]Originally posted by GZsound: See... here is a prime example of good thinking being destroyed by political dogma. [/b] You've got to be kidding, right? I just wanna hold people accountable for their actions under the same laws, whatever their political persuasion. This should be good, lets see where you go with it... [b]Think about what you just suggested. Impeaching and jailing Bush would start a reform and bring a round of rethinking corporate greed? [/b] Well, not quite that simply, but yeah - hold the highest officer of the land accountable for his actions up to, and including, criminal prosecution involving the same penalties as the populace. [b] Come on, you cannot possibly be that naive.[/b] You'd be surprised...I'm a dork from way back! [b] Impeaching Clinton has no effect on corporate greed did it? Enron was cooking the books, Global Crossing was cooking the books, Arthur Anderson was the chief book cooker. [/b] Well, you've got a point there - although blowjobs in the White House have dropped off the map, unless the twins are in town... Actually I wouldn't be surprised if political perjury instances did drop post-impeachment of the Big Dog. Remember all the roaches that came scurrying out of the woodwork when Larry Flynt was going to publish stories about legislators who had some skeletons to hide. I would remind you of the EXTREME scrutiny the previous president was put under in all aspects of his life during that GOP witch hunt, and despite his slimyness (sp?) managed to squeak through. The current monkey-president simply could not go under oath about anything except maybe good strip bars in Houston without perjuring himself. [b]No matter what you do to anybody, it will not send a message to anybody, especially corporations. Any more than it will send a message to government to stop wasting money, stop spending on stupid programs, etc. [/b] What a dark corner of the world you reside in Sir..Let me introduce you to my friends hope and integrity. They have been MIA for a while, but if the people can renew their ties with these old friends they can move mountains...It's not that hard a concept really. [b]And please remember that if there was proof Mr. Bush committed a crime, the democratic congress would try to impeach him so fast it would make your head swim. Any idea why it's only the extreme left wing loonies claiming he has committed impeachable crimes? Please try to offer suggestions that would actually work.[/b] A couple of points: I think its cute you think that there are two political parties, kinda like watching the crowd at a WWF wrestling match - It's not entertainment if the audience doesn't get into the "suspended reality" of it all. I actually very seriously miss when I lived in that world where my government was full of integrity and pride, the local businesses were strongholds of the community, and we all were a flag waving chorus of the goodness cheering on the 'Ol USA, the greatest nation on earth. Yep, those were the days...I will have them back, but we've got work to do. Congratulations, you have just referred to about 70% of the people involved in this thread as "left-wing loonie". Some may excuse it as energetic and lively alternate opinion. In my neighborhood we call this "paranoia" when you think nearly everybody around you is out to get you because they have different ideas about stuff. [b] First you agree that we need to make all entities accountable. You agreed with me that corporations, unions, governments, etc. all need to have some control put on their spending. The issue is how to make that happen. [/b] Aahh, common ground we have between us. [b] And putting Jesse Jackson in jail for fraud, theft, blackmail, etc. will not have any effect on bogus "civil rights advocacy" groups..[/b] I don't know that and you don't know that, so lets stop your conjecture right now. I am unaware of the charges you make against Rev. Jackson, but if in fact he is guilty of the charges you make, I would definitely like his community to hold him accountable to the same laws that they answer to. I don't see how you possibly think that if the Rev. Jackson did some time in the pokey that Rev. Johnson down the street might think twice about doing the same underhanded shit. [b]see the point? Putting Jim and Tami Baker in jail didn't stop bogus television evengalists from ripping off the public did it?[/b] Again I don't have the stats, but I would certainly think that TV preachers who were embezzling funds from their "church" would probably find out how the Bakers' were caught, and avoid it themselves. Perhaps by even going straight! [b]You should not be half rational...[/b][/QUOTE] I would settle for 30% most days... Best, Dogfur Woof! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ren. Posted September 5, 2003 Share Posted September 5, 2003 Bush is gonna... 1. Keep being the president. 2. Finish his period. 3. Lose the reelection. 4. Retire to his dude ranch. Can we move on? :D Who Put The ' M ' In MySpace? don\'t_click | day_job Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wow Posted September 5, 2003 Share Posted September 5, 2003 [quote]And putting Jesse Jackson in jail for fraud [/quote]The "Shake Down King" will never go to jail. They need to take his "Tax Free" status away from him though. Non-partisan my ass. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GZsound Posted September 5, 2003 Share Posted September 5, 2003 Guys, guys, guys.. here is some disapointing news for you all. 1. There are many, many rabid angry democrats in Washington that would love to throw Mr. Bush in jail. These folks have power, are in the senate and congress, are in the courts, etc. Do you think they might be smarter about laws Mr. Bush has supposedly broken than you are? Do you think they would leap at the chance to impeach him? If he has done something illegal he should be punished. No politician is above the law..period. Bill Clinton should have remembered that when he was under oath. 2. The largest things that effect your daily lives, your income, etc. are totally beyond the control of the president. Your local state legislature, your congressmen, senators, etc. all work really hard to take more of your money...period. The president can only propose legislation..not enact it. 3. The cool thing about America is we get to have a bloodless coup every four years. If any of you are so naieve as to think a democratic president will suddenly cure all the world ills.. get out and vote. quitcherbitchin.... Mark G. "A man may fail many times, but he isn't a failure until he begins to blame others" -- John Burroughs "I consider ethics, as well as religion, as supplements to law in the government of man." -- Thomas Jefferson Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peake Posted September 5, 2003 Share Posted September 5, 2003 Here's a months-old article on Bush claims regarding Iraq, and what it might mean to him for having said them. http://writ.news.findlaw.com/dean/20030606.html "We know that