Anyone got a "slide" rule?

[whitefang]

I obtained a cheap-o acoustic (Magnum) off my niece, and the action is so bad, I decided to use it to learn "slide". Got a glass tube(the chrome was more than I had on me) and am looking for tips on technique, tunings, tricks and anything else I might be overlooking. And if any of you have any extra patience, I might could use

some of THAT, too!

All help would be greatly appreciated...

Whitefang

[DC]

I learned slide by listening to George Harrison a bunch. I'd pick up some of his albums and also check 'Imagine' by John Lennon as Harrison does my fav slide solo on 'How Do You Sleep.'

 

I'm sure there are some good books on slide and tunings etc, but it's always been way quicker for me to listen to good playing and figure out how to do it.

[Gabriel E.]

It's easier if you use an open tuning. Open D, G, and E are popular as is open E with the low string dropped to a D. Right now I'm playing with a C6 which is what a lot of pedal steel players use. It's fun.

 

Listen to Robert Johnson, Ellmore James, Sonny Landreth and Duane Allman.

 

The Pahunuhi Bros. (sp?) are the masters of Hawaiian Slack Key playing.

[rog951]

Well, I SUCK ASS at slide playing (but I am working on it) so I won't try to give you much advice. I WILL second the motion on George Harrison though, and I'll throw David Lindley's name out there too. He played some very cool leads on Jackson Browne's stuff...

[Tedster]

George was the Guru of melodic slide.

 

Now, if you wanna get down and dirty, listen to Duane Allman, Johnny Winter, Bonnie Raitt, Lowell George (old Little Feat)...etc.

 

The cool thing about Harrison's approach is that it sorta transcended a lot of the cliche blues licks a lot of people gravitate toward when they learn slide.

 

A couple of the coolest slide solos ever recorded IMHO are Badfinger's "Day After Day"...very Harrisonesque...and Todd Rundgren's "I Saw the Light". Both solos are similar in their harmonic/melodic approach...and funny, both Rundgren and Harrison produced the Badfinger album (Straight Up). Coincidence? I think not...

[whitefang]

To all who replied (so far);

I have a four-page sheet of open tunings, and open D seems easiest, as yet.

Am familiar with the artists mentioned, but I will NOT rely on Harrison as inspiration. If anything, his slide style will leave me feeling I'm wasting my time even trying. We'd all argue over whether he WAS sliding or not, or both sliding AND picking and bending at the same time!

It's that good!

Tedster, Rundgren was an odd lot! Couldn't nail him down, and I LOVED that about him. The same man that can do something like "Hello, It's Me", and then a few years down the road do "Hammer in My Heart" shows he can't be bothered with the limits of genre. Jack of all trades, and MASTER of them too! How many can make that claim?

whitefang

[Lee Flier]

Elmore James is a great place to start with slide.

 

--Lee

[Christopher]

You know who kicks ass on slide? Junior Brown.

 

And the guy from North Mississippi Allstars.

[Tedster]

Originally posted by whitefang:

Tedster, Rundgren was an odd lot! Couldn't nail him down, and I LOVED that about him. The same man that can do something like "Hello, It's Me", and then a few years down the road do "Hammer in My Heart" shows he can't be bothered with the limits of genre. Jack of all trades, and MASTER of them too! How many can make that claim?

whitefang

Yes, Jack of all trades, and master as well puts it aptly...no genre confines. When he's on top of his game, he's kinda beyond comprehension. But, he's done some pretty sucky stuff too. My favorite stuff of his is his early pop stuff and his spaced out prog stuff ("Initiation"...first "Utopia" LP) circa mid to late 70s). In my opinion he was at his worst when he became conscious of trying to score hit singles, and they just didn't happen. The ones that did happen seemed to happen spontaneously.

[halljams]

THIS GUY IS THE MOST STUNNING SLIDE PLAYER TO EVER WALK THE EARTH....

 

http://www.azizamusic.com/david.htm

 

I'm not joking, check him out.

[Mr. Downchild]

Whitefang, here's some basic pointers (subject to personal taste)

 

Wearing the slide- There's no "incorrect" finger to wear your slide on. Some players prefer to wear the slide on the middle finger(better vibrato/control), ring, or little finger (still fret notes/chords). Try them all and see which one feels comfortable to you. Heck, David Hole even wears his slide on his index finger, and places his hand OVER the neck in a style that's literally over the top! (BTW it took me about a year before I finally settled on wearing the slide on my little finger.)

