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El Superfly Grande
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Blankman: Any more news on the fretless 6 development?


spreadluv

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I was supposed to pick it up a couple days ago but something came up. I'm waiting to hear back from him, hopefully soon today...


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We finally connected today. Got my baby back. The maple lines look good as they should; the nut is nicer; the 6 luscious layers of epoxy make what was once just another piece of rosewood (a wood which I've always been pretty blah about visually) look very much more dramatic in grain and color contrasts - and the glossy sheen is like the Thor pics of Rosewood jobs. Topnotch!

Now the important stuff: sounds like it sustains forever, is very sensitive to nuance, plays with very low action and seems destined to last almost forever. Much thicker - and thicker looking - than what you'd find on a polycoated Pedulla.

I'll brag about how it looks and sounds more. After I look at it and play it more : }}}}


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Sweetness.

Where are the sound clips?

Where are the pics? \:D

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Wow, this is almost the exact same color as my old Modulus Prime 6



Hope the new coating is working for you. I've debated it, but I'm afraid to alter an instrument that much.

I think I subscribe to the Pino Palladino book, anyway: keep playing that fretless until you need to replace the fingerboard. I remember when BP did a cover story on him, and I think he said he's been through 3 or 4 fingerboards, and at the time had the fingerboard of an old double bass on his Stingray. I think I might try either another Pau Ferro board when it comes time to replace it, or maybe even go for a cocobola board.


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I'd love to see it now that it's done. And play it.

Congrats man, I know you were dyin' to get that thing back!

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To be frank...word.

(Looking forward to pics...)


spreadluv

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Glad to hear the good news. Let's have the full sound report when you can.

Tom


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H.G. Thor just sent me pictures of my recently-finished Alvarez RB30C acoustic-electric bass. It will be in the mail soon and I should have it sometime next week.





He said it actually took him longer and more work than he thought it would so he has updated his prices on his webpage, but he was cool enough to stick to the price he had quoted me at the beginning. Because the fretboard needed a little planing work, it came out to around $300 for the whole deal. Shipping from Utah to New York and back is a pain though!

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I came in cheaper, even with it being a Six, and with the cost of my hoity-toity, made-with-pure-wood-resins epoxy, and maple strips for the lines.

I just got through tastelessly playing on the low B and the high C strings. Wow, this B is killin' - now I'm thinking bad thoughts like low F#. My V-Bass will give my upward register extension anyway...


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'Course, I didn't bother to get the photos last night. Maybe that's part of the Thor price* ; }... I s'pose I should take some and get a new scanner - or get a digital camera. But my bass has a few other things to happen yet...
 
 
* I can almost hear your freakin' when you discover that your ABG looks BETTER than the photos : }


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I saw two pieces of highly-figured mahogany last night, freshly sawn from a tree in Brazil. Incredible!

But the cost was $800. They are going into an acoustic guitar. Shame. Much of their thickness will become wood dust.


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I just moved this from another thread:

Quote:
DONUTHOLE: I sense a different energy in the coated fretboard on a Pedulla. More vibration given back to the string from the harder surface. Do you find that with your Ibanez compared to when It wasn't coated or with other uncoated boards? What did you use? How did you do it? If you did it,that is.
Hey, I had forgotten to reply here and talking to Willie on the phone last night the subject of epoxy came up and it reminded me.

A lot of people think "a glassier sound" when they see a coated 'board, but I think that's only one possibility. The thing is with fretless, that the way you press in and use your stopping fingers determines really how wide a range of tones and envelopes you can achieve. And the feel of that beneath the fingers also has some subtle influence on the way you think of it AS you play, I suppose. Anyway, the rwange of sounds is a little more sustained perhaps, when considering not only the fundamental, but the overtones. It's just a little more lively. Though realize that I come from ebony which I think is superior for a bare 'board.

I like the somewhat expanded - or shifted anyway - range of tones available, don't feel I've lost anything and have gained in an area I consider useful. So when my war horse of a Carvin needs a 'board leveling (could be any day now - its got gazillion of hours and a fair amount of roundwound use), I'll have my friendly local luthier (actually have found a few but this guy is great) use the same epoxy, which I think is a fantastic product because of its flexibility. I've seen epoxy on other necks, with split marks and chips, along the edges and from truss rod or expansion/shrinkage changes, so the flexibility this stuff has I think is a real asset.


