Neo-Soul Keys Studio 2 for iPad

[nickd2]

For what it's worth, I'm running Neo Soul Keys happily on an iPad mini 5 (which I know is more recent than your iPad) - and it runs with no issues, and lots of fx, at 256 samples.

 

It can also happily run in the background while you use another app (I leave it on midi channel 1, and run the Moog Model D app on midi channel 2).

[drawback]

Thanks for the report - I think I'm gonna pull the trigger. I don't really need any crazy effects, just the basic rhodes, stereo tremolo, and maybe an occasional phase shifter or chorus.

I wonder how much better is this new version to my old one (first gen of Neo Soul Keys). I have the full package of Rhodes, Wurlie, Ex5 and Dyno piano, and it's already very good and solid.

 

Just to update some of my earlier thoughts, I"ve never been satisfied with Jamal"s presets in any of the Neo Soul Studio products and redesign the preset I like best to a Rhodes that works for me. Not to much surprise, then, I"ve found I end up in the same place after deep tweaking both NSKS and NSKS2.

 

Before you buy, do a practical comparison of the interface graphics on the App Store and see if you might want to start with the original Studio. The original app is much less complex with a completely different set of controls that are way more Rhodes-like and intuitive than the later version, which has a synth style interface and pretty clunky. The advantages to the later version are the huge leap in the after-fx section, and infinitely more control over the minutiae of sonic detail using a GUI that"s become the base design of the other Gospel Musicians apps that came after it, if you think you might go there in the future. Something to consider.

 

FWIW Rob, I have screen shots of editing panels from NSKS2 I could send your way, at least for something you could build on. I haven"t used the apps at all since designing in Kronos hardware so I"m not sure if my 2021 ears are the same as my 2019"s, but PM if interested.

[Reezekeys]

Before I buy, I have to say that I have an old version of what I'm assuming (hoping?) is a totally different iOS neo-soul product, called "Neo Soul Keys." It was free to download, ad-supported, and offered in-app purchases of six different keyboard samples for between $3 and $5 â which I assume only removes the ads, but doesn't get you improved versions of these. They are, to put it kindly, "rudimentary" virtual instruments that I could never use on any gig, ever. If this was a way to entice users to upgrade to their "real" product, I'm not sure it was the best way to go about it. It's actually making me nervous about spending any amount of money on their stuff! These six "instruments" sound virtually identical to each other, and appear to have no sample layers at all. Anyone ever check this out? Below is the first page that comes up when you run the app, then two of the six instruments, the "Stage EP" and "Suitcase EP" - they sound identical. I don't get it.

 

[drawback]

I too originally tried the first & free version (Neo Soul Keys). Waste of time. Then I quickly bought Neo Soul Keys Studio, which is the "earlier" version I was referring to, above. It's very different from the free version, with lots of tweakability.

[Reezekeys]

I just watched this video:

 

I guess I'm a Scarbee guy; the NeoSoul Studio is not doing it for me, sorry to say. I use the original Scarbee Rhodes on my MacBook Pro (via Kontakt) on all my gigs. I want an old-school rhodes like 70s-era Herbie Hancock. Nothing fancy sound wise, no "synth" parameters, just a playable rhodes - and by that I mean one with enough layers so when I play hard I get the corresponding funky bark I like. That video above doesn't actually tell me if the Korg Scarbee will give me that, because the uploader doesn't seem to vary the dynamics much and isn't hitting the keys too hard. I'm just tired of hunting through youtube for one solid example of someone playing a plain iOS rhodes like I would. If the basic sound isn't there, and more importantly if the way the sound evolves with increasing velocities is not natural, all the knobs, sliders, buttons, presets, etc. mean squat to me. I'm also guessing that in order to use the Korg Module Scarbee I need to buy both the Module Pro and then make an in-app purchase of the Scarbee. No indications of any black friday deals on those, right? I'm sure the deals on Neo Soul right now are great but even if they gave that to me for free I would probably not be inspired to use it much.

 

I'll also mention that I have the Orange Tree "Famous E" Rhodes for my Mac, and it's a beauty, very playable - just not the right sound for the gigs I'm doing right now. Mid-70s Herbie with Headhunters, that's the sound I want.

[Fleer]

OTS Famius E is simply stupendous.