 

Intonation- Expect your first efforts at slide to sound something like a neurotic cat in an acid bath. Like learning the bagpipes or violin for the first time, your initial efforts WILL sound terrible! When sounding a note, place the slide directly OVER and parallel to the fret. Think about it: when you fret a note with your finger, where does the string actually stop? At the fret!Though this should get you in the intonation ballpark, you will still need to rely on your ears to tell you whether a note is too sharp or flat.

 

Muting- This is an artform unto itself. I can't stress the importace of string damping to help achieve a clean sound. I almost always use a fingerstyle technique when I play slide. (exept for when I go for those Elmore James style glisses) This makes it easier to rest a finger, or the edge of my palm on strings that I don't want to sound. Unless you've played fingerstyle before, this technique can take a while to master, so keep practicing! Some players also lightly rest the unused fingers to the left of the slide (or right of the slide if you're a southpaw) to dampen the overtones that sometimes occur on that side. One more reason I went with the little finger.

 

When playing, keep your arm relaxed, and DON'T apply pressure to the strings with the slide! Just enough contact with the slide should be enough to get the string to sound. It also helps if your string radius is fairly flat. This will prevent you from having to rock the slide to reach from the treble strings to the bass strings, and vice-versa.

 

As far as types of slides, there are obviously many to choose from, so it's really a matter of personal preference, but a handy rule of slide is: the thicker the slide, the better the sustain. If you're just starting to slide, I recommend you start off with a relatively light slide just until you get the basics down pat. When you get the hang of it, a heavier slide will likely sound better, and will also help keep you from applying too much pressure to the strings. Again this boils down to whatever your personal preference may be.

 

When I learned to slide, it was like learning a whole new language, and it opened up new doors for me, but at first it wasn't easy, so don't get discouraged!

Hope this helps. If you have any questions, you know where to ask. Good luck!

[Marso]

Duane Allman, very very tasty. I would add Keb Mo to the list, for acoustic slide, a more vintage type of playing. Playing in open tuning will make you play different, that's good! If you play in standard tuning you might end up trying to do what is familiar to you, open tuning is a different animal! I agree a 100% with the previous post about muting strings, it is very usefull to be able to mute strings with your right hand in order to avoid dissonnance and also with your left hand by laying down one finger behind the slide in order to eliminate buzzes (unless that's what you wanna hear and that's cool too! J. Page and J. Winter did'nt bother many times)

[D_dup3]

You'll get a lotta stick from some people for what I'm suggesting but try it before you laugh.

Stick with regular tuning & you'll be able to play a much greater variety of music than any chordal/open tuning will allow.Just use your knowledge of theory/chord construction to build chords within a single fret !

Trust me, you can make 7ths,minors, & usable partials that can be very useful !

(An additional advantage is that you don't need to continually rethink the fretboard for single-note lines.)

P. S. For all doubters, check "Dreams" by the Allman Brothers---THAT was played in standard tuning !

[Gabriel E.]

Mississippi Fred McDowell is another one to listen to.

[whitefang]

d;

Don't fret none (pun possibly intended)about the suggestion of standard tuning. At this stage, I'm open (pun NOT intended)to ALL ideas, and might give it a go. I have a sheet with so many different tunings listed, I'm 'fraid my strings will snap if I go after all of 'em. So I'll not wander far from standard or open D.

Thanks to all for the help I've recieved, and to those who may offer even MORE ideas!

Whitefang

[lrbreez]

The tunings you want to be able play slide in are: standard, E or D, and G.

Buddy

[max]

i use standard tuning, a heavy brass pen or a 'swinging' slide on the second finger

 

the first time i saw someone play slide in a jam situation, it was ross hannaford (legendary oz rock guitarist) and he was using a bic lighter (!)

try that for a simple introduction to sliding and you'll never look back

 

cheers

max

newcastle, oz

[desoto]

Originally posted by Christopher:

[QB]You know who kicks ass on slide? Junior Brown.

QB]

Junior Brown kicks ass on anything related to guitar (just saw him in concert...woo-hoo!). But he pretty much slides on the steel guitar part, not really on the six-string stuff. Though I'm sure he'd kick ass on that, too.

 

I slide in Open D and standard only. There's some beautiful slide work on certain Stones songs...particularly No Expectations. You can see it being done on the Rock & Roll Circus video, very simple, elegant and effective. I think he's tuned to Open D (Lee- can you verify?).

 

Standard tuning is convenient, but can be a pain in the rear to put stuff together on. I like to follow along the "A chord formation" road map, I just chase it up and down the fret board to get started. Makes it easy to match your notes to whatever someone else is playing on rhythm guitar.

