teashea

I was very interested to read this. I just ordered an Artis 7 yesterday. It seems like a very capable instrument. I was considering an SP6 or Forte but after consideration, the Artis 7 was the right one for me. Enjoy performing. I would like to see some videos of your performances.

I was wondering about that, because although I wasn't sure I was remembering correctly, I thought that I was indeed able to load Double Leslie PC3 programs into the Artis7, so thanks for confirming that. But as you say, just being able to load them in doesn't necessarily mean they sound the same, and since Dave is saying that the Artis7 doesn't support the Double Leslie effect, it could well be that the program loads but the full effect isn't there. It seems counter-intuitive since the Artis7 and the PC3 both have 16 fx units, so one would think that the fx capabilities of the two would be identical, but I guess there are other architectural differences that are preventing the DL effect from working on the Artis7. I listened carefully to the sound files that Kurzweil has on its website for the organ sounds for the Forte, SP6 and Artis 7. To me they are indistinguishable. After quite of bit of consideration I have decided to order an Artis 7 today.

Good to know - thanks.

That is a significant factor. I have some digital organs where the speed up / slow down is adjustable.

Are you saying that the difference between "standard" KB3 organ sounds and "double leslie" KB3 organ sounds is more than just the difference in the leslie sim? David, it is great to get information from the source - you. Makes it no easier to make a decision between the Forte and Artis 7 but it will result in a more informed decision. Thanks so much ------

The Artis does not have or use the "double Leslie" KB3 programs from the PC3. The SP6 does. I believe the Forte has a few of them that were added in recent OS updates. (They couldn't get them working at the time of release. I have been providing all of the PC3 double Leslie KB3 programs to any Forte owners who want them, free of charge.) The double Leslie versions are a good bit nicer. What is the double Leslie program?????? I don't know what that means. Is the rest of the Kb3 section the same/ Thanks in advance. I appreciate the information. Simply put, these are Kurzweil's "really good" KB3 programs. The name "double Leslie" just refers to the FX chain, became used by PC3 owners on forums and Facebook when it was released in an OS update years ago. (The FX chain uses a ton of FX resources but the result is a noticeably better Leslie simulation.) I won't torture you (or me!) with the technical minutiae...basically they use double the amount of processing power to achieve a better sound. The relevant info is: the Artis does not have 'em, the Forte and SP6 do have them. Maybe audio examples would best illustrate the difference: http://kurzweil.com/product/sp6/audio/#Organ http://kurzweil.com/product/artis7/audio/#Organs (Note the better organs are available for Forte but they're not featured in the Forte's website demos.) Thanks so much --- This is very helpful

The Artis does not have or use the "double Leslie" KB3 programs from the PC3. The SP6 does. I believe the Forte has a few of them that were added in recent OS updates. (They couldn't get them working at the time of release. I have been providing all of the PC3 double Leslie KB3 programs to any Forte owners who want them, free of charge.) The double Leslie versions are a good bit nicer. What is the double Leslie program?????? I don't know what that means. Is the rest of the Kb3 section the same/ Thanks in advance. I appreciate the information.

There are definitely differences. I think the sound set comparison is this: * Forte and Artis7 both have the complete PC3 sample set, and all PC3 programs are available online and can be loaded into either of them. * They both have the Kore64 sample set as well... however I don't know that the original full set of Kore64 programs are available online, so in terms of factory programs, you may be limited to the Kore64 programs that these boards happen to include. Kore64 sounds are primarily guitars, brass, woodwinds, and drums. (Also some synth sounds.) * Both have an updated (i.e. better than triple-strike) Steinway grand, but the Forte has the biggest version, Artis7 has the smallest version (Forte SE and SP6 have something in between). Larger versions employ more sample data, so may include more velocity layers or less sample stretching or looping... I'm not sure what the detailed differences are, though they are all derived from the same master sample set. * Kurzweil's other updated quality grand (Yamaha) is in the Forte at full size, in the Forte SE and SP6 at a smaller size, and not in the Artis7 at all. * Forte (and also Forte SE and SP6) also include an additional new sample set, which consists of Rhodes, Wurlitzer, Clav, Harpsichord, Orchestral Percussion, Celeste, Glockenspiel, Chimes, Bells and Crotales. These are not in the Artis7. (Of course, Artis7 still has these kinds of sounds, plenty of Rhodes/Wurli/Clav for example, but only the ones from the original PC3 sample set, and not the ones that use the improved sample set of the Forte/SP6.) A few other differences: Artis7 has the TP8 semi-weighted action. It's a good little guy, tiny footprint. The SP6 and Forte/Forte7 have hammer actions. (Albeit ones that are friendly for quick passages, but still hammer weighted) Forte7 and SP6 also have small footprints. SP6 has reduced versions of the Steinway and Yamaha pianos, Rhodes 73, Clav, Harpsi, Celeste and Glock. Forte has full versions of Steinway, Yamaha, Rhodes 73, Rhodes 77, Wurly, Clav, Harpsi, Celeste, Glock and assorted bells/chimes. Both Forte and SP6 have twice the FX power of Artis/PC3 and both have superior KB3 organs. Thank you for this information. The semi weighted keybed, as opposed to the fully weighted keybed, is actually an advantage to me. I am very interested in knowing more about the differences in the KB3 engine. That is important to me. I appreciate your help.

