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Yamaha YC61 Announced


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Good video. Duxbury can be annoying with his waffling about, but he's pretty on point and efficient in that 40 minutes.

 

The main thing that jumped out at me that hadn't before is that, relative to the Electro, effects are more extensive and flexible on the YC. That's a big plus.

 

Leslie and chorus are effects we put under an aural microscope, and this video wasn't really about that, but they both sounded at least ok. The Leslie sounded a bit too distant-mic'y, which is probably adjustable. Overall I didn't have a strong negative reaction to either of them. My opinion would still be this is a useable Hammond clone even if it's not among the best.

 

He didn't say much about the action. To the extent you can tell anything by watching, it appears to be extremely light, and that might be an issue.

Gigging: Crumar Mojo 61, Hammond SKPro

Home: Vintage Vibe 64

 

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Nadroj,thanks for posting this. Pretty nice overview although I wish he would let you hear the rotary on fast for more than a split second. Every demo vid I've seen of this thing lets it accelerate and immdiately goes back to chorale. It's been said that the real test of a rotary sim is how long you can stand to listen to a sustained chord on fast with no C/V. Also,the purpose of these vids is to let you hear the instrument,not to showcase how much choppy stuff the presenter can play. We need a Matthew Fisher to demo the YC61. Pianos do seem to sound good. Thanks again for posting.

 

Adan,from looking through the manual it doesn't appear that mic distance on the rotary is adjustable. Maybe I missed something. Wouldn't be the first time I've been wrong. At least the C/V seems to be usable.

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Just watched the Anderton's demo. Took the chance to ask about the key width here

(should be the highlighted comment).

 

Seems like Jack says the key widths are very similar to the Nord Electro's, wider than Yamaha's regular synth keys. Definitely puts the YC61 back into consideration for me beside the Mojo61 (I'm pretty torn between the two at the moment). Now I just have to try it for myself in store to make a final verdict...

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Just watched the Anderton's demo. Took the chance to ask about the key width here
(should be the highlighted comment).

 

Seems like Jack says the key widths are very similar to the Nord Electro's, wider than Yamaha's regular synth keys. Definitely puts the YC61 back into consideration for me beside the Mojo61 (I'm pretty torn between the two at the moment). Now I just have to try it for myself in store to make a final verdict...

 

And on action type, is the mechanism more semi weight feeling like the Montage or springy like the Electro?

Yamaha CP88, Casio PX-560

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Unfortunately, these days "very light" doesn't mean that the keys are not semiweighted. It is not a clearly defined term so the manufacturers use it when they find it convenient. Yamaha also states that the MoDX6 and 7 have semiweighted keys. Maybe they really have some kind of microweights attached to the keys but if you tried those keys, you'll know it doesn't feel anywhere similar to the Montage or similar keybeds of higher quality.
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Jack Duxbury isn't what I'd call a premium credible source of information. His whole shtick is based on playing products as if he's seeing them for the first time, which often he is. I appreciate that he's got the mind of a gigging player, and his low brow humor is a refreshing oasis in the dry desert of keyboard product videos.

 

Evaluating action based on videos is kind of a fool's errand. Call me foolish but my guess is this is going to feel like the MODX with waterfall keys. That may not be terrible but it also may not be exactly my cup of tea. My favorite non-weighted/semi-weighted actions are the Mojo 61 and the Vox Continental. Would I prefer a too-light action over the too-stiff Electro action? Quite possibly, yes.

Gigging: Crumar Mojo 61, Hammond SKPro

Home: Vintage Vibe 64

 

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Just watched the Anderton's demo. Took the chance to ask about the key width here
(should be the highlighted comment).

 

Seems like Jack says the key widths are very similar to the Nord Electro's, wider than Yamaha's regular synth keys. Definitely puts the YC61 back into consideration for me beside the Mojo61 (I'm pretty torn between the two at the moment). Now I just have to try it for myself in store to make a final verdict...

 

Based on 'scaling' the photo at the top of this page: https://usa.yamaha.com/products/music_production/stagekeyboards/yc/specs.html#product-tabs

- and assuming Yamaha's specified width measurement of 896mm for the whole keyboard is correct? .. then the width of one octave of keys comes out at 160mm.....

