self learned as opposed to taught

[PeeMonkey]

I myself am a self taught guitarist, I was wondering anyone else the same, and the number of years they have been playing. I myself have been playing for about almost 2 years and am feeling kinda down because I think I couldve had a much bigger improvement with some guidance in the amount of time I took. Anyone else take lessons and see that they are really worth the costs of it? Ive seen lesson range from around 80+$ per month I think. Please post replys.

[A String]

I am self taught and really wish I had taken lessons. I am now a teacher and seeing how a little guidance can really push a guitar student in the right direction makes me wish I had that. I learned scales by stumbling across them. I learned songs by ear (I suppose that was a good thing to learn). I learned theory by trying to blindly piece everything together myself. Things would have gone much quicker if the puzzle pieces had been visible to me via a teacher. You can learn it all yourself, but if you really want to learn quickly, get a teacher!

[BlueZet]

mostly self taught - I took 6 months of classical guitar when I had been playing about 20 years,because I wanted to learn to play "from the paper", but didn't stick to it (I can read sme music and can learn a simple melody from sheet music if I have enough time, but that's it)

I learned a lot from teaching though - having to explain why you do what you do and how you go about it is a MAJOR lesson for yourself

[NMcGuitar]

Lessons from a good teacher, who will really pay attention to what you do and how you play, are worth their weight in gold.

 

I have taught myself a lot over the years, but I don't think I could have gotten nearly as far if I hadn't started out with several years of good lessons.

 

The main things to remember when looking for a teacher, is to find one that: A)knows what they are doing; you don't want a teacher who is practically a beginner themselves. And B)that you can connect with personally - it will make the learning process much more enjoyable, and therefore, more productive.

 

My $0.02

[Gruupi]

I am 95% self taught but had a few lessons as a beginner. If you are self motivated you can learn most of whet you need but you should definatly read everything you can and talk to other musicians as much as possible. A good teacher can save you alot of time. A bad teacher will make you want to quit. I had some very mediocre teachers but was driven enought to keep going. The best music teacher I ever had was a guy that gave me saxphone lessons when I was around 30 or so. He was so happy to be teaching someone with some music experience that was older than 13 that he gave alot of bang for the buck. He would come to my house for the lesson and stay way past the hour he was supposed to be giving me. He would stay and have a beer or 2 and we would talk about music. He was the one who turned me on to Coltrane so that alone was worth the lessons. He would also go ande pick out equipment and I would try and pay him for his time but he wouldn't even let me.

A bad teacher will try and force a particular style on you and be demeaning of your tastes. A teacher should make information about other styles available but shouldnt force you in a direction. Maybe I am a bit stubborn and am hard to teach but it sure would have been easier early on to have someone to ask questions of.

[PeeMonkey]

Thanks for the replies, but finding the right teacher would be pretty hard I guess.

 

Does reading alot of music theory help my composition of solos and etc. ALso anyone have suggestions of good books to read to help my song writing?

[headlow]

I've been playing for seven years and was completely self taught. I have been in and out of bands since I was 17, and never had the time or desire to take lessons. I think I was also a touch arrogant and thought that I didn't really need them. However when my last band broke up I started taking lessons just to make sure I didn't lose interest. Now I wish I'd started years ago. After only a few lessons I can play things I could only dream of before. I think that I now also have a better understanding of the guitar. You should start taking lessons ASAP. You'll be amazed at the improvement you'll make.

[Tedster]

Fascinating. I tested a pet theory with a buddy of mine (teacher up in Michigan). He's been teaching at a music store there for years...and has probably seen hundreds of kids come and go. Right now he says he's got about 75 students.

 

As an occasional teacher myself, I asked him "What percentage of the kids you teach go on to attain musical enlightenment?" His answer was about what my experience was; only a tiny, tiny, tiny percentage go on to become even proficient enough to play in a band. The typical guitar "student" fancies himself (or herself) a star, or worse, they really don't have a clue why they want to learn it. They want a teacher who will spoon feed them until they get bored with it, and then they quit.

 

Yup.

 

I'm "self"-taught. My buddy took lessons for a little while, and then broke off on his own. Same with most of the decent guitar players I have known. I think that the successful guitar "students" are ones that already have a grasp of the instrument, and want the right teacher to boost them to higher places, not to sit and tap out lessons in the Mel Bay book.

[PeeMonkey]

I see youve made a really good point tedster.

