**MYLES!!!** OVER HERE! (hehe) Amps... also, thankyou to all :)

[Nollykin]

Heyyy. hope the subject got your attention.

 

Right. Well.. now that I'm here, I'll begin. I am a new guitarist, and if you have read any other posts of mine you'd know I'm just about to buy my first electric - so I dont know heaps about them. HOWEVER, my friends have basic electrics (yamaha and samick respectively) with amps of the same brand (bought in packs). So thats about the extent of my knowledge on amps..... yeah.. not much.

 

I have guessed form hat I have read that "modeling" amps are the electronic ones like Line 6, Yamaha DG etc, that recreate the sound electronically. And Tube amps are the "standard" amp. Is this about right?

 

My question is thus: What is a tube amp? What sort of things make the sound quality different? I see you guys talking about amps all the time - and I dont really know what you're on about. Are there different types of amps for different playing styles? Whats the deal? I dont get it But I will. with your help... I will.

 

Ohh yes. I will conquer musical knowledge... with the help of my new friends here at musicplayer.com hehe..

 

Ta Myles, and anyone else who can help. Wickerman? Cereal? Tedster? TurboDog? Ta guys, I want ou and all others here to know that you have really helped me open up a new phase in my life - without knowledge from you guys, I'd never know what to do. I've been into music for years - but been clueless. Now, I a learning so fast, I dunno what to do with myself Muahaha...

 

Thankyou guys... and dont forget the questions

 

Ta

 

Nolly (the crazy aussie newbie)

[gtrmac]

Get a tube amp, all tube, no transistors. If you're just starting out on electric you need to hear what the thing is really supposed to sound like. Modeling is for skinny girls.

 

Marshall, Fender, Vox, Matchless, they all make real tube amps.

[myles_rose]

Originally posted by Nollykin:

Heyyy. hope the subject got your attention.

 

Right. Well.. now that I'm here, I'll begin. I am a new guitarist, and if you have read any other posts of mine you'd know I'm just about to buy my first electric - so I dont know heaps about them. HOWEVER, my friends have basic electrics (yamaha and samick respectively) with amps of the same brand (bought in packs). So thats about the extent of my knowledge on amps..... yeah.. not much.

 

I have guessed form hat I have read that "modeling" amps are the electronic ones like Line 6, Yamaha DG etc, that recreate the sound electronically. And Tube amps are the "standard" amp. Is this about right?

 

My question is thus: What is a tube amp? What sort of things make the sound quality different? I see you guys talking about amps all the time - and I dont really know what you're on about. Are there different types of amps for different playing styles? Whats the deal? I dont get it But I will. with your help... I will.

 

Ohh yes. I will conquer musical knowledge... with the help of my new friends here at musicplayer.com hehe..

 

Ta Myles, and anyone else who can help. Wickerman? Cereal? Tedster? TurboDog? Ta guys, I want ou and all others here to know that you have really helped me open up a new phase in my life - without knowledge from you guys, I'd never know what to do. I've been into music for years - but been clueless. Now, I a learning so fast, I dunno what to do with myself Muahaha...

 

Thankyou guys... and dont forget the questions

 

Ta

 

Nolly (the crazy aussie newbie)

Nollykin;

 

Lots of questions here ....

 

I think the first thing you might do is go to my website as a lot of your questions are answered there, with attention on tubes and how they work, etc.

 

The other folks you mentioned, have a lot of expertise too, and I think that any advice they pass on to you would be great advice.

 

Let me know what questions you have after you look around on my website a bit.

 

You might want to ask next time in a little post I put up as I get email notification when somebody asks something there. I saw this by luck as it was still a current post.

 

Regards;

 

Myles

[Sylver]

While in spirit I agree with Mac on this, I don't think it is as cut and dry for you Nolly.

 

The pros and cons ...

 

If you are going to buy an amp and money is an issue(as it is for most people), you could go all tube. In that case a good first amp might be the Fender Pro Jr. or an old Fender Champ. Small, not too loud and great sounding. The thing with tube amps is to get overdrive out of them, they need to be turned up. If you can't make a lot of noise, it's best to have an amp under 15 watts.

 

Now, the reason you should go with something else ... You're just starting on the electric and you may not know what you like, what your style is, or what kind of music you want to play. See, tube amps tend to sound wildly different from each other, and in a lot of the less expensive amps tend to be one trick ponies. My advice is to check out a lower price "modeling" amp until you know for sure who you are as an electric play.

 

Best of luck,

Jack

[Gabriel E.]

A tube amp is an amp that uses old fashioned, expensive, high-voltage glass vacuum tubes to to take the signal out of your guitar and make it louder. Vacuum tubes used to be used in TVs, computers, radios, audio equipment, medical equipment, radar, guided missiles, lie detectors and pretty much every other electronic device you can think of until the late 1960s when transistors, and later integrated circuits, took over.

 

ICs and transistors pretty much do everything better than vacuum tubes EXCEPT audio. While there are good solid-state (non-tube) guitar amps, the general consensus is that tube amps sound better. Audiophiles who spend thousands of dollars on handmade sterios also generally prefer tube amplification.

 

Tube amps generally sound "warmer" and produce a pleasingly smooth distortion when overdriven. All the guitar tones on classic rock records by Led Zepplin, The Who, AC/DC, Van Halen, the Beatles, Elvis, ZZ Top, Bill Haley, etc., etc. were produced using tube amps. In comparison, most solid state amps can sound great clean but sound harsh when turned up. This is because tubes produce even-order harmonic overtones when they distort. These are pleasing to the ear. Solid-state circuits produce odd-order harmonics when they distort which we tend not to like.