Yamaha - YC61 - P105 - MOX6 - HC2 -- Neo Vent 2
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the only issue I have with Jack's demo was his failure to completely eliminate the distortion/overdrive in the organ model, even though that was his goal. still waiting to hear the clean organ tones, and also eagerly awaiting to hear it without leslie sim, although nobody ever demonstrates that. perhaps I will get the chance soon...

 

talking of Jack, I would much rather watch his entertaining and humerous demos than the dry and heavily biased videos by the brands and other retailers.

 

Fun fact about Jack, you might not know because he's far too modest to ever mention it, but he's regularly performed on vocals, keys and guitar at festivals and arenas for audiences of hundreds of thousands. So calling him a gigging player is a bit of an understatement :)

 

Fun fact nr.2, we're both from the same town on the south coast of england!

hang out with me at woody piano shack
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Good purnt, that the 1st thing I do , is check for the non-overdriven tone on any clone or one of the 1st... in my Electro 5D 61... it's never totally gone BTW! I prefer it totally clean, take that onstage and it will come a bite you when you don't want it to (overdrive always on or in sample)! Gotta love Jack!

 

the only issue I have with Jack's demo was his failure to completely eliminate the distortion/overdrive in the organ model, even though that was his goal. still waiting to hear the clean organ tones, and also eagerly awaiting to hear it without leslie sim, although nobody ever demonstrates that. perhaps I will get the chance soon...

 

talking of Jack, I would much rather watch his entertaining and humerous demos than the dry and heavily biased videos by the brands and other retailers.

 

Fun fact about Jack, you might not know because he's far too modest to ever mention it, but he's regularly performed on vocals, keys and guitar at festivals and arenas for audiences of hundreds of thousands. So calling him a gigging player is a bit of an understatement :)

 

Fun fact nr.2, we're both from the same town on the south coast of england!

 

 CP-50, YC 73,  FP-80, PX5-S, NE-5d61, Kurzweil SP6, XK-3, CX-3, Hammond XK-3, Yamaha YUX Upright, '66 B3/Leslie 145/122

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I always find grit in it(5D and a bit colored also), at least to my ears even with dial @ zero-like a default base floor distortion in the DB sound......think it's just how Nord samples but they may leave a bit in I think... after years of gigging a CX-3 ver 2 and Hammond XK3 where it seems to totally eliminate the OD... I felt the Nord was still a bit dirty compared to them at zero! Probably just the sample, something with it...?! ..I enjoy the Nord overall though! I only generally use just a hair of OD.. and let my 145 do the dirty work... I gigged many Hammonds in my days!

weird with the 5D there legato. I remember my E2 used to overdrive when the effect was switched on but turned all the way down. Switching the effect off would leave you with completely clean tone. Not the same on the 5?

 

 CP-50, YC 73,  FP-80, PX5-S, NE-5d61, Kurzweil SP6, XK-3, CX-3, Hammond XK-3, Yamaha YUX Upright, '66 B3/Leslie 145/122

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Fun fact about Jack, you might not know because he's far too modest to ever mention it, but he's regularly performed on vocals, keys and guitar at festivals and arenas for audiences of hundreds of thousands. So calling him a gigging player is a bit of an understatement :)

 

Fun fact nr.2, we're both from the same town on the south coast of england!

 

KB, I didn't mean to be putting down Jack, but I've seen a number of his videos and it seems like his method is to produce the moment a keyboard hits his store, in fact he'll often explicitely say "I'm just seeing this for the first time." I suppose that's useful but it's a contrast to the more thorough and thoughtful videos you produce. I suppose the two of you complement each other. You certainly compliment each other!

 

In any case, there's only one way to judge action and that's by playing. Given this is Yamaha, you know it's coming to a store near you.

Gigging: Crumar Mojo 61, Hammond SKPro

Home: Vintage Vibe 64

 

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On the issue of the waterfall keyboard I am curious to know how it deals with the high trig point for the organ and also high it is. There is nothing in the YC61 manual unlike the Nords which have a menu option to set it high or low. The Roland VRs are high for organs and low for the piano and synth section so I'm assuming it's following that model. If it's the latter then I hope when splitting the board the trig point is still high for the organs.
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After years of carrying a *real* Hammond to gigs, (A B-3 Chop, then a B-200) then spending tons of money on clone wheels... and finally landing on the Nords because I like them; I'm convinced that you folks are haggling over nuances that can only be heard in a set of decent headphones.

 

Your average barfly can barely hear the keys in the mix.