[jejefunkyman]

I'm also a Scarbee guy when it comes to iOS EP. I have both NSKS and NSKS2 but could never find or build a preset which fits to my taste. It comes actually from the base samples, which all sounds strange to my ears. I find it a bit of a pity, because I find the app concept and programming quite good. But in the end, it all comes down to whether the basic tone is ok for your or not.

 

I even tried VTines, which I find not too bad, but still I prefer Scarbee.

 

@Reezekeys: there is a on-going sale for all Korg apps, so you can grab Korg Module Pro and Scarbee for a lower price. Korg Module Pro base version is currently at 19.99 USD and Scarbee at 9.99 USD. I think it is a good deal ;-)

 

There are some other good sounds available like Clavs, all the KAPro packs. I like also the Wurly pack (Currently 4.99 USD).

[Reezekeys]

I even tried VTines, which I find not too bad, but still I prefer Scarbee.

I have VTines too. Very clean and good tone, imo... it sounds like a Rhodes to me (unlike some of the iOS "Rhodes" I've checked out!). My issue is that once you play past a certain dynamic level you get nothing back; it needs a few more loud layers, imo. That can be very frustrating when you're playing music that demands those. For ballads, it's fine! And, I can use it with a nice low buffer on my old iPad Air 2.

@Reezekeys: there is a on-going sale for all Korg apps, so you can grab Korg Module Pro and Scarbee for a lower price. Korg Module Pro base version is currently at 19.99 USD and Scarbee at 9.99 USD. I think it is a good deal ;-)

I thought those were the regular prices, am I wrong?

[jejefunkyman]

I thought those were the regular prices, am I wrong?

 

Yes you are ;-) I think the regular Module Pro price is around 40 USD (like Gadget 2).

[drawback]

That video comparison must be old, because the version of Neo Soul Keys Studio is the original.

 

It"s clear the main reason Jamal changed the entire approach of his apps going forward was to provide extra engines to build the sound more completely. For example, each of the four oscillators in NSKS2 are there for you to program how much and the type of tone you want, and where it will appear. In other words, if you want that bark to appear when you hit the note hard, you can now program that. If you want any degree of bell to be there as you softly strike the key but disappear when you strike harder, you can program that.

 

I"ve never liked stock presets in Neo Soul products, but the editing possibilities in NSKS2 are almost endless.

 

The problem is that the interface is quite daunting at first appearance and it takes quite a bit of work to get where you want to go. For those who expect an app this flexible to provide a perfect Rhodes within their stock presets, I don"t think you"re going to find it anywhere. You have to start with a preset that you feel has promise and tweak away. Once you"re used to that, you can begin with an init and build your own from scratch. I guess it depends on what you"re willing to do.

 

Granted, what can be (so far) achieved on an iPad is minor compared to a computer, but NSKS2 is the closest to that possibility. The only other app that lets you shape a Rhodes sound with great flexibility is VTines, but it"s based on one basic sound that you can manipulate only so far.

[jejefunkyman]

I have to admit that I'm more a preset guy, simply because I don't have much time to spend on sound programming. So I usually start from a preset, and then make some little tweaks to adjust it to my taste. But I tried really hard to program tones with NSK2, and you know that Rod :-) You even help me by sharing your own tweaks, which in the end didn't work for me. I spend quite some time with the app, going back and forth, with no success.

 

This is why I came to the conclusion that for me, the problem doesn't come from programming but more from the basic tones you can use to build your own sound, which I simply don't like.

 

The timber of an instrument accross the frequency range, and velocity levels, is in the end what is the most important to me, and I couldn't find what I'm having in mind with NSKS2.

 

But it's just me, I've seen many other people praising it, so I will not say it is a bad app. Just that it is not for me lol. I'm happily keeping on using Scarbee, and also the EPs from my SV2 and Vox Conti, which I'm also recording in my iOS DAWS (Gadget 2 and Cubasis 3) with an AUDIO/MIDI interface.

 

I still keep NSKS2 partially loaded on my iPad, in the case I'm someday coming accross somebody who would like to use this kind of tone for a track. And let's see what happens...

[drawback]

I have to admit that I'm more a preset guy, simply because I don't have much time to spend on sound programming. So I usually start from a preset, and then make some little tweaks to adjust it to my taste. But I tried really hard to program tones with NSK2, and you know that Rod :-) You even help me by sharing your own tweaks, which in the end didn't work for me. I spend quite some time with the app, going back and forth, with no success.