There are definitely differences. I think the sound set comparison is this: * Forte and Artis7 both have the complete PC3 sample set, and all PC3 programs are available online and can be loaded into either of them. * They both have the Kore64 sample set as well... however I don't know that the original full set of Kore64 programs are available online, so in terms of factory programs, you may be limited to the Kore64 programs that these boards happen to include. Kore64 sounds are primarily guitars, brass, woodwinds, and drums. (Also some synth sounds.) * Both have an updated (i.e. better than triple-strike) Steinway grand, but the Forte has the biggest version, Artis7 has the smallest version (Forte SE and SP6 have something in between). Larger versions employ more sample data, so may include more velocity layers or less sample stretching or looping... I'm not sure what the detailed differences are, though they are all derived from the same master sample set. * Kurzweil's other updated quality grand (Yamaha) is in the Forte at full size, in the Forte SE and SP6 at a smaller size, and not in the Artis7 at all. * Forte (and also Forte SE and SP6) also include an additional new sample set, which consists of Rhodes, Wurlitzer, Clav, Harpsichord, Orchestral Percussion, Celeste, Glockenspiel, Chimes, Bells and Crotales. These are not in the Artis7. (Of course, Artis7 still has these kinds of sounds, plenty of Rhodes/Wurli/Clav for example, but only the ones from the original PC3 sample set, and not the ones that use the improved sample set of the Forte/SP6.) Great information - thanks very much

The Forte is all aluminum except for plastic end-caps. Thanks for the information Jim. I appreciate it. Maybe I will rethink the Forte over the Artis 7.

I have been research which Kurzweil to purchase. I was originally looking at the Forte. I looked at the SP6 but eliminated it because of its plastic construction. Finially I have settled on the Artis 7. While it is an older platform than the Forte, the panel configuration is almost identical. The Forte screen is much larger and has twice the processing power but it costs more than twice as much (and I am still not clear if the Forte is plastic construction or not). There is a good selection of sound comparisons on Youtube between the Forte and the Artis 7. The differences, if any, are insignificant to me.

You are so correct. The current state of the best digital organs is so good that subjectivity takes over the evaluation.

I'm not sure adjustability is such a big deal in the broader market. It has often been said that many players never change the factory presets on their boards, and I would not be surprised if most clone-players never tweak the more deeply tweakable settings many of them have. And of course, a real tonewheel organ doesn't have so much typical end-usr adjustability either. That's probably a good thing, in that the SV1 tube was probably most useful in the low end of its range (and finer amounts of gradation there could have been helpful). I'd be curious to know how these EPs compare with SV1, and also how much of an improvement the tube can offer to the CX3 engine. I wonder again about how relevant that is in the broader market. Korg seems to have sold a lot of non-splittable SV1s, and Nord sold a lot of Electro 2/3/4, I'm curious what percentage of them are gigged by themselves vs. as part of multi-board rigs. I've definitely seen people gig with just an SV1 or just an Electro. FYI, my understanding is that the last CX3 was a Fatar TP-8O. (I actually preferred the earlier lipped version.) I agree with you. I don't see it becoming broadly popular. For certain players, including me, it is delightful. I continue to really like mine. And it has been flawless.

I have both direct and belt drive turntables. I think each is fine. I think the specific design is more important than that the particular mode. Most new turntables are belt drive. I suspect that this is because direct drive would be much more difficult and expensive to engineer and manufacture.

I have both direct and belt drive turntables. I think each is fine. I think the specific design is more important than that the particular mode. Most new turntables are belt drive. I suspect that this is because direct drive would be much more difficult and expensive to engineer and manufacture.

