Motion sound vs. new leslie 21 system

[tonyd]

Does any have any experience with the motion sound products? How do they compare to the new Leslie 21 system?

[Dave The Rave]

Welcome to the Keyboard Corner Tony.

 

I had a MS Pro145 and a Leslie 21 system at the same time - I bought both and wanted to compare them side by side to decide which one to keep.

 

The Pro 145 is a nice small package that gigging players will appreciate. For its size, it's a remarkable box. It kicks out tons of volume. Since it has real rotating horns, it has a "real Leslie" sound. However, IMO, the amplifier and/or speakers used give it a fairly "nasal" sound (lots of middle, not so much bass and cutoff treble). Turning up the bass doesn't work - the speaker/cabinet/amp (combination of all I think) can't take it, and it sounds distorted, so you have to live with less bass than you'd like. Turning up the treble doesn't work either - for some reason, it just becomes very harsh sounding (I guess it's distortion that does that) and unpleasant to the (my) ears.

 

The ramp up/down and slow/fast speed setting pots on the Pro 145 are a bit difficult to adjust. I found I needed to keep a small screwdriver handy for this - bit of a pain really. Also, having all the controls on the front of the unit is not ergonomic IMO. I'd rather have the speaker up front with the sound output forward and put the controls on the back so I can tweak them while I'm playing.

 

The Leslie 2101/2121 system, IMO, sounds much better. Tons of clean powerful bass, gads of loverly Leslie sound in the middle and treble range, nice smooth sound overall. No distortion, nasalness, harshness etc. Just nice! The bass section uses a Leslie sim. I honestly can't tell the difference in the bass between a real rotating bass (Leslie 122A, which I also own) and the simulated Leslie out of the 2121.

 

I like the easier to use controls on the back of the Leslie 21 system also. No screwdriver needed.

 

The other nice thing about the Leslie 21 system is that it turns ON/OFF with the power switch on your Hammond Organ. In my case, I'm using a Hammond XK-3 with its standard 11-pin Leslie output, connected directly to the Leslie 21 system. It just works.

 

The Pro 145 does not have an 11-pin Leslie connector. I made up a homebrew 11-pin Leslie connector interface adapter for it. It worked fine, but is a kludge. It would be nicer if the Pro 145 had an 11-pin Leslie input right on the chassis (I guess there's a licencing issue that stops MS from doing this?).

 

If I have but one criticism of the Leslie 21 system, it's that the motor driving the horns is a bit loud (compared to my Leslie 122A). You only notice it when you're not playing though - as soon as you hit some keys, the organ drowns the motor noise (and horn swooshing!) completely.

 

In the end, I decided to sell my Pro 145 and keep the Leslie 21 system. I have not regretted that decision so far.

 

Hope this helps.

 

:DTR

[tonyd]

Dave,

 

That's exactly what I needed!!

 

Thanks so much!

 

Tony D

[Phil Aiken]

I'm debating these 2 choices also.

By all accounts the 21 sounds somewhat better - and it costs less.

Yet I'm leaning towards the Motion Sound. Why?

Well, I use a 122 on bigger gigs - I want something else for smaller clubs that is easy and convenient, and with which I have control over what is getting sent to the FOH.

I used to own a Motion Sound Pro 3T. It sounded pretty good, but setting up was a hassle. You have to go organ into Pro 3T into amp for the low end. Then the rotor would need to be mic'ed up, the low rotor DI'd, and the house guy would have to blend them. His blend would have nothing to do with what I was hearing on stage, and I didn't trust it.

It seems like the Leslie 21 is basically the same thing, albeit better sounding.

The PRO 145 on the other hand, seems like you just wheel it out, plug into it, and the sound guy can either

run lines from the XLR's, or you can do that, put em' into a mixer and just send the house stereo or mono out.

Sweet.

 

I'd love to hear more 1st hand opinions on these!!!!

 

I need to hear them both before I decide though.

[JMcS]

With the L21S, just mic the upper unit into the lower unit (it sounds great anyway) and send the lower unit's line out to the FOH, a second lower unit or wherever it needs to go.

[Phil Aiken]

posted 17-09-2005 08:44 AM                   

------------------------------------------------------------------------

With the L21S, just mic the upper unit into the lower unit (it sounds great anyway) and send the lower unit's line out to the FOH, a second lower unit or wherever it needs to go.