 

Hey, Jérôme â my remarks weren't directed at you and of course I remember our back'n'forths. They were more for others who would dismiss the app out of hand. It's definitely not for everyone. Again, I'm so happy with the flexibility of my hardware lately I haven't given this topic much thought in quite awhile.

[jejefunkyman]

I didn't take it personally ;-) I just wanted to share my experience with the community :-) I've also spent more time on the hardware stuff recently...

[Reezekeys]

That video comparison must be old, because the version of Neo Soul Keys Studio is the original.

Yea it's from Feb 2019.

It"s clear the main reason Jamal changed the entire approach of his apps going forward was to provide extra engines to build the sound more completely. For example, each of the four oscillators in NSKS2 are there for you to program how much and the type of tone you want, and where it will appear. In other words, if you want that bark to appear when you hit the note hard, you can now program that. If you want any degree of bell to be there as you softly strike the key but disappear when you strike harder, you can program that.

Oscillators? So this is modeled, not sampled, or a combination?

I"ve never liked stock presets in Neo Soul products, but the editing possibilities in NSKS2 are almost endless.

 

The problem is that the interface is quite daunting at first appearance and it takes quite a bit of work to get where you want to go. For those who expect an app this flexible to provide a perfect Rhodes within their stock presets, I don"t think you"re going to find it anywhere. You have to start with a preset that you feel has promise and tweak away. Once you"re used to that, you can begin with an init and build your own from scratch. I guess it depends on what you"re willing to do.

As I said before, I'm not really interested in anything but a basic Rhodes sound. To my way of thinking, a Rhodes virtual instrument should start with just the basic sound of the instrument with little or no effects and flat EQ, then allow tweaking to more non-standard tones. Your post seems to say that is not the case with Neo Soul. In any event, I'm just not into doing "quite a bit of work" to get to a stock MK 1 rhodes.

Granted, what can be (so far) achieved on an iPad is minor compared to a computer, but NSKS2 is the closest to that possibility. The only other app that lets you shape a Rhodes sound with great flexibility is VTines, but it"s based on one basic sound that you can manipulate only so far.

I haven't checked out VTines on a computer, but it looks interesting. I've said my piece about the iOS version in this thread.

[AnotherScott]

Oscillators? So this is modeled, not sampled, or a combination?

I think it's just sampled. Oscillator can refer to anything that generates a waveform. Lots of keyboards use "oscillator" to describe their tone generaing unit, where the underlying mechanism for generating the waveform is (or can be) a sample.

[drawback]

Oscillators? So this is modeled, not sampled, or a combination?

I think it's just sampled. Oscillator can refer to anything that generates a waveform. Lots of keyboards use "oscillator" to describe their tone generaing unit, where the underlying mechanism for generating the waveform is (or can be) a sample.

 

I was going by the panel labelled "Oscillator" in the editing page. NSKS2 is edited/programmed like a synth, but I'm assuming everything is built from a core set of samples. They're downloaded (free) a la carte after purchasing the app. This way if you don't want certain core samples (ie CP70) to take up storage space on your iPad, you don't have to download them.

[Reezekeys]

Yea I should have known from the description of how large the app was that it used samples. Part of me was questioning it because I heard a synthetic quality to the sound, which made me think there was more than sample playback going on.

 

The computer version of VTines claims to use a combination of samples and modeling, it sounds pretty good to me.

[Groove On]

Re: Korg Module

- aside from the 'Scarbee EP-88M', there's the '80's Electric Piano' expansion set that might be worth looking at.

- splits/layers functionality is an additional in-app purchase

- both the free and paid versions of Korg Module let you try out the expansion packs for 7 days

 

Korg Module (free)

https://apps.apple.com/us/app/korg-module/id1048875111

 

Korg Module Pro (paid)

https://apps.apple.com/us/app/korg-module-pro/id932191687

 

 

Notes:

Am hoping we see a modeled Rhodes/WurleyClav on the level of IK Multimedia's Hammond B-3X or maybe Pianoteq's Electric Piano Packs (if they every release it for iOS).

[brenner13]

Gotta say it again, apeSoft"s Electric Vintage is a phenomenally good 1976 Rhodes with loads of tweak ability.

 

Electric Vintage iOS link

[Reezekeys]

- both the free and paid versions of Korg Module let you try out the expansion packs for 7 days

Are you sure of this? This was my experience back in June: https://forums.musicplayer.com/ubbthreads.php/topics/3101209/need-help-with-loading-expansion-into-korg-module

 

tl;dr - the free Module leads you to believe you can try out expansion packs but turns out it's just a big tease!

