Who has a Moog Matriarch?

[dazzjazz]

Hi,

 

I"m thinking about a Moog Matriarch for my studio (not gigs) and would appreciate hearing from those who own one.

I"ve watched a lot of demos and I think it"s pretty unique. I hear it"s paraphony as an interesting limitation.

I"m aware some hidden settings are exactly that - and that seems to be an issue, but perhaps not a deal breaker.

 

Questions:

 

What do you most like about it?

What are its weaknesses?

Is it a 'forever" synth or something you"re likely to sell?

 

Thanks in advance

 

Darren

[Markyboard]

Except for modulars it"s probably the ballsiest Moog synth available, different from a mini although on some sounds you can get very close. But also way more versatile and works equally well as a self contained synth or one where you integrate it with external modules and such.

 

The keys feel wonderful but the velocity response sucks if you"re using it to control other midi gear. It"s almost impossible to generate low velocities. Velocity to CV works fine which is how I use it.

 

Up until a couple of months ago the hidden globals were frustrating. Since then Moog released a new version which allows editing globals via midi. There are 2 editors now available ( one I got to participate in) but either works well and the hidden parameters are no longer hidden - at least in a studio environment.

 

It"s easy to overdrive the mixer and filter, especially in paraphonic mode playing chords. I love paraphonic mode but it"s not a substitute for polyphonic. It"s another/ different flavor and I think people often make that mistake thinking they can get by with it for the 'wrong' purpose. Also the output isn"t as hot as other synths so there are times when the inclination is to turn up mixer levels and such. Better to boost the output externally.

 

I almost never sell synths, even if a 'better' model comes out so take this for what it"s worth. The Matriarch is going down with the mothership.

 

 

Edit: I have to add that one of my favorite features is the stereo filter combinations. Being able to "separate" the filters and route one to each output is awesome. The Voyager (and the Poly Evolver) also has this feature but the Matriarch takes it to the next level.

[mate stubb]

I don't own one but have played one several times. Its tone is awesome and up there with a good Mini. I have not bonded with many Moog synths (Moog One and Voyager for instance), but this one I liked a lot!

[dazzjazz]

Thanks Mark and Moe,

 

That"s encouraging information, especially the update to the hidden features and that it has cajones!

Disappointed to hear about the velocity curve but it wouldn"t be a major issue for me.

I should return to the store and spend more time with it - they retail at about $4000 Aussie dollars, so it"s a sizeable investment. Don"t get me started in the price of a new P5...!

[Markyboard]

You may also want to check out this Moog Sub- Forum for additional information. There are still some remaining bugs- nothing catastrophic imo but it's always good to be aware.

[GovernorSilver]

Hi,

 

I"m thinking about a Moog Matriarch for my studio (not gigs) and would appreciate hearing from those who own one.

I"ve watched a lot of demos and I think it"s pretty unique. I hear it"s paraphony as an interesting limitation.

I"m aware some hidden settings are exactly that - and that seems to be an issue, but perhaps not a deal breaker.

 

Questions:

 

What do you most like about it?

What are its weaknesses?

Is it a 'forever" synth or something you"re likely to sell?

 

Thanks in advance

 

Darren

 

Hi Darren,

 

1. The sonic versatility and flexibility thanks to 90 patch points. The basic tones of the oscillators and filters - I don't really care about exact reproductions of specific Moog models, but they have the Moog sound. Sequencer is more useful than expected and can record up to 4 notes in one step. Stereo delay sounds really good. I tested the MIDI velocity with some iPad apps - Ravenscroft 275, FM Player 2, etc. The velocity response seems reasonable to me, but that's only judging by iPad speakers, not running through a premium quality monitor system. Support for MIDI Tuning Standard with up to 27 user loaded tuning tables. 4 Patchbooks available from Moog website for patch ideas.

 

2. The global settings that require you to either the manual at hand or software like Chunk or the Web MIDI editor - otherwise it's impossible to tell what's what. 8 patch cables shipped with the Matriarch, which is admittedly more generous than the miserly 2 that I got with my Pro-1, but there are several patches in the Patchbooks that require 14 or more cables.

 

3. Sell? More likely to be pried from my cold, dead hands.

 

There's an interesting thread on the Moog subforum that Mark mentioned, about adjusting your chordal playing to the Matriarch's paraphony. The results you get from playing a chord can vary wildly depending on the oscillator register settings, waveform settings, etc. You could play a basic C major triad shape on the keys 4 times in a row and hear 4 different sounding chords. There's a Round Robin global parameter with 3 options to set the round robin behavior of the oscillators in paraphonic mode. In addition, there are other global parameters related to paraphonic behavior.

[dazzjazz]

Thanks Governor!

