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fantom X8 as stage piano


delirium

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Since I want to exchange my FP5 for something real pro I have a question.

Are there any cons against buying fantom X8 as stage piano (instead e.g. RD700SX)? On fantom you can get great deals right now, since looks like roland is preparing something new soon.

So I figure if I spend only few hundred more on fantom I get all in one solution(workstation, sequencer,drum pads etc).

action and Grand Piano patches which are most important to me looks the same on both and they are great.

thanks

♫♫♫ motif XS6, RD700GX
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Ill give my .02 cents worth of opinion if ya got change for nickle.

 

Based on your question there are only two sensible options. (in my humble opinion)

 

option 1.

Get the Fantom. Why, because you obviously would like the full workstation ability and will NOT get that with the 700sx. The 700sx does have a piano that is NOT on the Fantom but youve indicated that you are happy with the Fantom piano . The Fantom has a 'piano-mode' which sort of 'in a way' turns it into a stage piano (so to speak).

 

Also, even if you are not, you can add/upgrade your piano via SRX cards OR samples. You CAN'T add 'work-station' ability to the 700sx.

 

Conclusion; if you even think you want a workstation, youll regret buying the 700sx.

 

(holy crap, come to think of it, I may re-consider the Fantom myself)

 

option 2.

Wait. If you think Roland is about to release something new (which I have no idea) and it is not an immediate emergency, then hold off a bit to see if and what they release. It may even be a better option then the Fantom.

 

If not, by then the Fantom may even be a bit cheaper.

 

 

....now, where can I pick up my nickle ???

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I had to make this same decision about 4 mnths ago and a bought the X8 . I have already made use of the extra features it has compared with the RD and the price difference was minimal.

Some things to consider :Make sure you play the piano sound through an amp (it has taken me this long to get used to it in the mid range )but with a little adjustment I am now starting to love it.

The RD has balanced ( cannon)XLR outputs , my other board has these and most sound guys love it.

The Rd is lighter and in most cases a stage piano would be slightly more durable for on the road.

These features of the RD 700sx are what nearly persuaded me two buy it but I have found the extras on the Fantom i.e. additional patches , dynamic pads , sampling , etc very useful even thoght 80% of gigs I use only AC and EL piano sounds . It is nice to have a few tricks up your sleeve so as I said it was the X8 for me.

JDP
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Con - Size. It is bigger and heaver than the RD. But for stage, that may be countered by a big

 

Pro - Notes on the display. If you choose to use the controller features to do a setup for each song, I believe you can also have some handy information pop up on the display, such as a basic chart of the song.

 

Robert

This post edited for speling.
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yes, the size is the main concern or rather weight,

but RD is not light either, both are much heavier then my FP5. Also RD has cool black beauty look, and fantom is kind a "ugly" :D , but you're right

big display can be useful for extra information.

Also both are made very sturdy, fantom even more I guess. These XLR inputs are useful? I don't see them in any yamaha stages piano either.

 

Anyway when we talk here about stage pianos usually yamahas PXXX are mention, but they don't have even half of the features of fantom for almost same price and sound is not better for me at all. Also P250 is not lighter much I guess.

♫♫♫ motif XS6, RD700GX
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You can bring the Fantom up to meet the RD-700SX's piano via the SRX-11 expansion board. Actually, I'm told by a couple friends who are hooked in at Roland better than I am that the SRX-11 actually has one additional sample layer over the RD-700SX Superior Grand, which would make it a step above.

 

My main gripes with the Fantom X8 are that it weighs a ton (even compared to the RD700SX, which isn't a lightweight), it's bulky (the 700SX is easy to carry because it's much less deep), and that it lights up like a Christmas tree, and in a gimmicky way.

 

If you're mainly looking for piano sounds, the Fantom X is overkill.