 

what is one method to greatly improve without a instructor other then practice, well practice is essential but I still need a large knowledge on how to compose the right solo's and so on. Music theory books useful in any ways? ALso who here can actually read notes like reading a book? Ive had much trouble learning based on notes and mainly been learning off tabs.. is that bad?

[njrocker]

Being able to read music isn't really necessary for guitar. But if you could, you would be able to, for example, read a lick a piano player would play and do it on guitar.

 

Lots of awesome guys can't read music. Slash, for example.

 

But, if you learn to read music, I believe your rhythm and timing improve incredibly.

 

As for learning songs from tab, everybody does it. See if you can figure it out by ear first though. If you can't nail it, go for the tab.

 

(BTW, I read music. I took piano lessons, classical and jazz, for a while before guitar. I think that's why guitar seemed so natural to me. On guitar I do, rock, heavy metal, blues, everything...learning to read is a good thing, but you can get by without it.)

[Lee Flier]

Well it depends on what type of music you want to play. I think the best way to learn to compose solos is by LISTENING to music. That's something a teacher can't really help you with. Theory, scales, reading music and so on, those are just tools to help you be able to execute what you want to "say" with the guitar. They can't actually tell you what to say.

 

If you find that you have a lot of good ideas for solos but are simply unable to play them, then yeah, learning theory and scales and so on from a formal teacher will help you. If you simply don't know how to compose solos well, then more careful listening, and maybe discussing the merits of some of your favorite solos/riffs with others (like on this forum) would be a good way to build a foundation. You can always take lessons down the road if you find you still need them - and at that point you'd have a much better idea what you need to accomplish with your lessons, and therefore you'll be more motivated to stick with it and work harder.

 

Sometimes you can get good ideas for songs or solos just from messing around on the guitar, too. Make it a point to spend lots of time just playing - not necessarily learning a tune from tab, or whatever, but just noodling around. Maybe get a chord book and learn a new chord, see what ideas that triggers in your brain.

 

Or when you're in the shower or about to fall asleep or some other quiet place, just imagine you're playing guitar and think of what you would play. If you like what you've thought of, then when you have the guitar in your hands, try to play that.

 

So... sometimes you come up with more ideas for parts when you don't have the guitar in your hands and therefore aren't limited to what you can play. Other times playing itself is what inspires you, and still other times, listening to others. So be sure to do all three!

[I I mjrn]

Originally posted by Peemonkey:

Does reading alot of music theory help my composition of solos and etc. ALso anyone have suggestions of good books to read to help my song writing?

Theory won't necessarily help you be creative; music theory is a way to understand how music that you hear fits together more than the way it should be made.

It's also good to know the terminology when you want to communicate with others, though remember that the sounds are the best communicators.

An understanding of it will, however, help you find connections between various elements & give you ideas to explore to increase your experiments & studies. That effort will yield bits & pieces that you may eventually make into compositions.

 

I think you'd be better off studying the tunes of writers you like than trying to find a "workbook" for writing. Not just to imitate but to hear how they do the things that intrigue you---how the move between chords, what harmonies you like, etc. Make music your "book".

 

As far as teachers, besides what's been said, I suggest that you find people that are able & willing to help you with the music that you like but also interested enough to alert you to areas that you might neglect on your own. You, too, must be willing to take their advice.

Keep in mind that you may go through several teachers; not necessarily because they're not right for you but because as you evolve what you need varies & there's something to be learned from many people that's wider than from just one.

 

Lastly, don't let yourself get too impatient; you'll be learning music for the rest of your life.

[mstreck]

Originally posted by Peemonkey:

I myself am a self taught guitarist, I was wondering anyone else the same, and the number of years they have been playing. I myself have been playing for about almost 2 years and am feeling kinda down because I think I couldve had a much bigger improvement with some guidance in the amount of time I took. Anyone else take lessons and see that they are really worth the costs of it? Ive seen lesson range from around 80+$ per month I think. Please post replys.

Yeah... what YOU said... ME, TOO! I've got a little over two years in but I was able to teach myself enough to get into a working band. I am definitely NOT the most talented member of the group and I was considering starting lessons. But I was talking to the lead guitarist about it and he said that I already "know" everything I need to know. I just need to "put in the time exploring the open spaces". Our bass player tells me to take vocal lessons instead and that in itself will help my playing. Maybe that's something to think about?

 

Mike

[pauldil]

Originally posted by NMcGuitar:

Lessons from a good teacher, who will really pay attention to what you do and how you play, are worth their weight in gold.