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I'm gonna have to photocop this neck when the strings are off. When I shoot it from any angle right now, I get too much mirroring - multiple images of the strings' reflections.


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Quote:
Originally posted by greenboy:
The thing is with fretless, that the way you press in and use your stopping fingers determines really how wide a range of tones and envelopes you can achieve.
Too many players associate the fretless sound with just slides, mwah, lyricism etc, and there is so much more to it than that. Because your fingers are stopping the note you have no much more control of the note's envelope, both in terms of the overall envelope and the envelopes of the individual harmonics. If you have a soft board, then you can only do so much to get more sustain, particularly of the higher overtones. If you have a hard board then you can let your left (and right) hand(s) control the damping you require.

My fretless has a polyurethane coating on the rosewood board. Not as hard as epoxy - probably not as hard as ebony - but it's holding up really well, especially considering the amateur job I did on defretting, filling, sanding and coating!

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While as a Ph.D. Chemist I am quite interested in different coating to improve a fretless neck, I remain most enthusiastic about the possibility of using a ridiculously hard (and currently fairly cheap) wood to make the fretboard. I am speaking of Ipe (Tabebuia serratifolia), sometimes known as Brazilian Walnut.

Ipe is the king of the JANKA scale (which measures the pounds of force needed to push an 11.28mm ball bearing half way into the board) at a whopping 3680 lbs Granted this is a bit subjective but Ipe is easily 2.5 times harder than "hardrock" maple (Acer saccharum), and its commonly used for decks (until they empty the Rainforest). While its a bit green/brown it stains and polishes well and I've even found some nice figured pieces in a pile of decking. Get ready to use a TON of sandpaper and elbow grease to radius sand it, its a bit like sanding marble...

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Originally Posted by tedmich
While as a Ph.D. Chemist I am quite interested in different coating to improve a fretless neck, I remain most enthusiastic about the possibility of using a ridiculously hard (and currently fairly cheap) wood to make the fretboard. I am speaking of Ipe (Tabebuia serratifolia), sometimes known as Brazilian Walnut.

Ipe is the king of the JANKA scale (which measures the pounds of force needed to push an 11.28mm ball bearing half way into the board) at a whopping 3680 lbs Granted this is a bit subjective but Ipe is easily 2.5 times harder than "hardrock" maple (Acer saccharum), and its commonly used for decks (until they empty the Rainforest). While its a bit green/brown it stains and polishes well and I've even found some nice figured pieces in a pile of decking. Get ready to use a TON of sandpaper and elbow grease to radius sand it, its a bit like sanding marble...


Great job resurrecting a zombie thread!!!! Your information about Ipe is interesting to me.
I recently converted a Warmoth Jazz neck to fretless, it has a black ebony fretboard. I filled the fret slots with white epoxy and carefully sanded everything down to 1200 grit, shiny and smooth.
I use Rotosound Trubass strings, they have a black outer surface (nylon) but are much more lively and bright than typical flatwound strings. No roundwound noise when you slide up or down and no wear and tear on the fretboard wood.


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.. hey, he got it in before passing the 16 year mark.

tedmich, I'm not saying that you are wrong in any way but one thing to consider with wood (or metal) is that hardest is not necessarily the best. Some things need a certain amount of "give" so they won't be brittle or cause other problems. One can also argue about "warmth" and weight which are subjective of course. You may also consider how things are affected by moisture, human and atmospheric, and how things age.

To summarize, as usual, I'm no help here.


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Originally Posted by KuruPrionz
q
I use Rotosound Trubass strings, they have a black outer surface (nylon) but are much more lively and bright than typical flatwound strings. No roundwound noise when you slide up or down and no wear and tear on the fretboard wood.

I also have tapes on my #1 fretless. Love it.