 

Another compelling option is the Nord Stage. Very tweakable, more so than either of the Rolands in terms of knobs and buttons on the front panel, very compelling sounds, and it weighs the same or less than the 700SX. Downside is that the action is crappier, but I'm finding I prefer my Stage 76 to my RD700SX on most gigs, it just feels more alive.

Current live rig: Roland RD700SX, Hammond XK-3 with Leslie System 21, and Muse Receptor. Also a Nord Stage 76 other times instead. And a Roland FP-7 for jazz gigs.

HOME: Kawai MP8 + a bunch of VI's.

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piano sound is not the issue here, I like both.

Personally I'd even prefer fantom piano over RD700sx. But I guess it's subjective as opinion about SRX-11 are too.

Issue is the value/price to the features ratio.

♫♫♫ motif XS6, RD700GX
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Another thing which makes the RD-700SX more suitable for live use (the context in which I assume you'll be using it, as you're talking specifically about a stage piano) is its digital organ model, which is apparently based on that found in the Roland VK-8. This means that you can get decent organ tones out of it, with near to the flexibility of a dedicated clonewheel (assuming an appropriate midi controller).

 

I don't actually own an RD-700SX (but during the brief moments I've had with one, the organ model sounded quite acceptable), and I don't know if organ tones are even that important to you, but it's another thing to consider.

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Originally posted by Jazz+:

The SRX-11 sounds inferior to the RD-700SX Piano 1, extra sample layer or not. I know, I have one.

[HIJACK]

 

Not to hijack the thread too much more than it already has been, but do you think this is the SRX-11, or the fact that you're playing it back through an XV2020 with 2-generation-old DAC's and effects? Of course the RD-700SX would fare better in that comparison. And who knows how much else positive and negative voodoo there is to contribute variables in both models.

 

I of course own an RD700SX but I used to gig regularly in a venue where the house had a Fantom X8 with an SRX-11 installed. I never played the two side-by-side, but I never remember enough of a difference that it stuck out to me.

 

[/HIJACK]

 

Re the fact that this is really about feature set and not sound, the Fantom X has more features, but also weighs more and costs a bunch more. The real question is, will you ever use those features to enough of a degree that the extra weight and cost is worth it?

Current live rig: Roland RD700SX, Hammond XK-3 with Leslie System 21, and Muse Receptor. Also a Nord Stage 76 other times instead. And a Roland FP-7 for jazz gigs.

HOME: Kawai MP8 + a bunch of VI's.

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Originally posted by Zeke Smith.:

Not to hijack the thread too much more than it already has been, but do you think this is the SRX-11, or the fact that you're playing it back through an XV2020 with 2-generation-old DAC's and effects? Of course the RD-700SX would fare better in that comparison. [/QB]

thats actually good poit, it would explain the differences.

 

Regarding costs, you can buy FX8 already for less then 500$ more then RD so thats the reason I'm considering it.

♫♫♫ motif XS6, RD700GX
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While my Fantom X7 is not weighted, the Fantom is pretty sweet for its ability to build a really nice set of 'favorite' patches. Patch editing is visual, and you have additional control options over RD with pads, D-beam, etc.

 

I also have an RD-700 (not SX), and except for the weight, I would whole-heartedly recommend the Fantom for live use. Go for it if you can get a deal.

 

Might be more versatile and future-proof to get Fantom X6 + weighted controller.

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FWIW... a close buddy just copped a fantom 8 and in the couple of opportunities ive had to play it was way impressed... he's running it through a pair of the alesis 300 wt amps which was over kill in the room... but still way cool keyboard...
"style is determined not by what you can play but what you cant...." dave brubeck
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I went to GC today and tried to lift it and put it under arm...doable! Not that bad at all. Another reason to go to the GYM :D

I tried also yamaha p250 (to lift) which is heavier and it was harder bacuase of its shape.

So I guess FX8 wil be my next stage piano soon :cool:

♫♫♫ motif XS6, RD700GX
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Originally posted by Phred:

Get the X8 - I hear Jordon Rudess is even using one now :eek::rolleyes:

yes, that assures me it's not such bad idea.

