Ow.. Ow Owww... My poor little fingers! :(

[Nollykin]

Argh - Okay, is it just me, or am I doing something wrong with my power chords.

 

I dont only play powers, I play opens as well at the moment... but whenever I DO play power chords, my fretting fingers hurt after a few minutes of playing.

 

This is because of how I put my hands. My palm rests on the back of the neck, with the thumb sitting along the back facing the headstock. Pretty much dead centre. This forces my fingers to touch the strings (index finger on the E, 3rd finger on the A and D...) with the end, then bend upwards at the first nuckle, bending my first joint backwards... A mate says its better to play them with straight fingers, but I find this difficult.

 

How I am playing now just HURTS. My 3rd finger mainly - it is bent back so far that it goes white. see - thats the only way I can get my palm resting on the neck. If I take it off, I can get straight fingering, and oppose the force on the fretboard with my thumb in the centre of the neck (at the back)... aiee... and its all buggered. My hand looks deformed when I do any of this.

 

If I take my palm off the neck, I am basically holding the neck with my thumb on one side, and my two fingers - 1st and 3rd - on the strings - I find it hard to slide along the fretboard without a good grip...

 

My fingers are quite short, but yeah... could anyone please suggest a CORRECT way to place fingers in power chord structure? This is really hurting

 

Nolly

[BUSH IS GOD]

No pain, no gain.

 

Oah iss it "No pain, no brrain".

 

I haff foahgotten.

[pumpcat]

I was always taught that the "correct" way is to fret the root with the index finger, fifth with the ring finger, and the octave with the pinky. That's how most barre chords are fretted, and a power chord is just the bottom half of a barre chord.

[Nollykin]

Originally posted by pumpcat:

I was always taught that the "correct" way is to fret the root with the index finger, fifth with the ring finger, and the octave with the pinky. That's how most barre chords are fretted, and a power chord is just the bottom half of a barre chord.

Cant REALLY do that - my pinky is too small

 

hehe

[Tedster]

Well, Nollster...I think, if I read you correctly, you're double barring with the index on the root and third on the 5th and octave...so, if you're barring an A on the fifth fret you'd have

 

x

x

x

7

7

5

 

With the index playing the "5" and the third playing the two "7s". If your pinky is small and such, that may be the only way. Naturally, your third finger is going to be mooshed down in the only way it can be to double barre those strings. Make sure you're using your thumb as a "clamp" on the back of the neck. Go easy. It will hurt at first, and little by little it oughta get better. Heck, you're still pretty new to this game, don't expect to be "Joe Powerchord" overnight. I'd say to get used to playing 'em, play songs with mostly open chords, and toss in a couple power chords. Little by little, y'know.

[Nollykin]

Originally posted by Tedster:

Well, Nollster...I think, if I read you correctly, you're double barring with the index on the root and third on the 5th and octave...so, if you're barring an A on the fifth fret you'd have

 

x

x

x

7

7

5

I knew this much - I am doing it as you say - no, I'm not double barring the index, Im double barring the 3rd finger. And yes, I can play them... and play them quite well... its just... painful sometimes.

 

With the index playing the "5" and the third playing the two "7s". If your pinky is small and such, that may be the only way. Naturally, your third finger is going to be mooshed down in the only way it can be to double barre those strings. Make sure you're using your thumb as a "clamp" on the back of the neck.

Clamp? How do you mean? at the moment, my thumb runs along flat along the back of the neck, parallel to it. Should I be bringing the thumb up and around the neck, as if I were to mute the 6th string (but without doing so)? Is that what you're saying?

 

Go easy. It will hurt at first, and little by little it oughta get better. Heck, you're still pretty new to this game, don't expect to be "Joe Powerchord" overnight. I'd say to get used to playing 'em, play songs with mostly open chords, and toss in a couple power chords. Little by little, y'know.

I generally only know of songs with all powers, or all opens.. and I dont know many with all opens

 

I have been practicing marilyn manson and the likes a lot - as far as power chords, which is very.. VERY simple...