In my opinion there is no doubt that digital provides more faithful reproduction than vinyl. That being said I enjoy vinyl because I enjoy playing with the equipment. Thus I have 8 turntables ---

Yes, the manuals for the various Dexibells are very good. They reveal a lot about the the capabilities of each instrument. On the level of the basic engine, the engine in all of the Dexibells is the same with the same quad core processor. They also use the same sound sampling/modeling system. Each uses a different system of controls and layout of the functions. For example, the Classico L3 and the Combo J7 use different approaches to the controls. Each system works for the particular keyboard. As far as the Clonewheel section goes, I like it. And the motorized drawbars on the J7 are wonderful. I did not realize how good it would be to have these until I started playing mine. One of the other excellent things about the J7 and L3 is the build quality - very solid and excellent in all regards.

Well stated

The J7 can be split and layered. Split point is adjustable.

Yeah,,,, They really need to get some more high quality videos out there with good sound for the J7.

To address you main question about what clonewheels I have used, I also have a Legend, 2 Legend Lives, 2 XK5's, 5D, Stage 3, Mojo, C2D, 2 Numa Organ2's, Korg Vox Continental. Tom Which other high end clones have you played, which you feel it compares well to? Adjustability isn't really much of an issue. The sims in clones are typically highly adjustable (some more than others). But of course that doesn't mean you can adjust them to sound like a Vent. Again, I think it would be helpful to know which other clones you've used. I was not particularly impressed by the extra sounds in their P3 piano, particularly the EP sounds. Though there were also things I liked about the board, including its general operational interface. The J7 looks interesting. It would be nice if it were a bit stronger on the MIDI controller side (i.e. being able to store MIDI Program Changes in your user programs).

Some thoughts on the Dexibell Combo J7. The J7 is a 73 key combo organ, with its primary focus on emulation of a Hammond B3 family organ. It is a direct competitor to the Hammond SK1, Nord Electro 5D and Roland VR 730. There are over 100 sounds (instruments) in the J7. In addition to the B3 emulations, the J7 has an array of Vox, Farfia, electric pianos, acoustic pianos, synths and orchestral sounds. It weighs 22 pounds and has very solid construction with metal chassis and top panel and wood end panels. The controls are very secure, with very good feel. It is comparable in build quality to a Nord. Dexibell has one engine that powers all of it top keyboards. It uses a quad core processor and can generate 320 oscillators. Like all of its brothers, it has unlimited polyphony. Impressive. Taking advantage of this power the J7 uses sampling and modeling for its sounds. Instead of the usual 16 bit processing, it has 24 bit processing - which is a 256 times increase in the rate. In its sampling, Dexibell uses long sampling times. While most competitors have sampling rates of up to 5 seconds, the Dexibell sampling is up to 15 seconds (for lower bass notes). This minimizes or eliminates the need for looping. The control layout is thoughtful. There are knobs and buttons for most functions, divided into areas on the panel in a logical and useful manner. It does use menus for some functions, but the menus are first layer for most functions and do not require deep menu diving. This is a compromise. The J7 has substantially more tweekability than an Electro 5D or Stage 3. The most obvious difference in a J7 is the setup for the drawbars. They are motorized and always show the actual position of the organ sound that is playing. The feel is very good and they can always be moved manually. The motorization applies whenever a preset is used. The drawbars quickly move to the preset position so that a player knows at a glance what the setting is. As far as the reliability of the motorized drawbars, this is a mature technology that has been used for many years on high end recording consoles. Ok - now the meat of the issue. How is the sound? In a word - excellent. The combination of high quality sampling and modeling is executed very well. It is on par with other high end clones. The percussion, CV and Leslie sims are quite well done. I know that there is some question regarding the Leslie sim. The nice thing about this simulation is that it is highly adjustable. With just one menu level down, one can easily and quickly adjust a variety of parameters of the Leslie effect. The extra sounds are as good or better than any other clone I have used. The piano sounds are especially excellent. Well done Dexibell. Well done.

Just like the differences among different B3's family organs, the are differences between the Mojo and Legend (or Live). If one gets used to the sound of one, the other is going to sound questionable. It is a natural response. I find that it is difficult to determine if one sound is better than the other - just a little different. But I know that some players like a particular type of sound and will prefer one or the other.

I think that the action on my Live is quite good but this is so subjective. Players have very different opinions of a keybed action. I think that the Live is very solid and reassuring. There is no wobble in the keys and the sensitivity is good for me.

For some reason, I find that the pianos are playing better on the Electro 5D than they did on the Electro 3 or the Nord Stage 2-73. ... and, the Nord Stage 3 is the same as the Electro 5D in this regard. The piano are quite good - maybe not quite as good as a Dexibell though.