Send and Return

[Starman]

Hi,

Wanted ask what was the difference with using the send/return on the back of my amp's head when using effect pedals rather than using the normal input - effects chain? I was told that usually the send and return is the best way to go 'cause:

1: it cuts down any extraneous noises and

2: and allows the amp's pre-amp to be fully utilized at it's max. power. Advice/suggestions please.

 

P.S I have a Laney TF700 head and 4 X 12" cab.

[Jedro]

I think it depends on the type of effect you using as to whether it will be more efficient. I always felt that most pedals sounded better in front (guitar--effects--amp) of the amp rather than in the loop. Rack units sounded better in the loop. All this, of course, could be due to my choice of effects. I say try 'em both and then decide. Experiment!

 

One thing I like was to have a volume pedal in my effects loop. That way I didn't lose the preamp gain like you do when you lower the volume before the amp. Same tone, just a lower volume.

[fantasticsound]

Unless your amp has switchable levels on the effects loop, you're better off putting effect pedals (which output instrument level) in front of the amp and line-level effects in the loop. Besides, most dynamics, wah, and distortion pedals should feed the preamp. In the effects loop, they appear after the pre-amp gain stages.

[Starman]

Interesting you make mention Jedro of the volume pedal. I've tried to do that but it somehow takes away the full effect of any dirty or distortion channels. I was hoping that a volume pedal would increase the volume for when I take a solo but all I found it does it cut back the sound, like totally wipe off the distortion effect and gain from the signal. Weird?

[Philip OKeefe]

Originally posted by Starman:

Interesting you make mention Jedro of the volume pedal. I've tried to do that but it somehow takes away the full effect of any dirty or distortion channels. I was hoping that a volume pedal would increase the volume for when I take a solo but all I found it does it cut back the sound, like totally wipe off the distortion effect and gain from the signal. Weird?

Not really... as Neil told you, some things need to go in the front of the chain for the normal results. Compressors distortion and boost pedals normally sound best "up front" and not in the effects loop. Depending on your amp, you might have level controls that allow you to use these instrument level devices successfully in the effects loop, or you can try the volume pedal trick, but if you don't like that, you're not alone... so feel free to experiment.

 

Normally, things like delays, verbs and chorus are done post preamp tone (ie the effects loop), but you can try chorus up in front or whatever... it's a different sound, which you may or may not prefer, but most people don't do it that way.

 

In short, it depends on your gear and preferences. What amp and efx are you running?

[BlueZet]

you can use a volume pedal to give you more headroom for soloing, BUT it can't give you a boost, what it will do, is turn DOWN volume when playing rhythm, then go to full volume (or anywhere in between) for the solo

 

I've used chorus, tremolo and delay pedals in the effects loop with good results, comp, overdrive and wah should come between gtr and amp

[picker]

I absolutely swear by putting delay & chorus in the loop, and gain increasing effects(overdrive, distortion) in front. However, filter effects(wah, ring modulator, phase shifter, Univibe) and sometimes flanging can sound very cool either way. One thing that is for sure, if you have a partiucularly noisy time-based effect, the loop gets rid of a lot of noise by simply not pre-amplifiying it. However, most effects loops simply do not work well with gain-increasing pedals, and these days they are about the noisiest pedals out there.

I have never had any problems with input/output levels on pedals as opposed to rack units in the loop, and I have tried a bunch of them on several different amps with loops. Actually, when I got my first Boogie, it had level problems with a Deltalab Effectron II rack unit I had been using before the Boogie. Mesa said it was because the Deltalab unit didn't have the right buffering circuitry. I got rid of the Deltalab and got some Digitech pedals(the Two Second Delay & the Chorus/Flanger), and the problems went away...

[Starman]

Philip: my amp and effects are:

Laney TF700 head

4 X 12" cab

Boss Chorus

Foot controlled channel switcher (my amp has three channels - clean, crunch and dirty)

Zoom 505II (I only use this as a tuner now and for it's auto wah)

Proel Volume pedal

 

Thats it!

P.S Are there any websites that discuss this matter and show you combinations, hooking up effects etc?

[Bbach1]

Jedro, you might have to replace your avatar with a number 39 pretty soon.

Freekin awesome comeback on sunday.

Ok, I won't hijack this thread. Let's see, what were we talking about again? Oh yea, pedals and effects and stuff. Have any of you ever thought about plugging your guitar right in to your amp?