----------------------

But then you're likely sending a disproportionate amount of the low rotor to the FOH. If you have them balanced on stage, you're hearing the upper rotor directly as well as what you're sending to the low unit, but the board is only recieving what you're sending to the low unit.

[JMcS]

I have the mic a little to the side facing the louver at an angle so that it picks the horn up as it comes around. I don't know that it doubles the volume, but it may increase the length of time that the horn sounds like it is coming to the front from the L21S. The signal to the FOH would sound like one mic'd Leslie. I think, I could be wrong. No matter what, I don't think it would sound bad.

 

I think that the intended use is to have two lower units and mic the horn into the second one along with the right outputs of the upper unit.

[burningbusch]

I had the Motion Sound stack with the Low Pro. It used belts. I don't know if that true with the Pro145. I had issues with the belts on both the top and bottom units. The Leslie 21 uses a direct drive system which makes it more reliable and more programmable. You can, for example, program the horn to turn in the opposite direction.

 

I think the overall quality of the Leslie is a notch above the standard Motion Sound stuff (though I've never seen the Pro145).

 

Busch.

[JMcS]

Originally posted by burningbusch:

The Leslie 21 uses a direct drive system which makes it more reliable and more programmable. You can, for example, program the horn to turn in the opposite direction.

 

I think the overall quality of the Leslie is a notch above the standard Motion Sound stuff (though I've never seen the Pro145).

 

Busch.

The L21S uses a DC motor so both speed and direction are variable but there is a belt from the motor to the horn. The motor assy. has a spring tensioner so that if the belt does stretch any the slack is taken up.

[Stephen Fortner]

Dave the Rave wrote

It would be nicer if the Pro 145 had an 11-pin Leslie input right on the chassis (I guess there's a licencing issue that stops MS from doing this?).

I don't think it's a licensing issue... the model Motion Sound aims at churches and homes, the MS-1771, has an 11-pin connector, as do Roland clonewheels. With the Pro-145, they probably just wanted to keep it simple. It does mean you have to use a footswitch for speed, where the 11-pin lets you use the simulator controls right on your organ. (Both Hammond and Roland do this).

[DaveMcM]

Originally posted by Stephen Fortner:

where the 11-pin lets you use the simulator controls right on your organ. (Both Hammond and Roland do this).

FYI: Diversi organs also use an 11 pin connector.

 

Dave

[Dave The Rave]

Originally posted by JMcS:

Originally posted by burningbusch:

The Leslie 21 uses a direct drive system which makes it more reliable and more programmable. You can, for example, program the horn to turn in the opposite direction.

 

I think the overall quality of the Leslie is a notch above the standard Motion Sound stuff (though I've never seen the Pro145).

 

Busch.

The L21S uses a DC motor so both speed and direction are variable but there is a belt from the motor to the horn. The motor assy. has a spring tensioner so that if the belt does stretch any the slack is taken up.

The MS Pro145 also uses DC motors with electronic speed control, but their belts don't have tensioner mechanisms (not that I could see anyway). The switched mode power supply feeding the motors is fairly noisy and noticeable at low speeds - it kind of "whines" at you.

 

I have also noticed this a little bit on the Leslie 21 system, but not so loud as on the Pro145. For live gig purposes, you won't notice any of this on either unit. I only mention it because I was looking for the best solution for my ultra-quiet studio environment - if you're mic'ing up for recording purposes, it's something to consider - you might need to use a noise gate.

 

While I'm on the subject of noise...has anyone else noticed that the left audio output on their XK-3 is (much) noisier than the right output? Do I have a defective unit? I swapped cables and mixer inputs and the problem stays with the left output of the organ always. Weird.

 

:DTR

[burningbusch]

Originally posted by JMcS:

Originally posted by burningbusch:

The Leslie 21 uses a direct drive system which makes it more reliable and more programmable. You can, for example, program the horn to turn in the opposite direction.

 

I think the overall quality of the Leslie is a notch above the standard Motion Sound stuff (though I've never seen the Pro145).

 

Busch.

The L21S uses a DC motor so both speed and direction are variable but there is a belt from the motor to the horn. The motor assy. has a spring tensioner so that if the belt does stretch any the slack is taken up.

