Karftwerk Inducted into R&R Hall of Fame

[Jonathan Hughes]

I did not expect this kind of reaction?

 

Whenever anyone brings up the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame inductees, there are two circles in the Venn diagram of commenters. In one circle are the people who think that one/most/all of the bands being inducted aren't worthy because some other "better" or "more important" band hasn't been inducted yet. In the other circle are people who think that the entire concept of the RARHOF is ridiculous because rock is rebellious music and shouldn't be reduced to a contest, and/or they think that the whole thing a money grab, and/or they think the that whole thing is stupid because they include music that's not rock and roll (i.e. rap, R&B, techno, etc.).

 

In the center of the Venn diagram, where those two circles intersect, are the worst commenters of all: those who think the whole thing is stupid AND complain that their favorite band hasn't been inducted. It's like the old joke: "the food there is terrible â and the portions are so small!"

[Muad’Dib]

Thank you Jonathan!

[Marzzz]

I visited the R&RHOF summer of '19 while on a driving trip around the Great Lakes. It sits right on Lake Erie in the nicest (relatively speaking) part of town. Worth seeing if you are passing thru the area (why?), but not necessarily for a special trip. They had several floors of various displays in some chronological order, as well as some historic instruments, sort of. You could almost reach out and touch Jerry Garcia's custom guitar, but it was like his 4th or 5th instrument and not one of the ones he played frequently. Same was Steve Cropper's "first guitar," some sort of semi-electric Gibson, but you don't see his Telecaster there (I guess he is still using it?). But there are definitely a lot of interesting artifacts, stage costumes, etc. I was particularly intrigued by a letter Madonna wrote while in college in Ann Arbor, she actually was in one of the all-girls dorms, and went on about how she "had to get out of there" and go to NYC. They also had one of those two-manual Mellotrons that the Beatles used literally right on the floor, I tried to take a picture of the rear mechanicals and the flash from my iPhone accidentally went off; some scruffy asshole smelling of cigarettes in a denim jacket (that hadn't seen a washing machine in the better part of a year) claimed to work for the HOF and tried to get me thrown out! Pics are OK there if you don't use flash, but really...?

 

In contrast, we have the Musical Instrument Museum here in Phoenix which has a lot of fascinating gear, including an 8-voice Oberheim and is definitely worth a side trip. And if you are ever in Liverpool, the British Music Experience is amazing by comparison. More accurate displays (including a replica of Buddy Holly's Strat, and they do tell you it is a reproduction, and the interactive keyboard area displays Keith Emerson!), a lot of Beatles stuff without skimping on everything else that was happening in Liverpool at the time, and a broader historical perspective. btw- the touristy "Magical Mystery Tour" bus tour is worth it- they really do take you around to everything worth seeing in Liverpool and you actually see Penny Lane, Strawberry Fields, etc., and the final stop is The Cavern Club. Fascinating to learn that George and Ringo grew up in council housing, Paul was middle class and had a nice home, and John actually was upper middle class in the nicest neighborhood, he had his own room and another that was used as his "studio!" Working Class Hero, indeed....

[bfields]

In contrast, we have the Musical Instrument Museum here in Phoenix which has a lot of fascinating gear, including an 8-voice Oberheim and is definitely worth a side trip.

 

Oh, yes, I'll second that one. Big collection, really well put together. The kind of museum where I get engrossed in the first few exhibits, and then realize I'll have to sprint if I want to make it to the stuff I thought I'd come for....

[Adan]

I did not expect this kind of reaction?

 

Whenever anyone brings up the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame inductees, there are two circles in the Venn diagram of commenters. In one circle are the people who think that one/most/all of the bands being inducted aren't worthy because some other "better" or "more important" band hasn't been inducted yet. In the other circle are people who think that the entire concept of the RARHOF is ridiculous because rock is rebellious music and shouldn't be reduced to a contest, and/or they think that the whole thing a money grab, and/or they think the that whole thing is stupid because they include music that's not rock and roll (i.e. rap, R&B, techno, etc.).

 

In the center of the Venn diagram, where those two circles intersect, are the worst commenters of all: those who think the whole thing is stupid AND complain that their favorite band hasn't been inducted. It's like the old joke: "the food there is terrible â and the portions are so small!"

 

You're right about the predictability of these discussions . . . and eventually the meta-guy comes along and ties it all up in a bow. But can you tell us what the cool and hip way is to comment?

 

My New Year's Resolution will be to not open next year's RRHOF thread. I could do with a little less deja vu in my life.

[Jonathan Hughes]

"But can you tell us what the cool and hip way is to comment? "

 

I think the answer is that line from the movie War Games: "The only winning move is not to play"

 

Barring that, it would be cool if people didn't take the whole thing like a personal affront. Although not all music is or should be fun to listen to, rock and roll and its variants generally should be, as should talking about it, AND giving awards for it.

[Docbop]

"But can you tell us what the cool and hip way is to comment? "

 

I think the answer is that line from the movie War Games: "The only winning move is not to play"

 

Barring that, it would be cool if people didn't take the whole thing like a personal affront. Although not all music is or should be fun to listen to, rock and roll and its variants generally should be, as should talking about it, AND giving awards for it.

 

After years of doing online forum both as a paid rep' for companies and a user I've taken the stance of say what I want and start reading replies less and less if the thread keeps going and going. Seem like once a thread gets over a page or two then that when things start going bad, off topic, or the agenda people start posting. But today things are calmer than the early days of forums before the web. The old USENET forums could get wild and nasty. There weren't many moderators back then so forest fires would break out in threads and no one to try and control them.

