Casio gives the CT line a bump

[Jazz+]

Why does the CT-S1 manual, on page 78, list some rhythms?

"VL Tone (Tone List #50" ) Keyboard Key List"

"Selecting VL TONE assigns rhythm tones to keyboard keys C2 thru Eb3

 

C2 March

C#2 Waltz

D2 4 Beat

Eb2 Swing

E2 Rock 1

F2 Rock 2

F#2 Bossa A

G2 Bossa B

G#2 Samba A

A2 Samba B

Bb2 Rhumba A

B2 Rhumba B

etc...

[Mike Martin]

 

Why does the manual on page 78 for the CT-S1 list rhythms "VL Tone (Tone List #50" ) Keyboard Key List"? "Selecting VL TONE assigns rhythm tones to keyboard keys C2 thru Eb3.

 

When you select the VL-Tone - it is set up as a split with the melody tone on the top of the keyboard and the rhythms or drum sounds available in the bottom couple octaves.

[Mike Martin]

How subtle (short) can the "sustain" effect be dialed in? The range is "0-9".

 

This is for "panel sustain" for those that want to sustain without using an actual pedal.

[Jazz+]

dbl post

[Jazz+]

I guess it requires a split with violin in all cases, not ideal for a pianist.

"Selecting VL TONE assigns rhythm tones to keyboard keys C2 thru Eb3, and violin tones to keys E3-G9"

At 5:36 it is shown. It's like something for a little kid...real tinkly. Is the Bossa Nova tinkly and only available with the violin?

 

[video:youtube]

[Jazz+]

At video time stamp 04:18 the CT-S1 exhibits a Fender Rhodes clean tone vintage electric piano.

I am impressed by the sound quality. Vintage Rhodes without gimmicky effects baked in. Vintage Rhodes stands up as a solo instrument, sort of like solo piano does.

 

[video:youtube]

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[ajstan]

I guess it requires a split with violin in all cases, not ideal for a pianist.

"Selecting VL TONE assigns rhythm tones to keyboard keys C2 thru Eb3, and violin tones to keys E3-G9"

At 5:36 it is shown. It's like something for a little kid...real tinkly. Is the Bossa Nova tinkly and only available with the violin?

It sounds like it's just the old-school Casio rhythms with the synth violin sound from the VL Tone VL-1. Could be fun if you're trying to cover one of the songs it was used on.

 

http://www.vintagesynth.com/casio/vl1.php

 

From the Vintage Synth Explorer website:

This seemingly worthless synth/calculator hybrid weighing in at under a pound has somehow found fame and fortune despite looking like a kid's toy. Its ultra cheesy sounds have been discovered and immortalized in the hit songs of such artists as Trio for "Da Da Da" and White Town. The Casio VL-1 or VL-Tone as it's also called has 29 little calculator-type button keys, five preset and one user memory patches, built-in rhythm machine (waltz, swing, rock, samba, etc.) and a 100-note sequencer. There is no chance at any external or MIDI control and there are no filters or effects. There is an LFO with vibrato and tremolo effects and an ADSR envelope.

 

The tinny monophonic blips and beeps that come out of the VL-1 provide a childishly funny accent to your music, if you're into that sort of thing. The VL-1 is analog, it's tiny, it has a built-in speaker and a useless built-in calculator. The synth itself is quite small, light-weight and portable when running on batteries. The keys are unreliable and cheap soft buttons with absolutely no natural feel, response, aftertouch or velocity. The VL-1 was succeeded by the VL-10 (same spec, smaller case) and VL-5 (4-note polyphonic version with a useless bar-code reader). Strangely, the simple cheesy sounds of the VL-Tone have been used by Apollo 440, Devo, the Talking Heads, the Cars, Dee-Lite, Sting, Stevie Wonder, Vince Clarke, Beastie Boys, The Human League, Trio, White Town, and Bill Nelson.

[Jazz+]

I still can't get over the improved "Stage E Piano" clean tone Rhodes. I ordered it last night, if the action is playable, it's very gigable.

 

At 4:18 time the CT-S1 exhibits a Fender Rhodes clean tone vintage electric piano!!!

[Jazz+]

How's the resistance at the back of the keys?

[GovernorSilver]

This thread is tempting me to order one now, instead of waiting for our favorite area shop to get units in stock - especially my desired color.

[El Lobo]

How's the resistance at the back of the keys?