Didn't know that, thanks.

 

Busch.

[Jack Kent]

I have an XK3 in my immediate future, and I am inclined to step up to the Leslie 21 upper and lower, but that is based upon what I can read only, so far since I haven't been able to find any to try out locally.

 

From those who own these units, and also use a digital piano on stage, are using the lower unit for the organ only, or can a digital piano plug in lower unit? Looking at the marketing sheets I can't tell. Assuming that much is correct, and that it doesn't interfere with the interconnect of the upper unit to the lower, how does it sound?

 

I am fortunate to have some money rolling in, so I want to step straight up to the right gear, but a reasonable economy of size is a factor, both a full Leslie 21 set plus another amp is getting up there is terms of haul in and room on stage.

 

The Motion Sound KBR3D looks like it could serve as the one amp, but I would like not to be working with another floor pedal for speed control, and, I am hoping the Leslie sounds better than the KBR3D I was able to test.

 

How about it? Can the smart folks on this list keep me from making a mistake?

 

Thanks, The new guy.

[David Loving]

I have read that the leslie 21 system handles another keyboard input, too. I'm not sure how many, and I do not have one, I just remember reading the manual online somewhere.

[Dave The Rave]

Jack - you can try a L21 system at the Guitar Center on Stevens Creek in San Jose - it's only 45 mins from SF. Last time I was in there they had one hooked up to an XK-3. If they don't have the set up still, get back to me and I'll see what we can set up.

 

Dave - The L21 upper unit (Black = model 2101) has one mono line input jack that will allow you to connect external instruments to the rotary channel. Two audio connections are usually made between the upper and lower units as well as a remote control cable. This leaves you with one more line/mic input on the lower unit (Black = model 2121). It has a Neutrik connector (XLR with 1/4" jack in the center), 48V switched phantom power, a separate volume control and a line/mic gain switch. If you wanted to put more instruments through the top or bottom units, you could use a small external mixer and feed its output into the L21 system. It would make a very cool keyboard amplification setup IMO.

 

Cheers,

:DTR

[JMcS]

Originally posted by Dave, the Rave:

While I'm on the subject of noise...has anyone else noticed that the left audio output on their XK-3 is (much) noisier than the right output? Do I have a defective unit? I swapped cables and mixer inputs and the problem stays with the left output of the organ always. Weird.

 

:DTR [/QB]

If you are using the 1/4" outputs along with the 11 pin Leslie cable to the L21S, the signal at the right 1/4" output does not go through the Digital Leslie. That may account for the difference you hear. On mine, when listening with headphones, with the L21S turned off, both sides of the headphones sound the same. When I turn the L21S on, the right side gets quiet. The noise I hear seems to be a small amount of Leslie mechanical noise built in to the Digital Leslie's sound. The noise tracks the speed of the Leslie.

 

In an earlier post, you mention that you don't need a screwdriver to adjust the upper unit. There are two small recessed pots for adjusting the volume of the frequencies below 125Hz and the volume of the frequencies going to the horn. If the 2101 is going to be attached to the same amp consistantly, this would be a one time adjustment to balance the three volumes: Horn, mid-range (the lower rotary sim'd freq's going to the lower unit) and bass (freq's below 125Hz that don't go through the rotary sim and are sent to the lower unit via the Sta./rotary bass outputs).

 

The Rotary volume knob on the upper unit is an overall volume control for the three components of the overall sound. If in adjusting the small horn pot one turns it up, and then turns the Rotary knob down because the overall sound is now too loud, the balance between the two is lost. The procedure I have used to balance the whole system is this:

Turn both of the small recessed pots fully counter clockwise to turn their volumes off. If using the 2121, set its volume controls as the manual shows: Input two (for the Sta/Rot. Bass signal) to 12:00, Input three (for the lower rotor sim signal) to 3:00 and the master volume control at a comfortable level (the manual shows 3:00, I have mine set at 12:00).