 

So say what you want, think twice or three time before replying more, and if start going sideways just walk away from the thread. Life is too short to waste time in online flamewars that nothing changes in the end.

[area51recording]

I never care who gets in, or who gets snubbed.....it's just nice to see who (in conjuction with the Grammies of course) wins music every year......

[MAJUSCULE]

Same was Steve Cropper's "first guitar," some sort of semi-electric Gibson, but you don't see his Telecaster there (I guess he is still using it?).

 

His Tele is at the Stax Museum in Memphis, which I highly recommend. A lot of of the original gear is there, including the full studio setup that you can walk through (a few bits and bobs are sourced but mostly it's all the stuff they tracked on). All kinds of displays with original instruments and showclothes, even Isaac Hayes's pimped-out Cadillac from his big record deal. Plus, plenty of other cool things to see, do, hear, and eat in Memphis.

[drawback]

I never care who gets in, or who gets snubbed.....it's just nice to see who (in conjuction with the Grammies of course) wins music every year......

 

The only exception I have is the name! "Roll" left "rock" a few decades ago. I like watching the show when it's on TV. I've seen a lot of mind-blowing live mini-concerts on the broadcast â probably the best I've seen in years was Stevie Nicks. What a BAND. I say keep it up and if you don't like JayZ do something else while that stuff is on.

[Muad’Dib]

Note to self: Do not mention the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame on here. Ever again.

[MathOfInsects]

"But can you tell us what the cool and hip way is to comment? "

 

I think the answer is that line from the movie War Games: "The only winning move is not to play"

 

Barring that, it would be cool if people didn't take the whole thing like a personal affront. Although not all music is or should be fun to listen to, rock and roll and its variants generally should be, as should talking about it, AND giving awards for it.

 

After years of doing online forum both as a paid rep' for companies and a user I've taken the stance of say what I want and start reading replies less and less if the thread keeps going and going. Seem like once a thread gets over a page or two then that when things start going bad, off topic, or the agenda people start posting. But today things are calmer than the early days of forums before the web. The old USENET forums could get wild and nasty. There weren't many moderators back then so forest fires would break out in threads and no one to try and control them.

 

So say what you want, think twice or three time before replying more, and if start going sideways just walk away from the thread. Life is too short to waste time in online flamewars that nothing changes in the end.

 

You know who else used to take threads off-topic on the second page? HITLER.

[roygBiv]

How's this for Meta?

 

Jay-Z take on this controversy.

 

Jay-Z comment #1:

 

[video:youtube]

 

 

 

Jay-Z comment #2:

[video:youtube]

[roygBiv]

And from a pretentious Academic Perspective.....

 

One accepted way to assess "impact" of a scientific publication is to check how often it has been cited by subsequent papers.

 

(For example using Google Scholar, etc.).

 

Anyways, instead of working to increase my citation impact, I instead stumbled across this interesting tool that measures how many times a musical artist has been sampled/covered, etc.

 

Kraftwerk has pretty spectacular stats:

 

- 834 samples, 203 covers, 63 remixes

 

The only "Rock" bandsI could find with more were members of the "Pantheon" (Beatles, Stones, etc.).

 

Give it a try, its kind of fun to see who gets sampled/covered the most. You might be surprised - Kraftwerk is more sampled than the Rolling Stones (but has fewer covers).

 

 

WhoSampled site:

 

PS - interestingly, artists in the Rap genre show a lot more sampling (of their samples?)

[Docbop]

60's-70's Soul and R&B records were sampled like crazy and Jazz artists like guitarist like Grant Greene has made more money after he died he's been sampled so much. Now they are taking smaller samples and chopping them up, processing them in many ways to make something totally new. Hard to say if those small chopped samples ever get credited back to the original recording. Making beats is really big high paying business.

[KuruPrionz]

...Rock music, along with its ancestors and its diasporadic progency (think JayZ) are supposed to embnody the anti-establishment sentiment. The rockn'roll star in his or her fetal form rejects the structures imposed by society including, and maybe particularly, those that demand a merit-based ranking. I've never been able to care about the RRHOF because I've never been able to suspend disbelief in this contradiction.

That's it, shake The Rock and Roll Bible at those lost souls operating the RRHOF. They just don't know the definition of Rock and Roll. Hell, I didn't know what Rock and Roll was supposed to be. I can't wait to feel enjoyment of True Rock and Roll now that I have seen the light! I submit this rare version of a classic as an example that embodies

.

 

 

 

 

 

Y'all just Rick-Rolled us big time!!!! Lol...

[EscapeRocks]

60's-70's Soul and R&B records were sampled like crazy and Jazz artists like guitarist like Grant Greene has made more money after he died he's been sampled so much. Now they are taking smaller samples and chopping them up, processing them in many ways to make something totally new. Hard to say if those small chopped samples ever get credited back to the original recording. Making beats is really big high paying business.

 

A few years ago when Smokey Robinson was on "Live From Daryl's House", at the sit down dinner section of the show they discussed this. They were talking about their music being sampled and used in rap and hip hop. Smokey said, "yes, please use my music" since he gets paid when they do.

[Synthaholic]

I like Kraftwerk, but when they get in and Foreigner and ELP are left out, something is bad wrong. All credibility is lost. Not that they've had any credibility the past ten years.

Also Jethro Tull, Pat Benatar, and Kansas. But ABBA is in!

[David Emm]

I'd prefer categories such as "Band that sounds the most like DEVO without being DEVO." At least that would be fun instead of pompous. I'd also like to see a really lively new "IDM" band named Karftwerk, just to watch the resulting sparks fly.