If I would also see that Chick Corea uses FantomX I would no have any more doubts ;)

♫♫♫ motif XS6, RD700GX
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I did try my SRX-11 in my friends RD-700SX just to hear if there was a difference and we noticed a difference.

Harry Likas was the Technical Editor of Mark Levine's "The Jazz Theory Book" and also helped develop "The Jazz Piano Book." Harry spends his time teaching jazz piano online and playing solo piano gigs.

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Originally posted by Jazz+:

I did try my SRX-11 in my friends RD-700SX just to hear if there was a difference and we noticed a difference.

difference in favour to what? RD or SRX?

 

I guess all difference between FX, SRX and RD are

flavour kind, not a quality one.

♫♫♫ motif XS6, RD700GX
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I have the RD700SX, RD300SX, Fantom X7, Fantom XR and all the SRX cards.

 

If weight/bluk is not a concern, I would use the X8. But for me it is. I gig at least once a week and the RD700SX has gotten too much for me and I use the RD300SX as a controller instead most of the time. I would put either of the RDs into a soft case. I would not do this with the Fantom as I feel it will just get too banged up because of its bulk/weight. Even an SKB case is approx 35 lbs so the Fantom X8 is around 100 lbs while the RD700SX/RD300SX might be 60 lbs and 40 lbs respectively, in soft cases.

 

The RD700SX has all of the Fantom FX plus FXs from the VR plus some dedicated ac. piano and el. piano FXs. The RD has a very nice B3 emulation with better leslie sim than the Fantom. There are some more esoteric piano effects such as string resonance that aren't available on the Fantom. The only thing that's significantly better in the RD700SX is the B3 sim. I agree with Jazz+ that you can't get the SRX-11 to sound exactly like the RD700SX superior, but you can get it close. The SRX-11 comes out of the box with a more mid-range sound.

 

I won't list all the advantages of the Fantom series as they are well known, e.g. sequencer...

 

Both are quite nice as live performance instruments. The RD allows you to quickly setup four banks of ten patches that you can get to with the touch of a button. The Fantom has a live mode that is similar but quite a bit more capable.

 

Busch.

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Originally posted by burningbusch:

I have the RD700SX, RD300SX, Fantom X7, Fantom XR and all the SRX cards.

 

If weight/bluk is not a concern, I would use the X8. But for me it is. I gig at least once a week and the RD700SX has gotten too much for me and I use the RD300SX as a controller instead most of the time. I would put either of the RDs into a soft case. I would not do this with the Fantom as I feel it will just get too banged up because of its bulk/weight. Even an SKB case is approx 35 lbs so the Fantom X8 is around 100 lbs while the RD700SX/RD300SX might be 60 lbs and 40 lbs respectively, in soft cases.

 

The RD700SX has all of the Fantom FX plus FXs from the VR plus some dedicated ac. piano and el. piano FXs. The RD has a very nice B3 emulation with better leslie sim than the Fantom. There are some more esoteric piano effects such as string resonance that aren't available on the Fantom. The only thing that's significantly better in the RD700SX is the B3 sim. I agree with Jazz+ that you can't get the SRX-11 to sound exactly like the RD700SX superior, but you can get it close. The SRX-11 comes out of the box with a more mid-range sound.

 

I won't list all the advantages of the Fantom series as they are well known, e.g. sequencer...

 

Both are quite nice as live performance instruments. The RD allows you to quickly setup four banks of ten patches that you can get to with the touch of a button. The Fantom has a live mode that is similar but quite a bit more capable.

 

Busch.

I see you're into Roland a lot :)

I didn't realized actually I need to add weight of ATA case to fantom weight :eek: Do they really weight that much? 35lb? Flying with this thing will be an expensive problem...

 

Somehow I didn't like SRX-11 in my juno anyway, but fantom ultimate grand is great for me. At this level all that is subjective;

♫♫♫ motif XS6, RD700GX
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