 

I would like you to be right but I'm not into spending more time downloading samples that don't show up.

[yannis D]

Gotta say it again, apeSoft"s Electric Vintage is a phenomenally good 1976 Rhodes with loads of tweak ability.

 

Electric Vintage iOS link

 

I bought after I've read your comment and, yes, regarding the price it's very good.

Needs some tweaking and you're good to go

Thanx

[Reezekeys]

Checking out apeSoft on u-tube now, and once again â as of now anyway, 10 - 15 minutes into checking various vids â all I'm getting is demos with multiple effects slathered on, making it impossible to evaluate the basic sound. Great, I can automate 1000 parameters. Can it sound like a f^&7ing stock Rhodes? Kids today.

 

edit - I found a vid where the uploader seems to be hitting the keys a little harder with a more stock sound called up â and I hear very little bark, so I think I'm gonna pass on this one. Too bad, $5 is a good price â that's like $0.000001 per controllable parameter!

[Groove On]

- both the free and paid versions of Korg Module let you try out the expansion packs for 7 days

Are you sure of this? This was my experience back in June: https://forums.musicplayer.com/ubbthreads.php/topics/3101209/need-help-with-loading-expansion-into-korg-module

The Korg Module 7-day trial is working fine on my old beater iPhone. I was able to try out several expansion packs in the free version before purchasing in the paid "Pro" version.

[drawback]

start with a preset that you feel has promise and tweak away. Once you"re used to that, you can begin with an init and build your own from scratch.

To my way of thinking, a Rhodes virtual instrument should start with just the basic sound of the instrument with little or no effects and flat EQ, then allow tweaking to more non-standard tones.

 

That"s what the init is, and you could certainly start there. I was just suggesting an easier route to working the editing functions would be to begin with a preset and modify it, at least that"s how I approach 'most everything.

 

Anyway, I think we"re done here. You might find the iOS Rhodes you"re looking for â and if you do, I"d sure like to know about it! That mid 70s sound you described is the one I"m into.

[Reezekeys]

- both the free and paid versions of Korg Module let you try out the expansion packs for 7 days

Are you sure of this? This was my experience back in June: https://forums.musicplayer.com/ubbthreads.php/topics/3101209/need-help-with-loading-expansion-into-korg-module

The free Korg Module 7-day trial is working fine on my old beater iPhone. I was able to try out several expansion packs before purchasing in the Pro version. But heck, you never know, YMMV.

I got the free Module earlier in 2020 where it was promoted more as just their "free piano" and touted â on this board, I think â as a "pandemic giveaway" (I also got some free Moog offerings then). So maybe I have a different "free" Korg Module? I guess I'm gonna try downloading it again. sigh...

[Groove On]

I got the free Module earlier in 2020 where it was promoted more as just their "free piano" and touted â on this board, I think â as a "pandemic giveaway" (I also got some free Moog offerings then). So maybe I have a different "free" Korg Module? I guess I'm gonna try downloading it again. sigh...

I think it's the same app, but they may have updated it to work properly. I use the Pro version, but to test out new sample packs, I downloaded the "free" Korg Module 2 weeks ago, so it's pretty recent.

[Reezekeys]

Well I got it happening. Checked out my (free) Korg Module app, saw it was the latest version (I think I have auto-update turned on), so went ahead and grabbed the 7-day free trial of Scarbee like I tried back in June with the Ivory piano, and unlike the last time the downloaded instrument shows up in my list of programs and I can play it. Hallelujah! Not quite the Scarbee sound I get from Mac/Kontakt but pretty close. Maybe I need to mess with the parameters some more.

 

I have some Qs about getting a multitimbral setup happening but that's OT to this thread so I might start another one if my searches don't give me any answers. Thanks & apologies to everyone who read through my rants in this thread!

[brenner13]

Did some this that & the other with apeSoft, NSKS2, and VTinesâ¦I like them all for different reasons and uses.

 

Neo-Soul has far more controllable artifacts, but the highest volume bark, has a rather abrupt tonal change.

 

I can also hear distinct velocity changes on apeSoft, but I really like the way it decaysâ¦makes me smile.

 

VTines just has a bit more bell tone than I like, but love the strait-forward control lay-out. The amp get pretty dirty, pretty quick. Sometimes that just what"s needed.