I just got my S1 today and have only had a half hour to play with it but right away I noticed the feel of the keys is too short. I measured and the keys are shorter than the keys on my Casio S3000. The keys on the S1 are 5 1/2 inches long (deep) and the keys on the S3000 are 6 inches long. The result is the feel at the back of the keys is not as good, the travel or fulcrum or whatever you call it feels too short. Hope this makes sense. I'm not knowledgeable about keyboard tech talk. I'll play with it some more and see if I can add to this comment.

[AnotherScott]

I just got my S1 today and have only had a half hour to play with it but right away I noticed the feel of the keys is too short. I measured and the keys are shorter than the keys on my Casio S3000. The keys on the S1 are 5 1/2 inches long (deep) and the keys on the S3000 are 6 inches long. The result is the feel at the back of the keys is not as good, the travel or fulcrum or whatever you call it feels too short. Hope this makes sense. I'm not knowledgeable about keyboard tech talk. I'll play with it some more and see if I can add to this comment.

Hammer action boards are usually about 6"; non-hammer boards (including the Hammond B-3) are usually somewhere around 5 1/2". Some, like the widely used Fatar TP/8O, are even about 5 1/4". Off-hand, the only non-hammer action I can think of with keys as long as the hammer action boards is the Fatar TP/8P (found in some Kurzweils and the Dexibell S1). I assume there may be others... Maybe a high-end board like a Montage 6/7 or Fantom 6/7? I don't know how long their keys are. But a non-hammer board that goes much beyond 5 1/2" is a rarity (though some are more even toward the back than others).

[El Lobo]

Hammer action boards are usually about 6"; non-hammer boards (including the Hammond B-3) are usually somewhere around 5 1/2". Some, like the widely used Fatar TP/8O, are even about 5 1/4". Off-hand, the only non-hammer action I can think of with keys as long as the hammer action boards is the Fatar TP/8P (found in some Kurzweils and the Dexibell S1). I assume there may be others... Maybe a high-end board like a Montage 6/7 or Fantom 6/7? I don't know how long their keys are. But a non-hammer board that goes much beyond 5 1/2" is a rarity (though some are more even toward the back than others).

Thanks so much for the tech talk. I know nussing about dese tings. I played some more on the S1 to answer the question and I'd say there's not a lot of difference in resistance at the front and back of the keys, although there is some more playing at the back. Again, I don't know the tech but it feels like you're pressing a shorter lever at the back, which of course you are. I haven't done anything yet with the touch response settings (off, light, medium, heavy) but perhaps that can help address concerns about resistance at the back of the keys.

[El Lobo]

This thing is pretty damn close to the long-sought couch piano and boat keyboard. I took a strap off a guitar and put it on with the strap lock washers, then I put the strap around me at about the middle of my back so when I'm sitting on a couch or chair it holds the keyboard on my lap and doesn't slide off.

[Jazz+]

Is the action playable for you with the Piano tone? I assumed it would be slightly stiffer at the back (like all actions in general), but it's a light unweighted ("semi") action so is it of much concern? How's the "Stage E PIano" (vintage Fender Rhodes) for you with its semi-weighted action?

[AnotherScott]

Is the action playable for you with the Piano tone? I assumed it would be slightly stiffer at the back (like all actions in general), but it's a light unweighted ("semi") action so is it of much concern?

As a side note (since I haven't played an S1), I've found that it's *more* of a concern on the non-hammer actions. I've never played a hammer action board (not even the new "short" CDP-S/PX-S Casios) where the rear gets nearly as unplayable as what I've seen on some of the non-hammer actions.

[Jazz+]

You have me worried.

[El Lobo]

My caveat: I'm a hack player, self-taught, not a trained or long-term pro and I have limited skills. But dang this thing is fun to play. The action is quite playable for me. Frankly, I don't play at the back of the keys very much. What I do know is I like the sounds. I'm still clicking through all the sounds to see which ones I like the best. The tone list has 61 tones. I'm an old Wurly guy and I love the wurly on my Nord 5D, but the wurlys on this board are satisfying. They're not labeled as Wurly, they're listed as "Amp 60's" or "Tremolo 60's" and the Rhodes aren't labelled as that, they're Stage E. Piano and the like. I've never liked the Rhodes on my Nord or other keyboards but I like the ones on the S1. Hope that helps.