 

Solid state amps are getting better at sounding like tube amps all the time. Amps by Line 6 and Johnson use digital modeleling to "simulate" the sound and response of a tube amp (or many tube amps). They sound pretty good but they're still not there. Most people who think they are "just as good" have never heard a good tube amp cranked up.

 

In addition there are "hybrid" amps such as the Marshall AVT which use one or more vacuum tubes in the preamp but use a solid-state power section.

 

Of course not all tube amps are good. Snobs like myself look down on tube amps that use PCB circuit boards instead of very expensive hand-wired circuitry.

 

Many different companies make a lot of different tube amps. Tube amps are more expensive than solid-state but Carvin, Fender and Peavey all make reasonably priced ones that are suitable for a wide variety of music.

 

Of course with a little electronic knowledge, you can even build one yourself.

[Sylver]

While in spirit I agree with Mac on this, I don't think it is as cut and dry for you Nolly.

 

The pros and cons ...

 

If you are going to buy an amp and money is an issue(as it is for most people), you could go all tube. In that case a good first amp might be the Fender Pro Jr. or an old Fender Champ. Small, not too loud and great sounding. The thing with tube amps is to get overdrive out of them, they need to be turned up. If you can't make a lot of noise, it's best to have an amp under 15 watts.

 

Now, the reason you should go with something else ... You're just starting on the electric and you may not know what you like, what your style is, or what kind of music you want to play. See, tube amps tend to sound wildly different from each other, and in a lot of the less expensive amps tend to be one trick ponies. My advice is to check out a lower price "modeling" amp until you know for sure who you are as an electric play.

 

Best of luck,

Jack

[Nollykin]

Sorry about the over enthusiasm guys - I was attempting comedy... but I guess now that I look at it - it was just stupid.

 

Okay myles, ta for that site, and thanks to all who helped out too.

 

Nolly

[lrbreez]

It is true that modeling amps don't sound as good as a good tube amp, but they are closer that any of the traditional solid state and hybrids.

 

The advantage that a modeling amp has for someone starting out are:

1. You get alot of different amps so you can find out which you really like (then you can go out and but the real one).

2. You can get "cranked up" sounds at real low volumes, so low you can talk over it. So they are real good practice amps.

3. You get alot of effects so this can save you money when you are starting out and when you find an effect you like go get the real thing.

4. They are good for auditions where you are not sure of exactly of what kind of music they are trying to do. I use one on 75% of auditions.

5. When you play a crappy club and you don't want to risk your good amp.

6. They also record well. It is good to bring one along with you main amp to sessions (for the different amp models and effect models that you might not have).

 

Even though I use Line6 stuff I like the Vox better.

Buddy

[TurboDog]

Man you're getting some good advice here. Everybody is right on so far.

 

Most people's first amp these days is a small practice amp, like your friends. Understand, they are built cheap and sound like crap. But they get the job done in amplifying your sound. I haven't played thru a practise amp in a while, till my friend brought over a Midi out (you dont need to know what this means) practise amp, and I couldn't believe how bad it sounded.

 

Anyway, Gabriel gave a great post about tube vs. solid state. There are some very decent solid state amps, but few. Modeling amps are solid state amps that use a computer chip to make the amp sound like a popular sought after amp tone. They almost never get it right, but some come damn close.

 

I will say here, I have played thru some modeling amsp that were a lot of fun. They don't do any 1 sound great, but do many sounds pretty good. Now, I wouldnt go on stage with one unless I had to.

 

Shopping for tube amps is a blast. There are tons to chose from, and almost all sound different. And when you get one, you can further alter it's tone with tube/speaker changes.

 

My first recommendation, would be to find a nice used tube amp in the 30-40 watt range, max. Maybe even a 15 watter. Brands like Mesa-Boogie, Rivera, Marshall, Fender, Laney, Carvin, Peavey all have models in this range you can get for probably $500 or less used. After you have played this amp for months, you will know it inside out. And whenever you plug into someone else's amp, you will hear different characteristics, which you may like or not. If there are tones you're looking for that you can't find in your amp, then it's time to expand.

 

The type of music you play will largely determine which amps to look at. Some specialize in clean tone, some slightly overdriven, some a lot of gain. Some amps give great clean headroom, some breakup early and often for great distortion.

 

So I would ask, what kind of music will you be playing and/or whose guitar tones do you love?

 

I hope this helps, and didn't waste anybody's time. Good luck.

[Chip McDonald]

Originally posted by Nollykin:

[QB]So thats about the extent of my knowledge on amps..... yeah.. not much.[

/QB]

No, you know more about amps than you think. Watch...

 

Name me your top 10 favorite songs:

[Nollykin]

TurboDog: Ahh. Yes. I do actually know a bit - it seems. I peiced together things you told me, but you just confirmed those. However. 500 american is outta my range for now - like you said, I might go for a practice amp for now. theyre shit, I know. but I know of one that sounds pretty decent compared to others I have seen... a yamaha 10watt. its not too bad for a practice.

 

Chip: Bloody hell - thats difficult... you probably dont know much of them - I'll tell ya what. I like metal. basically. but not that heavy arsed, pantera crap, and not that punky, computerised crap.. I like metal with FEELING... something with some power and magic in the sound. When composing, I sing too, and I sing long, toned, drawn out notes (note: *sing* not scream), that go well with a heavy-yet-melodic style of playing - no death metal here - just good clean-yet-distorted electric guitar chords and notes. also like good sharp choruses too.

 

For a good example you would want to look at music by Devin Townsend. Try getting a song called "Life" by Devin Townsend - the album is called Ocean Machine.

 

So I like.. a clean and clear note for a lead guitar, yet distorted (but not too crunchy) chords in the back. I'd need two guitars to play my music. Two guitarists too. but yeah.

 

So uhh... there ya go

 

Nolly