the regime has produced thousands of tons of chemical agents, including mustard gas, sarin nerve gas, VX nerve gas." "We've also discovered through intelligence that Iraq has a growing fleet of manned and unmanned aerial vehicles that could be used to disperse chemical or biological weapons across broad areas. We're concerned that Iraq is exploring ways of using these UAVS for missions targeting the United States." Cincinnati, Ohio Speech October 7, 2002 Give me the ANALOG and no one gets HURT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peake Posted September 5, 2003 Share Posted September 5, 2003 From the same article: "Intelligence gathered by this and other governments leaves no doubt that the Iraq regime continues to possess and conceal some of the most lethal weapons ever devised." Address to the Nation March 17, 2003 Give me the ANALOG and no one gets HURT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peake Posted September 5, 2003 Share Posted September 5, 2003 Those quotes are half a year apart. They were drumming WMD into our heads for half a year. They could have improved military intelligence in half a year. This is the result of a half year's military intelligence? And Bush tried to invade Iraq without Congressional approval, IIRC? Give me the ANALOG and no one gets HURT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wow Posted September 5, 2003 Share Posted September 5, 2003 Peak, You are setting your own self up. :idea: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peake Posted September 5, 2003 Share Posted September 5, 2003 Ooookay.... Give me the ANALOG and no one gets HURT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint Johnny B Posted September 6, 2003 Author Share Posted September 6, 2003 No Nukes or missles today, just more of Bush and Cheney's lies, forged documents, and sure-thing, billion dollar contracts for their oil friend, butt-buddies. Interesting how Bush and Cheney will rob the taxpayers blind. My thanks to all those who voted. :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super 8 Posted September 6, 2003 Share Posted September 6, 2003 Are you dumbasses getting anything out of the threads on the dangers of partisanism??? Stop regurgitating the same points over and over again... Super 8 Hear my stuff here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alcohol Posted September 6, 2003 Share Posted September 6, 2003 JohnnyB, :thu: Some people just hate to be reminded that they were suckered. Tough! "The hottest places in hell are reserved for those who in a period of moral crisis maintain their neutrality." [Dante Alighieri] (1265-1321) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peake Posted September 7, 2003 Share Posted September 7, 2003 This "war" and "terrorist" thing is a tad more important than a blow job in the oval office. And it's far from resolved. Give me the ANALOG and no one gets HURT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Griffinator Posted September 7, 2003 Share Posted September 7, 2003 Indeed. Some people just can't handle the idea that they were wrong... A bunch of loud, obnoxious music I USED to make with friends. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super 8 Posted September 7, 2003 Share Posted September 7, 2003 [quote]Originally posted by alcohol: [b]JohnnyB, :thu: Some people just hate to be reminded that they were suckered. Tough![/b][/quote]Grow up, Alcohol... Last I checked we are all in this together. And there's no prize for winning the debate. I do find it really annoying to for Johnny B to endlessly repeat the same thing. I find it just as annoying that some of you think it's vital to all of us that he do that. It's not because it reminds me daily of how much I can stand the 'truth' or because I feel I've been 'suckered'. It's mostly because I get tired of people who think that their voice is more important than everyone else's voice. That they have the right to go around taunting other people. That pisses me off. It doesn't matter WHAT it is either... Could be "PC is better than Mac"... "The 70's ruled, the 80's sucked"... Whatever! Just shut up about it all ready! We KNOW where you stand! Droning on and on about the same thing does nothing. If you want to limit this issue to the current administration, then you are the one who is being 'suckered'. You and Johnny B (among others) seem to have some notion that getting rid of Bush gets rid of the problem. That's pretty short-sighted. I think the Democrats would certainly like to see that view perpetuated. If only it were true... Super 8 Hear my stuff here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anomaly Posted September 7, 2003 Share Posted September 7, 2003 It is easier to go to one consistent extreme or another than to remain in the center of political tension. To think that any politician can be blamed for any of the aforementioned is just plain shallow logic. This is a big world with a lot of people in it. Anytime there is instabilility, there is opportunity for the greedy to profit and profit they will. There is no conspiracy. Leaders make right and wrong decisions every day. The pieces eventually get picked up. Russia and the ex-Soviet bloc countries are still sorting out the problems brought forth by change from fifteen years ago. As for the economy: To think that any politician is going to step in there and solve the selfish, irresponsible spending habits of 250 million people with anything but a band aid is laughable. As long as you pick a side, you are not going to base your opinions on facts. Been there, done that. Truth is in the center and it isn't found in compromise...it is found in accepting the truth-not manipulating the truth to support what you want it to support. I just read 4 pages of largely political bias from both side of the fence. If you print this thread out and save it for ten years you will see just how meaningless all of our opinions really are in the grand scope of things. I've been around for ten administrations now and I can tell you, it's just the way it is. Wanna make a difference? Take your guitar and go down and visit some dying kids in the children's ward of your local hospital and sing to them. Or go to a nursing home and sing to some of those folks. And while you're there, ask them if all this left/right rep/dem pro war/antiwar is worth investing your time in. Gotta go, I got some music to play...now, that's important. ;) ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peake Posted September 7, 2003 Share Posted September 7, 2003 [quote]Originally posted by Anomaly: Wanna make a difference? Take your guitar and go down and visit some dying kids in the children's ward of your local hospital and sing to them.[/quote]I think that there's something in the Patriot Act making that illegal. I'm semi-joking as relates to receding freedoms. Give me the ANALOG and no one gets HURT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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