 

 

Muzikteechur is Lonnie, in Kittery, Maine.

 

HS music teacher: Concert Band, Marching Band, Jazz Band, Chorus, Music Theory, AP Music Theory, History of Rock, Musical Theatre, Piano, Guitar, Drama.

 

 

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After years of carrying a *real* Hammond to gigs, (A B-3 Chop, then a B-200) then spending tons of money on clone wheels... and finally landing on the Nords because I like them; I'm convinced that you folks are haggling over nuances that can only be heard in a set of decent headphones.

 

Your average barfly can barely hear the keys in the mix.

 

 

You're on the money regarding organ, which is why there's little reason for someone with an Electro to sell it and get the YC. Unless, for example, they need better midi implementation. I'm happy enough with the organ sounds from my VR09 that I don't feel a need to swap it for the YC. Except that playing piano sounds on the VR is really horrible. The YC might be a better gigging package.

 

As for the haggling, you should know by now that we just can't help ourselves.

Gigging: Crumar Mojo 61, Hammond SKPro

Home: Vintage Vibe 64

 

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I agree, for organ alone, there is not much reason to consider moving to this from another decent clonewheel, it's more a matter of whether you are really enticed by its other advantages over what you have (MIDI implementation as you say, more flexible splits/layers, whatever). Though presumably some people could be in the market for this who don't currently have any clonewheel at all, or only something much older, more limited in functionality, heavier, etc.

Maybe this is the best place for a shameless plug! Our now not-so-new new video at https://youtu.be/3ZRC3b4p4EI is a 40 minute adaptation of T. S. Eliot's "Prufrock" - check it out! And hopefully I'll have something new here this year. ;-)

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Yeah, for the average listener you just have to get close enough for them to say "yep, that's an organ". And hopefully avoid the "roller rink" connotation. But in my experience, playing something that sounds, feels and behaves more like a real B3 makes you play better- which average listeners are more likely to notice, IMO.

 

Or maybe I'm just trying to justify the amount of money I have spent on organ gear over the last year..Yamaha may be helping me with that issue because according to my Keyboard feed, the YC61 will not be sold 'til June.

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.....most of their unweighted pro keyboards for the last couple decades ... are 3/16 " narrower per octave.

 

Wow dinna know dat. Super lame. Why?

 

Why indeed...read farther in the thread for the yamaha defense and discussion.

Yamaha CK88, Arturia Keylab 61 MkII, Moog Sub 37, Yamaha U1 Upright, Casio CT-S500, Mac Logic/Mainstage, iPad Camelot, Spacestation V.3, QSC K10.2, JBL EON One Compact

www.stickmanor.com

There's a thin white line between fear and fury - Stickman

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.....most of their unweighted pro keyboards for the last couple decades ... are 3/16 " narrower per octave.

 

Wow dinna know dat. Super lame. Why?

 

I would say: kinda of a bad attitude because "we are a big company" and there is no standard anyway, so we are not wrong in producing narrower keys. It is the same why they refuse to implement a software polarity switch for the sustain pedal. You have to buy a pedal with the right polarity, otherwise, there is no way to change the polarity in the keyboard itself. There were two three situations where I forgot my sustain pedal and there were other keyboards and player on stage and it happened that the sustain pedals they used were not compatible with my yamaha keyboard.

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  • 2 months later...

I got one a couple of weeks ago. But I'm in Australia. Looks like a small shipment arrived here mid-April. Online I can see at least two retailers who have one in stock, including the place I bought mine from.

 

I'll write a proper review after I get it out on a gig, but that's currently a distant horizon, so I'll say a few things here. I should note I am totally the market for this: I need a decent Hammond emulation that makes me happy plus enough sounds to get me through a covers gig. I have been using a Hammond SK1 over a Korg Vox Continental. I also own a Gemini module and an HX3. I briefly owned a Nord Electro 5. I have played a few different Hammond tone wheel organs and over Xmas acquired a Leslie 122. So they're my references.

 

The key action is really sweet, in the Anderton's Youtube review Jack described it as a luxurious synth action and I'd agree with that, notice on that video how easily he plays piano and electric piano runs with clean even dynamics. It's fast but not springy like the Fatar action in the SK1 or Electros, and a step up in terms of dynamic control from the Korg Vox Continental, which is pretty sweet itself imho. And you can still use all your Hammond technique and tricks (or not, maybe skip the Emerson knife trick, lol).