Here's a little fretless inside information: I have a low spot on the neck of two basses. I put some metal tape on the fingerboard at that spot, and problem fixed. The metal tape is for ducts....so it's "duct" tape, but it's not like the "Duck Tape" duct tape brand.
Much cheaper than sanding the whole thing down, and is reversible. Durability hasn't been an issue, even on my bass with GHS Brite Flats on it instead of nylon tape. YMMV, as my low spots are close to the nut and so string vibration hasn't been an issue in premature wear of the tape. But your low spot is probably in the same area, as that end of the stick is more sensitive to these kinds of things.

Color doesn't match, but so far nobody has asked my what's up with my bass....so situation normal.


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Originally Posted by Paul K
Originally Posted by KuruPrionz
q
I use Rotosound Trubass strings, they have a black outer surface (nylon) but are much more lively and bright than typical flatwound strings. No roundwound noise when you slide up or down and no wear and tear on the fretboard wood.

I also have tapes on my #1 fretless. Love it.

Here's a little fretless inside information: I have a low spot on the neck of two basses. I put some metal tape on the fingerboard at that spot, and problem fixed. The metal tape is for ducts....so it's "duct" tape, but it's not like the "Duck Tape" duct tape brand.
Much cheaper than sanding the whole thing down, and is reversible. Durability hasn't been an issue, even on my bass with GHS Brite Flats on it instead of nylon tape. YMMV, as my low spots are close to the nut and so string vibration hasn't been an issue in premature wear of the tape. But your low spot is probably in the same area, as that end of the stick is more sensitive to these kinds of things.

Color doesn't match, but so far nobody has asked my what's up with my bass....so situation normal.


No low spots here, Warmoth necks have a couple of steel (older like mine) or maybe now graphite - rods in the neck in addition to a substantial truss rod mechanism. Makes the neck a bit heavy but it is straight and has been straight since the late 80's. Plus being dense, it sounds better, more even response and sustain.


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Indeed, the tape thing is for one string in one fret position; not a whole-scale Buzzy-McBuzz.

I used to own a Warmoth bass, five string mongo huge neck. Totally great construction and attention to detail. And mine was heavy as a tank and NEVER needed seasonal truss rod adjustments.


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Originally Posted by Paul K
Indeed, the tape thing is for one string in one fret position; not a whole-scale Buzzy-McBuzz.

I used to own a Warmoth bass, five string mongo huge neck. Totally great construction and attention to detail. And mine was heavy as a tank and NEVER needed seasonal truss rod adjustments.

I've used tape for other "repairs". Also, the "baking soda crazy glue trick" for nut slots that somehow are too deep.
And other evil kludges. If it works, it works.

My main giggers all have Warmoth necks - a Strat (I scalloped it), a Tele and a P-J bass. I've got a baritone Tele with a Warmoth neck as well.
Quality stuff for the most part.


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Originally Posted by KuruPrionz
Also, the "baking soda crazy glue trick" for nut slots that somehow are too deep.
t.

Baking Soda and Crazy Glue is new to me. I've used pencil graphite and Crazy Glue. It was a total pain in the ass. Instead of building the slot higher it built the slot wider and I had to re-file it again anyway and do it all over. Currently I use a bit of wax paper for that hack.

In my #1 bass I put in a Warwick Adjustable Nut. Heaven, baby. All basses should come with that as standard. It's just better.


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Originally Posted by Paul K
Originally Posted by KuruPrionz
Also, the "baking soda crazy glue trick" for nut slots that somehow are too deep.
t.

Baking Soda and Crazy Glue is new to me. I've used pencil graphite and Crazy Glue. It was a total pain in the ass. Instead of building the slot higher it built the slot wider and I had to re-file it again anyway and do it all over. Currently I use a bit of wax paper for that hack.

In my #1 bass I put in a Warwick Adjustable Nut. Heaven, baby. All basses should come with that as standard. It's just better.

I've never used baking soda and crazy glue to fix a bass nut. On a guitar, you pile up some baking soda with a toothpick until the slot has about 1/32" high or a little higher filling the nut slot. Then a drop or two of crazy glue, let it dry and re-file the slot. It's not ideal but sometimes the guitar needs played that evening and there isn't time to either shim the nut from the bottom or make a new one.

Contingency trick to keep the wheels on the wagon.


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I saw that trick in a Dan Erlewine tip in an old StewMac catalog. It really works.



I'm a lot more like I am now than I was when I got here.




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