 

My one criticism of this board is I can't read the labels on the control buttons, even in normal light. I need bright daylight to be able to read them. Tonight I was using a very bright flashlight in order to read them while I was sitting at my dining room table with light from my chandelier, then light from my phone, then light from my laptop and still wasn't able to read the control labels until I shone the bright flashlight directly on them. This probably won't be an issue for long as I'll quickly learn what each button is and where it is. But really designers, did you have naive users try to navigate these controls in dim light? Couldn't you have printed the labels in bright white or some fun color like neon red? You had to go for the dull faint grey because anything else would have ruined the stylish look of the board? If I gig this thing, I'll have to memorize where my buttons and settings are because I'll never be able to use it in a club setting. It would be like flying blind. I can just see myself randomly pressing buttons and getting synth sounds when I need the organ for the intro to the next tune. Sorry, I do go on ...

[Groove On]

Is the action playable for you with the Piano tone? I assumed it would be slightly stiffer at the back (like all actions in general), but it's a light unweighted ("semi") action so is it of much concern? How's the "Stage E PIano" (vintage Fender Rhodes) for you with its semi-weighted action?

For me the CT-S1 piano tone/action is decently playable, you're not going to get the finesse of an US$800+++ hammer action, but the dynamics for a US$199 keyboard are a pleasant surprise for me. Don't let your imagination run away with you, it's still an inexpensive plastic action, but there is a feel of key "travel" that gives decent control over dynamics for this price range.

 

I'm not sure why, but there's a difference in the way the key feels at the top vs the bottom of it's travel. There's some sort of friction or soft padding, so I do get a sense of how hard I'm pressing the key and when it's going to hit bottom. It's a minor but decent step up from the NP-32 / Go Piano actions (dare I say it's even nicer than the Korg Kross 61). I'd even offer that I think of it as a "junior" version of the key action on the Korg VOX Continental.

 

Notes:

- FWIW, quick repeated notes are super-easy and a fun to play.

- Long sustained legato is also easier than on most other inexpensive plastic actions (perhaps this was tuned by Casio)

- regarding playing at the back of the keys, I'd say the keys are fairly uniform up to 75% of their length, the last 25% of the key starts to get rough.

[Sam Mullins]

Is the action playable for you with the Piano tone? I assumed it would be slightly stiffer at the back (like all actions in general), but it's a light unweighted ("semi") action so is it of much concern? How's the "Stage E PIano" (vintage Fender Rhodes) for you with its semi-weighted action?

For me the CT-S1 piano tone/action is decently playable, you're not going to get the finesse of an US$800+++ hammer action, but the dynamics for a US$199 keyboard are a pleasant surprise for me. Don't let your imagination run away with you, it's still an inexpensive plastic action, but there is a feel of key "travel" that gives decent control over dynamics for this price range.

notes are super-easy and a fun to play.

 

+1. Well summarized. It doesn"t even occur to compare the action to say my Kronosâ¦different leagues and price to go with it. But compared to other low end consumer keyboards and many dedicated low end MIDI controllers, I find this action much more playable. You can get musical dynamics with this this thing.

[AnotherScott]

You have me worried.

I'm optimistic. El Lobo said "I'd say there's not a lot of difference in resistance at the front and back of the keys, although there is some more playing at the back". So at least one report says it's not bad. Also, my experience with past Casio semi-weighted actions (e.g. XW-P1, MZ-X500) is that they were much better in this respect than the low cost boards from Korg and Roland, for example.

 

My one criticism of this board is I can't read the labels on the control buttons, even in normal light.

This is why I'd get the white, it seems like it would be the easiest to operate of the three. Which color did you get?

[Sam Mullins]

I"m not one to nitpick at this price, but I"m a little disappointed that you can"t do splits. This obviously isn"t a DSP performance issue since it support layers; just a software limitation. There are a few function keys still available so maybe in a software update? (I know â¦not likely at this level). If they didn"t support layers, I wouldn"t even bring it up

[Mike Martin]

I"m not one to nitpick at this price, but I"m a little disappointed that you can"t do splits. This obviously isn"t a DSP performance issue since it support layers; just a software limitation. There are a few function keys still available so maybe in a software update? (I know â¦not likely at this level). If they didn"t support layers, I wouldn"t even bring it up

 

There is a bass / piano split built-in but the CT-S1 really isn't about that. It is about being simple, easy and instantly accessible. If you're looking for splits, layers and other things wait for the CT-S400. It has a much larger sound with the ability to store registrations. It is however missing some of the CT-S1's unique sounds.