 

It's not a Legend or an HX3, but the organ is imho in the same league as the Hammond SK1/Nord C2/Gemini/Mojo. Out of the box the Leslie is a bit squirrelly on the top drawbars, but unlike the SK1 where a common complaint is that the slowest minimum speed of the horn is too fast, on the Yamaha I can tweak it to where I'm happy. The drive works for me better than that on the SK1 or the Gemini/Mojo, but again the Hammond preamp - Leslie amp combo drive sim is not HX3 (or Vent) quality. I do think it will work well in a funk, rock or prog context, and I could happily play a soul gig on it. Jazz players though may be unimpressed.

 

The other sounds will be familiar to those who have played a CP73/88 or a MODX, so the acoustic pianos are sweet but the electric pianos are, as noted above, gig worthy in a covers band context but rather uninspiring, they pale in comparison to those on the Korg Vox Continental. Editing the synths is a real pain in the ass: there is one knob that you switch to go between filter and amp envelopes, and then if you're in the amp envelope the attack and release times are tied and you have to dive a few layers into a menu to choose the curve that dictates their relationship. Same with the filter cutoff and resonance values. And then while there are some perfectly useable pads and a few decent Moogish leads, most of the synth sounds are rather uninspiring, and left for dead by those in the Korg Vox Continental, I'd put them in the same ballpark in terms of quality and tweakability as those in the SK1, so not great. The clavs - there are only two options - can be saved by tweaking the amp sims, which also really help some of the synth sounds.

 

I'll write more when I get it out on a gig, but I think we're still waiting for someone to nail the clonewheel/synth keyboard that could fill both those duties as the top tier board of a two-tier rig. The Nord Stage Compact may still be the best option for that, though Nord's idea of what a Hammond should sound like has never made me happy enough to go there. In the meantime, however, I have been able to fairly quickly and easily program sound combinations ('live sets') for the four sets I need for a cover band gig, and I enjoy playing the clonewheel. On some gigs I can see the YC61 replacing my SK1 over a Korg Vox Continental rig. The organ makes me happy, the pianos are what you'd expect from Yamaha, and the rest is serviceable.

 

Fwiw, the slightly narrower keys do look slightly odd when you have another keyboard such as an SK1 or a Korg Vox Continental above or below it, but they have no effect on my playing.

 

US retailers still say June, and I'd be pretty hopeful given they've already arrived here.

Gig keys: Hammond SKpro, Korg Vox Continental, Crumar Mojo 61, Crumar Mojo Pedals

 

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Thanks, Niacin, very helpful. I'm especially encouraged by your comments on the action. I'm more focused on action and finger to touch connection than on absolute authenticity which is why, for instance, I go with Mojo over the Legend. The Vox is my favorite action for playing both organ and piano on one board, so if the YC is in that league, that's saying a lot.

 

You're obviously no stranger to clones, so your positive comments suggest it's better at that then most of us have been anticipating.

 

Despite it's less inspiring aspects, the saving grace for the YC, for me, might be the seemless ios integration. Piping in Neo Soul Keys and a synth app could help greatly to make the board feel complete.

 

My plan was to trade in my VR09 for this, but given how gig prospects have moved to a distant horizon, I may not be in a hurry to act.

Gigging: Crumar Mojo 61, Hammond SKPro

Home: Vintage Vibe 64

 

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+1 with Adan on the great report Niacin. Happy to hear about action too...I'm really not that picky about action but the best way I can describe playing the pianos on my NE4 is like having little sponges on my fingers...so I use a PX5S to control it for those sounds. Have been working on adding VST's/Cantabile to my set-up too and excited about the built-in audio interface in the YC61....that should cover for any on-board sound deficiencies. Hoping this can be my sole keyboard...plug the computer right into it and one set of outs to my amp or the house mixer...have reached an age where that kind of light weight simplicity would be a real good thing...
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Nice writeup.

 

The drive works for me better than that on the SK1

It won't solve all the ills, but on the SK1, have you tried selecting the EP drive option and using that on the organs? It's better than the organ-specific drive setting.

 

I think we're still waiting for someone to nail the clonewheel/synth keyboard that could fill both those duties as the top tier board of a two-tier rig. The Nord Stage Compact may still be the best option for that, though Nord's idea of what a Hammond should sound like has never made me happy enough to go there.