[GovernorSilver]

Plugged the Matriarch MIDI out into my Roland MC-101 and dialed up some acoustic and EP patches on the Roland.

 

Velocity response seems fine for me, even with soft notes. Ran the Roland through my cheap Mackie CR monitors. Volume was cranked all the way on both Roland and Mackie - one thing I picked up from practicing on electric guitar and reading Jim Hall's book was cranking the amp and trying to play as soft as possible to improve control over dynamics.

[Markyboard]

Plugged the Matriarch MIDI out into my Roland MC-101 and dialed up some acoustic and EP patches on the Roland.

 

Velocity response seems fine for me, even with soft notes. Ran the Roland through my cheap Mackie CR monitors. Volume was cranked all the way on both Roland and Mackie - one thing I picked up from practicing on electric guitar and reading Jim Hall's book was cranking the amp and trying to play as soft as possible to improve control over dynamics.

 

We all know keyboard feel is very subjective. But the midi data generated based on how much force is applied is not. Remember there are traditionally trained organist, pianist and everything in between. And then you have the bangers, percussionists and 1 finger trigger 'artists'.

 

Me saying the velocity response sucks or you saying it"s fine doesn"t really help anyone without additional information. I"m a trained pianist and use traditional (classical?) fingering on scales and such. As I said it"s near impossible to generate velocity values under 40 especially when making turns on black keys. I"m curious how this velocity data compares to that generated by your playing style.

 

For comparison the Andromeda and Voyager which use the same TP9/s keybed- no problem for me. In fact the Andromeda is the most velocity responsive synth I"ve ever played bar none noting my qualified playing style above.

 

The OP as a traditional B3 organist (I presume) may not care about velocity response at all. But he did ask for likes and dislikes.

[GovernorSilver]

Plugged the Matriarch MIDI out into my Roland MC-101 and dialed up some acoustic and EP patches on the Roland.

 

Velocity response seems fine for me, even with soft notes. Ran the Roland through my cheap Mackie CR monitors. Volume was cranked all the way on both Roland and Mackie - one thing I picked up from practicing on electric guitar and reading Jim Hall's book was cranking the amp and trying to play as soft as possible to improve control over dynamics.

 

We all know keyboard feel is very subjective. But the midi data generated based on how much force is applied is not. Remember there are traditionally trained organist, pianist and everything in between. And then you have the bangers, percussionists and 1 finger trigger 'artists'.

 

Me saying the velocity response sucks or you saying it"s fine doesn"t really help anyone without additional information. I"m a trained pianist and use traditional (classical?) fingering on scales and such. As I said it"s near impossible to generate velocity values under 40 especially when making turns on black keys. I"m curious how this velocity data compares to that generated by your playing style.

 

For comparison the Andromeda and Voyager which use the same TP9/s keybed- no problem for me. In fact the Andromeda is the most velocity responsive synth I"ve ever played bar none noting my qualified playing style above.

 

The OP as a traditional B3 organist (I presume) may not care about velocity response at all. But he did ask for likes and dislikes.

 

It was the first time I tested the Matriarch MIDI out with a hardware MIDI module. You may recall that in previous post I mentioned that I only tested Matriarch with softsynths (iPad). All I did was test and report my subjective results, my friend. I know better than to try to prove seasoned engineer and muso wrong without serious data.

 

I'm sorry you don't agree that our friend the OP would appreciate this informal report. I didn't mean to sound like I was challenging you.

 

Can I make up for it by buying you a beer next time?

[Markyboard]

Hey Paolo-

 

I was merely using your response as an excuse to preach my long held views on this often mis-represented aspect of keyboards. But I suspect you know that.

 

 

Can I make up for it by buying you a beer next time?

 

You know me all to well and of course I want to be fair; so make it 2.

:guinness:

[GovernorSilver]

Hey Paolo-

 

I was merely using your response as an excuse to preach my long held views on this often mis-represented aspect of keyboards. But I suspect you know that.

 

 

Can I make up for it by buying you a beer next time?

 

You know me all to well and of course I want to be fair; so make it 2.

:guinness:

 

Done deal!

[ProfD]

Hey Paolo-

 

I was merely using your response as an excuse to preach my long held views on this often mis-represented aspect of keyboards. But I suspect you know that.

 

 

Can I make up for it by buying you a beer next time?

 

You know me all to well and of course I want to be fair; so make it 2.

:guinness:

 

Done deal!

Count me in as well. Y'all bring the old broads, er, Matriarchs to the party.

[GovernorSilver]

If brother ProfD is in, I really gotta step up my Matriarch patching and playing games!