[AnotherScott]

I"m not one to nitpick at this price, but I"m a little disappointed that you can"t do splits...If they didn"t support layers, I wouldn"t even bring it up

The funny thing is, my first thought about lacking split on a board with layers was that adding split adds a bunch more complications (esp. on a board without display/menus). To make it really functional you need to be able to adjust, not just the split point, but also (even more so than having these things for layered sounds) the relative volumes of the two sounds, octave shifts for the two sounds (for example, a split with strings on left needs to be octave-shiftable unless you only want your strings to be cellos), sustain behavior for the two sounds (you'd want it for RH piano but not for LH bass)... and then I saw that the S1 actually already HAS these editable parameters even for its LAYERED sounds! This board is full of surprises!

[Groove On]

... but the CT-S1 really isn't about that. It is about being simple, easy and instantly accessible ...

 

I think the S1 does this really well.

[Mike Martin]

I"m not one to nitpick at this price, but I"m a little disappointed that you can"t do splits...If they didn"t support layers, I wouldn"t even bring it up

The funny thing is, my first thought about lacking split on a board with layers was that adding split adds a bunch more complications (esp. on a board without display/menus). To make it really functional you need to be able to adjust, not just the split point, but also (even more so than having these things for layered sounds) the relative volumes of the two sounds, octave shifts for the two sounds (for example, a split with strings on left needs to be octave-shiftable unless you only want your strings to be cellos), sustain behavior for the two sounds (you'd want it for RH piano but not for LH bass)... and then I saw that the S1 actually already HAS these editable parameters even for its LAYERED sounds! This board is full of surprises!

 

There are some other crazy surprises. I'm working on a video that uncovers some of these secrets later that will helpfully come out later this month.

[Sam Mullins]

I"m not one to nitpick at this price, but I"m a little disappointed that you can"t do splits...If they didn"t support layers, I wouldn"t even bring it up

The funny thing is, my first thought about lacking split on a board with layers was that adding split adds a bunch more complications (esp. on a board without display/menus). To make it really functional you need to be able to adjust, not just the split point, but also (even more so than having these things for layered sounds) the relative volumes of the two sounds, octave shifts for the two sounds (for example, a split with strings on left needs to be octave-shiftable unless you only want your strings to be cellos), sustain behavior for the two sounds (you'd want it for RH piano but not for LH bass)... and then I saw that the S1 actually already HAS these editable parameters even for its LAYERED sounds! This board is full of surprises!

 

Right...I think you would just need one function key to switch between layer/split mode and one function key to select split point...the rest of the stuff is there.

[Sam Mullins]

I"m not one to nitpick at this price, but I"m a little disappointed that you can"t do splits. This obviously isn"t a DSP performance issue since it support layers; just a software limitation. There are a few function keys still available so maybe in a software update? (I know â¦not likely at this level). If they didn"t support layers, I wouldn"t even bring it up

 

There is a bass / piano split built-in but the CT-S1 really isn't about that. It is about being simple, easy and instantly accessible. If you're looking for splits, layers and other things wait for the CT-S400. It has a much larger sound with the ability to store registrations. It is however missing some of the CT-S1's unique sounds.

 

Fair enough. And given the choice, I would probably still go with CT-S1 for it's nicer aesthetics. It's always something

[Mike Martin]

 

Fair enough. And given the choice, I would probably still go with CT-S1 for it's nicer aesthetics. It's always something

 

I've said this in some of our meetings, I have a lot of gear here at home. Casio and non-Casio

I also have both the CT-S1 and the CT-S400...but the CT-S1 is the one that I've been playing the most. Something about the immediacy of it that makes it so perfect.

[El Lobo]

My one criticism of this board is I can't read the labels on the control buttons, even in normal light.

This is why I'd get the white, it seems like it would be the easiest to operate of the three. Which color did you get?

I got black. I'm old skool and want my keyboards to look like a piano. And I'm tired of Nord red; it's so cliché or passé or something with an accent e. Looking at pix though, you might be right â the black lettering against white or red is easier to read than the grey against black and may be more visible in dim light.

 

But as long as we're talking colors, how about a nice blue? Or a soft dove grey? Neon lime green? Woodgrain? An S1 that looks like a B3 manual? Now there's an idea ...