 

I personally found that wearing a slide on my little finger works great and leaves my other fingers free for damping or fretting notes or chords. I use a big brass slide because I like the tone. I pad it with a little foam to keep it on my finger above the first knuckle since my fingers are so small.

 

Have fun!

Amanda

[g.]

I thought Keith Richards was into that 5-string G tuning. Gonna have to take some songs apart and see...

[desoto]

Originally posted by greenboy:

I thought Keith Richards was into that 5-string G tuning. Gonna have to take some songs apart and see...

That's a Stones signature tuning, but it's not exclusive. They did a good share of Open D work including No Expectations (at least the Brian Jones slide work) and Prodigal Son (that's fun to play!).

 

I read somewhere that Jumping Jack Flash and Street Fighting Man were done in open D, but can't verify that off hand.

 

Amanda

[whitefang]

Originally posted by desoto:

Originally posted by greenboy:

I thought Keith Richards was into that 5-string G tuning. Gonna have to take some songs apart and see...

That's a Stones signature tuning, but it's not exclusive. They did a good share of Open D work including No Expectations (at least the Brian Jones slide work) and Prodigal Son (that's fun to play!).

 

I read somewhere that Jumping Jack Flash and Street Fighting Man were done in open D, but can't verify that off hand.

 

Amanda

Wasn't "Honkey Tonk Woman" done in that 5-string G tuning? And I Believe "Jumpin' Jack Flash" was in B-flat, making any open tuning a senseless

endeavor. But don't bet the rent on this...

whitefang

[tinsmith]

I'd like to add Leo Kottke to that list of slide masters. Anyone familiar with his slide work?

[GuitarG]

"And I Believe "Jumpin' Jack Flash" was in B-flat, making any open tuning a senseless

endeavor."

 

Use a capo.

[desoto]

Originally posted by tinsmith:

I'd like to add Leo Kottke to that list of slide masters. Anyone familiar with his slide work?

Love him! Love him! Just recently caught him in concert here in ABQ. Ice Water is still my favorite album.

 

Amanda

[Lee Flier]

Ohhh yeah I'm nutso about Kottke's slide work! And let's not forget Ry Cooder, nor Ron Wood when he was with the Faces. I copped a lot of slide licks from him.

 

Re: Stones tunings. "No Expectations" is in open E, which is basically the same as open D except you know... up a step.

 

All the others mentioned are in 5-string open G e.g. "Honky Tonk Women". "Jumpin' Jack Flash" and "Street Fightin' Man" are both open G with a capo. Same with "Tumbling Dice", "Can't Always Get What You Want" and a host of others.

 

--Lee

[desoto]

Originally posted by Lee Flier:

Re: Stones tunings. "No Expectations" is in open E, which is basically the same as open D except you know... up a step.

 

--Lee

Oops, right...: I forget that I often tune to open D and then capo on the 2nd fret to get Open E. I think that goes for Prodigal Son, too.

[Bob Keelan]

I believe that Gimme Shelter is in open D or open E too but the majority of Keith's open tunings is G. Lee is the authority on this stuff.

 

bob

[whitefang]

The guitar I'm trying slide on has action bad enough that if I used a capo, going up to open E

would put me somewhere just a notch above F, but not quite Fsharp! Trying out open C now. Different tuning pattern than D, and some nice sound. As I said earlier, learning slide differs from guitar in general because when I mess up on slide, I have a tendancy to laugh about it rather that the usual frustration. And I must say, lately I've been laughing my ass off!

I'm also jotting down ALL the tips to try out eventually, so keep 'em coming! Appreciate them all.

 

whitefang

[strat0124]

I echo Lee with Ron Wood and Ry Cooder.....to me masters of the genre. Ole EC ain't no slouch either when he's in the mood. Dickey Betts is a killer dobro/slide player in his own right, LeRoy Parnell, Bonnie Raitt, Lowell George, Billy Gibbons, Bob DePiero, Sonny Landreth, Keb Mo, Alvin Youngblood Hart, ect. all kick ass.

Playing slide has always been my ticket in, with respect to getting work playing music. I am sorta glad not many other people do it!!!!!

[g.]

To re-open an old fave: forgot to mention the guy at least one major record company had high hopes for to fill the Stevie Ray void in terms of blues for the masses: John Campbell. Just as he was beginning to get with recording he died of a heart attack.

 

One bad mojo slide man from Texas by way of Louisiana, this guy could make it wail! His remake of WHEN THE LEVEE BREAKS is alone worth the work of trying to find his stuff in cut-out bins.

 

Good luck to ya, he only gets better each time I listen -- and that ain't closing time talkin' ; }