 

I should look into whether the new official Moog case for Matriarch will met me prepatch the Matriarch so it'll be ready to go, right of the case, for everyone to play. Meaning, will the case have enough room for cables already patched in....

 

I'll make sure to pick a KC friendly patch, not one too bloopy, lol.

[dazzjazz]

Thanks for the additional information about velocity.

While I mostly focus on organ these days, I"m a trained pianist - most of my undergraduate training was piano, for example.

I still play piano and practice on it for dexterity and endurance.

 

That said, I am glad I know that the velocity response of the Matriarch seems to be somewhat poorly implemented.

I probably wouldn"t use it as a controller much, but forewarned is...well you know.

 

Regards

 

Darren

[GovernorSilver]

That said, I am glad I know that the velocity response of the Matriarch seems to be somewhat poorly implemented.

I probably wouldn"t use it as a controller much, but forewarned is...well you know.

 

Regards

 

Darren

 

If you could try the Matriarch in a store, this is where bringing a small hardware synth module or IOS/Android device and MIDI cable/adapters would be handy unless you are confident the store will provide a MIDI sound module of some sort for your testing. As you saw upthread, Mark and I had different impressions of the velocity response. For me, it is ok enough to use as a controller for entering MIDI data into a sequencer with varying velocity values, instead all them set to exactly the same value. Also, I started learning "The Snow is Dancing" by Debussy and playing it with Matriarch MIDI velocity. I wouldn't claim the velocity response to be as sensitive as that of a well-maintained acoustic grand or anything, but for me, it's usable enough,

 

I do acknowledge that what might be poor for you or Mark may be ok for me. Also, I believe he has actual velocity value measurements while I don't.

[GovernorSilver]

I finished going through all 4 Patchbooks published by Moog Music. I skipped the 2nd half of the Lightbath one because it's all patches requiring external mult and external expression pedal - I'm not against those things, it's just I'm focused on learning what can be done on the Matriarch by its lonesome.

 

I started rewatching Cuckoo's tutorial. The idea of riding the Sustain fader on the Filter panel makes more sense to me now - it's yet another way of controlling dynamics while you play a chord or whatever with your other hand. This is based on watching around the 8-min. mark. The Multi Trig button also makes more sense to me know. You have to set the Filter and Amplitude envelopes, and the Envelope Amt. knob to certain settings to make the effect of Multi Trig more obvious.

 

[video:youtube]

[Markyboard]

The idea of riding the Sustain fader on the Filter panel makes more sense to me now - it's yet another way of controlling dynamics while you play a chord or whatever with your other hand.

 

Split the filters so that the amplitude ADSR controls filter 2. Use the filter separation control to differentiate filter 1/2 cutoffs. Then ride both sustains sliders in opposite directions This gives some really cool frequency dependent panning affects.

[dazzjazz]

Well, I finally bought a Matriarch! It"s my first Moog and I love the sound of it. It"s great to connect with those classic sounds I grew up hearing from Kraftwerk and Tangerine Dream. I haven"t even used any patch chords yetâ¦blown away!

 

Thanks for all the opinions on this thread.

 

Darren

[Studiotan]

Congrats! Moog really nailed it with this one. Its so much fun to play this keyboard

[Doerfler]

I bought a used one from a large retail chain 2 weeks ago. Had a few broken buttons so had to return it. (it was shipped to me, wasn't local to me). Really enjoyed the time I had with it.

 

Markyboard has had his for a few years now and I spend time with it whenever I am at his studio. Most excellent synth, IMO.

[dazzjazz]

I have a question for Matriarch owners:

 

I'm trying to get the sequencer to only play via MIDI and not having much success.

I have followed the instructions on page 65 of the manual, and switching Sequence Keyboard Control to 'Off'.

Unfortunately, the sequence still plays internally.

 

Any ideas?

 

Darren

[GovernorSilver]

Mine was sending MIDI from the sequencer, pretty much out of the box. I discovered that when I had it hooked up to my Roland MC-101 and wondering why the heck the MC-101 was playing sequenced riffs instead of what I was actually playing on the Matriarch keys.

 

Sorry, man, can't help much beyond that. Good luck.

[Doerfler]

I have a question for Matriarch owners:

Any ideas?

Darren

 

hey Darren -

 

there are quite a few helpful people on the Moog forum over at Moog Music that don't visit here. You might want to take a look over there. Hope this helps

[dazzjazz]

Thanks guys, I"ve posted over there but there"s nothing but tumbleweeds so farâ¦

[GovernorSilver]

For whatever reason Moog Music does not seem to maintain an active presence in their own forums.

 

I have heard they can be more responsive if you go to the corporate site and attempt to contact them via the popup chat window. That said, I have not had to contact them for support for quite some time.