 

(tabs)

 

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

7 7 7 7 101010105 5 5 5 3 3 3 3

7 7 7 7 101010105 5 5 5 3 3 3 3

5 5 5 5 7 7 7 7 3 3 3 3 1 1 1 1

 

if you didnt notice, the 10 - is the 10th fret... kinda hard putting double digits in tablature... you COULD play it as

 

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

- - - - 5 5 5 5 - - - - - - - -

7 7 7 7 5 5 5 5 5 5 5 5 3 3 3 3

7 7 7 7 3 3 3 3 5 5 5 5 3 3 3 3

5 5 5 5 - - - - 3 3 3 3 1 1 1 1

 

but... it doesnt sound right.

 

If those tabs seem stuffed, put em into notepad

 

anyway... but thats fairly simple stuff. As you can see.

 

*sigh* what am I dribbling about.

 

So basically... what I am doing is right? It just doesnt seem that way - my 3rd finger is at an awkward angle... the blood flow gets cut off from it and it turns white from the knuckle down... hmm... *shrug*

 

Nolly

[Tedster]

There's your prob, Nollster! Thumb PARALLEL to the neck!!! YIKES! Your thumb should be as perpendicular to the back of the neck as you can get it, pressing in on it. Well, it's hard to describe without a picture. Once in awhile your thumb can creep over like muting the 6th, but generally it should be pressing in on the back of the neck. Pick up a can of soda pop with your left hand. Squeeze it between your fingers and thumb. Now, try and do it by having your thumb parallel to the can. You'll be lucky if you can even pick it up, much less smoosh it. You want to smoosh the neck between your fingers and your thumb.

[PhilcoFord]

I concur with Tedster. The correct way to fret the instrument is to place the fat part of your thumb (the part with the print) squarely on the back of the neck, right in the center (on the stripe if you have one). Then you arch your wrist to get your fingers to depress the strings in a perpendicular manner. This is the way classical guitarists play. It takes some getting used to, but it's worth the effort (especially if you have small hands).

 

Great guitarists and guitarists with large hands can get away with a lot of slop. The rest of us need to master the basics and work with what we have.

 

Good luck!

[Nollykin]

so what... your palm doesnt even touch the guitar? Argh... no way. I've been doing it all wrong.

 

its fine with open chords... aiee

 

argh... no way. I cant grip the neck like this... my fingers are too small to reach the top strings!!

 

Hmmmm.. argh, bloody hell..

[Crimean]

I have pretty small hands; I think that flexibility and strength can offset some of the problems that happen wtih having smaller hands/fingers.

 

There are two main grips that I use. One is 'Classical' where the thumb 'follows' the fingers back and forth on the fretboard.

For instance, if you're playing on the low E string, your thumb would be planted directly 'through' the guitar lining up with your second finger. If you were to play the B string, it would be the same, but your thumb would line up directly 'through' the guitar, planted at the B String.

In this case, if you were playing a run, your thumb and hand would move in unison from the Low E string, to the High E string.

 

The second is more of a 'Blues/Rock' group. The thumb does not follow the fingers in unison. What happens instead is: If you're playing something on the B string, the thumb would be planted, across from the 2nd finger, but 'under the A string'. By doing it that way, you can 'hook' your thumb around the fretboard to do Bends, and Rock vibrato (Which is different than Classical vibrato).

 

I hope that made sense... Like Tedster said, it should always be perpendicular... And ideally, through the guitar lined up with the second finger.

 

An exercise you can try, on a guitar with lighter strings, is playing a song without using your thumb to plant... Just the strength of your fingers! Lucky for those opposable thumbs.

[Sylver]

Originally posted by Nollykin:

so what... your palm doesnt even touch the guitar? Argh... no way. I've been doing it all wrong.

 

its fine with open chords... aiee

 

argh... no way. I cant grip the neck like this... my fingers are too small to reach the top strings!!

 

Hmmmm.. argh, bloody hell..

Yep, that's right, your palm should never touch the guitar. I know it sounds awkward, but you'll get used to it. I'm teaching my wife how to play bass, and I had to beat that habit out of her. Like Ted said, in most cases, your thumb should be perpendicular to the neck, not parallel to it. It makes staying in position much easier, not too mention moving from scales to chords and vice versa. I just want to add one thing though. Da Tedster mentioned wraping your thumb around to mute ... A lot of players also fret with the thumb on certain chords(Hendrix, SRV, Beck, Clapton and Page all do some thumb chords). It does take some work, but unless your hands are REALLY small, it's a great technique to pick up. Better work on the bar and power chords first.