FWIW, I think the NS3 with its current software is notably better than their earlier Stage organ implementations. Plus it does have the assignable out if you'd rather send it through a Vent. I guess the next best option is probably the Roland VR-730 which has a bit of an edge over the Vox Continental in the organ/synth categories in that the organ has all the chorus and percussion options available, and the synth is fully editable (though it requires an iPad for that).

Maybe this is the best place for a shameless plug! Our now not-so-new new video at https://youtu.be/3ZRC3b4p4EI is a 40 minute adaptation of T. S. Eliot's "Prufrock" - check it out! And hopefully I'll have something new here this year. ;-)

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Nice writeup.

 

The drive works for me better than that on the SK1

It won't solve all the ills, but on the SK1, have you tried selecting the EP drive option and using that on the organs? It's better than the organ-specific drive setting.

 

Yeh, I use it, but it's still not great imho. I have my SK1 tweaked up the wazoo, using amp sim drive and EQ to tweak each synth sound, using the wah fx with a fixed filter as a filter to create pads, etc, so that I actually have a reasonable arsenal of synth patches that work pretty well in a cover band context. I've even got the piano sound EQed to a place where it's serviceable for pop or blues. But the overdrive on the organ doesn't make me real happy even using the EP drive option which does give you a more useable range.

 

I think we're still waiting for someone to nail the clonewheel/synth keyboard that could fill both those duties as the top tier board of a two-tier rig. The Nord Stage Compact may still be the best option for that, though Nord's idea of what a Hammond should sound like has never made me happy enough to go there.

 

FWIW, I think the NS3 with its current software is notably better than their earlier Stage organ implementations. Plus it does have the assignable out if you'd rather send it through a Vent. I guess the next best option is probably the Roland VR-730 which has a bit of an edge over the Vox Continental in the organ/synth categories in that the organ has all the chorus and percussion options available, and the synth is fully editable (though it requires an iPad for that).

 

For you maybe, but for me the quality of Roland's Hammond sound in the VR-09/730 is in the same ballpark as that of the Vox Continental, and way below that of the SK1, Nords, Mojo etc. It doesn't make me happy. I rarely use the Hammond sound on the Vox except occasionally to layer something like 004 400 000 under a synth sound to fatten it up. I find the top drawbars in the Roland borderline unuseable. I did own the first version of the VR-09 for a while and mostly stuck to the bottom 4 drawbars. Although the Roland synth section provides for more accurate tweaking that the touch faders on the Vox, the synth section on the Vox provides a wealth of high quality sounds that can be readily tweaked, and the texture/character of it, if that's the right word, compared to that of the Roland, really works for me: the Oberheim emulation can be tweaked from Jump to True Colours and everything in between and sounds just gorgeous. YMMV. Yes I'm aware that the Stage 3 has a better clonewheel than the Stage 2, and I can happily listen to other players and think it (or the latest Electro or C2) sounds great, but when I play it I find myself pulling drawbars and just not quite getting what I'm looking for, and so instead of getting on with playing I'm distracted trying to find the sound I was looking for, which is not a happy place. Given how it sounds out front though I'm still inclined to rate it alongside the SK1, the Mojo/Gemini and the YC61, even though those boards don't give me that headache. And the Petrof 'Black Upright' sounds as good as any acoustic piano patch I've heard through a PA on a stick, and collapses to mono pretty nicely. Yet to see how the YC61 holds up in that regard. Again, ymmv.

Gig keys: Hammond SKpro, Korg Vox Continental, Crumar Mojo 61, Crumar Mojo Pedals

 

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For you maybe, but for me Roland's Hammond sound in the VR-09/730 is in the same ballpark as that of the Vox Continental

 

I haven't played the Vox yet... I rated the Roland higher only on the basis of actually having all the expected organ parameters available. I also haven't heard the newest organ update in the Roland, for that matter. (I'd agree that the Nord organ beats the original VR09 at least.) But regardless, I was merely placing the VR-730 as 2nd-best to the NS3 for having organ and synth in one. I did not mean to imply it was a close second. It could be in the ballpark of the Vox and still be second. ;-)

Maybe this is the best place for a shameless plug! Our now not-so-new new video at https://youtu.be/3ZRC3b4p4EI is a 40 minute adaptation of T. S. Eliot's "Prufrock" - check it out! And hopefully I'll have something new here this year. ;-)

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