I agree. A good teacher can not only show you new things, but can also show you effective ways of using what you already know. Sometimes they can function as more of a coach, pointing out bad habits and suggesting corrections to problems. In the end it's still up to you. I think a lot of people think that showing up for a lesson once a week is enough. You still have to practice and work on your lesson all week long.

 

Paul

[Gifthorse]

In the end, you will sink or swim on guitar or any instrument. It is up to you. If you want to play a certain way bad enough, you will find a way to do it. You may need a teacher, you may not. You know what to do. I mean if you listen to some sicko and can't for the life of you figure out what the hell he is doing, for the love of god, find someone who does!! If your doing what you want, and your happy then it all makes sense. I think a good teacher can teach you a year's worth in 1 lesson.

[jzgtrguy]

It has often been said that "Experience is the best teacher" it could be better said that "someone elses experience is the best teacher" How ever. Even with lessons your going to get to the point where you really need to start figureing out a lot of stuff on your own but you really never ever get away from the need to study. The more you know the more you know that you don't know! I read an article a while back about Pat Metheny and he was saying if he could take the time he would like to take some lessons from either Pat Martino or Frank Gambale on picking technique! If Mr. Metheny says he needs lessons once in a while enough said.

 

Best,

 

Jeff

[Base]

I've played for about 12 years, a bit on and off. I was completely self-taught to start with, learning songs from tab, which was fine for me to be able to sit down and play something similar to what I had learned. A couple of years ago I wanted to get back into playing and took lessons for about six months and it was the best thing I ever did for playing. I had some ability, and my teacher just kinda polished it all up, sorted out my rythm and timing (something I was very weak at as I always played alone and not even along with tapes). Have been playing in a band ever since. You need the right teacher, but it is definitely worth it....

[Tele Kinesis]

I'm self taught by observing, stealing and investigating. Lately, I've been feeling a bit stagnant, though. I needed to learn new things. The computer is most useful tool in the world. Even with an instructor, a computer can be VERY handy.

Along with large chord charts on the wall, and scale charts, I use the computer. There are chord finders that come in handy. I have been searching for "theory" sites to learn more about why I would want to construct a piece a certain way.

A lot of times, I just load up Band-in-a-Box or Jammer, and let it auto-generate a tune. For whatever it comes up with, I try to figure out a guitar part. That's where the chord charts, and even computer chord finders come in handy. It forces me to play in different keys and positions, and learn new stuff. Most of the auto-generated stuff isn't very interesting, but it is useful in that it provides a good, solid beat with instrumental accompaniment. That helps with the phrasing and timing, and the different beats provide a bit of variety.

I can peck out notes on a staff, but I can't sight read very well, though I am getting faster at that. The problem I always had was that the music made some sense, but translating that to the fretboard didn't. Now I'm getting a good idea of where to quickly pick out notes on the fretboard, and the idea behind major, minor, diminished, 7th....all that. I knew how to play those chords from copping them from others and figuring them out, but I didn't even know what they were called, or why. I know how to play lead, just because I know by ear the intervals that sound good, or sound sour. And, there's still a LOT I could do to improve on that. I stsrt in adventure-land, but seem to end up in a safe harbor when I hit the wall.

I basically got tired of playing the stock blues/country/rock stuff with just a bit of my own twists thrown in. Sometimes simple is better for a particular mood of a song. But it's better, probably, to have the ability to delve in deeper to create more interesting things.

Any means necessary, I believe. I'm just trying to be careful not lose myself in the process. I don't wanna be a speed for speed's sake, scale-running wanker. I just wanna know what I'm doing.

And, it does make it easier when you know what someone else is talking about.

 

Tele

[Bbach1]

Originally posted by Peemonkey:

I myself am a self taught guitarist, I was wondering anyone else the same, and the number of years they have been playing. I myself have been playing for about almost 2 years and am feeling kinda down because I think I couldve had a much bigger improvement with some guidance in the amount of time I took. Anyone else take lessons and see that they are really worth the costs of it? Ive seen lesson range from around 80+$ per month I think. Please post replys.

I started out the traditional way, Hal Leonard, book 1. Oh soooooo boring. I couldn't force myself to start on book two, so I went for lessons. Mainly, I needed music theory because I want to know how and why, and because I need to be able to sight read somewhat because I'm not good about picking up a tune by ear yet. I spend about nine months on scales, chord shapes, and finger exercises. That got very boring too. After nine months I still didn't know any complete songs. But now, things are taking off. Some of the work has paid off and I'm now having so much fun learning. I think I'm going to hook up with another instructor and get a few more tips as I slowly begin to build a song repitoire. Guitars are a blast.