 

A tip I once heard about bar chords is to set up the non bar notes(IE, the ones not played with the bar finger) first, and make sure that they all ring, and that your hand is relaxed and comfortable, THEN apply the bar. It works pretty well for learning bars.

[Nollykin]

I see.

 

Boy - I've been going about this all wrong... from the start. Ohh boy. I have to learn all over again

 

Woe is me... (well... technically, y'know.. Nolly is me... but you know..)

 

Thanks for all your help guys - any other help would be much appreciated.

 

I have trouble moving my hand along the fretboard when I'm doing this. *sigh* oh dear. But I guess - I practice.

 

all over again.

 

Nolly

[TurboDog]

Hey, I rest my hand on the strings when I play solos, fills, runs, etc. I've never had a problem. I know several people who do this also. I also get pinch harmonics from the back of my hand, not from the picking fingers. Different "strokes" for different folks.

 

Of course, you can't rest your hand on the strings while strumming.

 

My thumb is also all over the place. When playing most open chords, my thumb sticks up at the low E string. With barre chords, it is parallel to my index finger midway on the neck.

 

Nolly don't get too freaked out. Everybody's technique is a bit different. I could show you where some guitar gods have "bad" technique and still play amazingly.

 

Posture is important and easy. I'm guilty of being lazy when it comes to that. Keep your posture good and work on finger strength and you'll be fine.

[Rim]

Nolly,

 

It sounds like you're "squeezing" the guitar neck with your fretting fingers and your palm - like when you're making a fist if you weren't holding the neck. You need to squeeze the guitar neck more with your fretting fingers and your thumb so that if you're not holding the neck, your thumb would meet with your index and middle fingers.

 

It's hard to give technique advice without seeing what you're doing. Can you post a pic?

 

Anyway, it sounds like you're bending at your wrist outwards (so if you have your hands palms down on the desk, your fingers are pointing up). What you need to do is bend at your wrist inwards (your fingers is pointing down and will actually lift your palm off the desk) but not too much inwards.

 

Kinda hard for me to know for sure since I don't have a guitar handy but I think what I'm saying is right.

 

Hey, remember to play something you're good at to keep you from getting too frustrated and remind yourself of your progress.

[Nollykin]

I know what I need to do now... and yes, I was sorta squeezing the neck like a fist. I did that in open chords too... I find it really difficult if my hand isnt gounded somewhere.. but I guess that I'll have to get used to that.

 

I will try and post some pics. I need to get dads digital camera first...

 

 

Nolly

[doc taz]

I used to do classical guitar concerts in HS, and what Tedster said is right. Also, in my experience, if the guitar is slung too low, this can also cause poor finger positioning. Yeah, it looks cool to play that way for some, but in the long run, you're only asking for trouble.

 

I position the fretboard end of my guitar (standing up) at around belly button level (sometimes slightly lower). The neck angle is usually around 30-45 degrees (stand in front of a mirror with the guitar on, make the neck parallel to the floor, then push the headstock up 30-45 degrees). The degree setting depends on what I'm playing; if it's rock, it usually lies at 30. If it's more classically oriented, jazzy or otherwise complex (wide chord stretches) then it's 45 degrees, sometimes more. Of course, you don't have to be fully conscious of this at all times; it comes naturally with practice. I a 5-foot, 4-inch guy with small hands, and I can play a 7 string guitar or 6 string bass comfortably, as long as it's not slung too low.

 

No surprise to me that Dream Theater's string pluckers play their runs for long stretches...can't do their stuff with the guitar slung low.

[Nollykin]

That isnt a problem for me - I sit my guitar right up thats - si its resting almost above my belly button. I have no problems there.

 

When I try to do open chords with my thumb like you said it should be (nintey degrees to the neck, keeping it steady) then I cant bring my wrist around far enough to hit the strings right. My fingers are so small I have to make them go all sideways.

 

its crazy, really

 

Nolly