 

Set the XK-3 with a combination of drawbars that will provide a full range of equal volume frequencies ie: 16', 8', 4', 2', 1' and using something like a matchbook or wedges (hardware stores usually carry something called furniture or toilet wedges that are small nylon pieces that fit between keys) hold down a number of keys (all the C's works). Having the notes stay on constantly really helps. Set the XK-3's volume where you will usually have it. Now adjust the Rotary volume knob on the 2101 to a comfortable level. Set the Stationary/Rotary Bass knobs to match that position. If you will be leaving the 2101's stationary speakers on when you normally play, leave them on now, otherwise, mute them via the switch. At this point, you will hear only the sounds below the 2101's cutoff frequency that are going through the lower rotor simulator. Since the crossover between the 15" spkr and the horn on the 2121 is 700Hz, that is where I have the 2101 set. Now, turn the small pot for the horn up until the volume from the horn sounds "right" in relation to the lower rotary sim's volume. If the overall volume is now too loud to listen to closely, do not just turn down the rotary volume knob. Turn the horn back off and then turn the rotary volume down a little and re-adjust the horn back up. When those two volumes sound right, turn the rotary bass level pot up until it's volume matches the other two. Now that these three are balanced, the Rotary volume knob is now the overall volume control and when you turn it up or down, all three volumes move in tandem. In order to keep the volume of any signal using the Stationary outputs matching the rotary signal, always turn them to match the position of the Rotary Volume control. By using this procedure, you keep a steady reference point to adjust the horn and bass to. Otherwise, you can be tweaking for days and it just wont sound "right". If after you have the 2101's volumes maxed you still need more from the lower unit, first turn up the Master volume. If you have to adjust the two input's volumes, that 1/4 turn difference seems to be important to keep the balance between the lower rotary sim and the bass. Also, if at this point the horn needs to be louder, Hammond seems to have thought of this by building in a mic input. Mic'ing the upper unit into the lower unit sounds pretty good to me. I have a mic set just to the left of and slightly behind the left front corner to catch the horn as it comes around to the front through the louvres (my horn is set to spin counter clockwise). Pretty much what comes out the horn of the upper unit comes out the horn of the lower unit. I hope this helps.

 

As long as I'm writing a short novel, here are a few suggestions for the XK-3.

 

1: Get those Chinese tubes outta there. The tone is in the tubes. Try some old 50's/60's era GE's. RCA's, Raytheons, Sylvania's etc. I just installed a set of 1956/57 Amperex long plate tubes and I am in tonal bliss. I've written about tubes in the XK-3 Tips thread so I won't rehash it here except to say that the old tubes don't roll off the highs and lows like the new production ones do.

 

2: Set the Expression - Min Level (See page 60 # 12) at -60, Exp.- Limit LF (pg. 60 # 13) at 0 and Exp. Limit HF (pg. 60 # 14) at 0. This affects the overall tone of the organ but really adds that Leslie "something" to the Digital Leslie.

 

3: Design a set of tonewheels that takes out a lot of the leakage noise and motor hum. Most of the tonewheels are set at or near the maximum range for both. You will need to use headphones for this and remember to turn foldback off. Refer to manual pages 64 and 65. This may take a couple of hours and it is easy to get ear fatigue while doing it. When you select a tonewheel to adjust (pick a middle one because it is easier at first to hear what the manual describes with those) adjust the value up and down to hear how the tone changes. Once you are familiar with what to listen for either start from there and work your way up and then come back to that spot and work down or start at one end and work toward the other. If you start at one end, when you get to the note before the one you have already adjusted you should think the setting is pretty close to the one you have already adjusted. If you don't, ear fatigue may be setting in and it is time to take a break. With each tonewheel there is a range where the tone of the note becomes "clean" and there is very little to none of the noise but the volume of that tone hasn't dropped or thinned out (per the description in the manual). The upper tonewheels have that range usually in the higher settings ie: 119 - 123, as you move to lower tonewheels that range drops so that by the bottom tonewheels, you may be in the single digits. Also, some of the higher tonewheels may have overlapping settings ie: TW's 88 and 89 may both have a setting range between say 112 and 116, TW 8 may have a range between 9 and 11 whereas TW 9 may be 12 to 17. Filtering most of the noise out really improves the tone of the notes primarily when playing chords etc. The biggest difference though is how it improves the tone of the overdrive. Since the tubes aren't distorting the leakage noise you lose the buzz but keep the sweet scream of the overdriven notes. Have I mentioned replacing the tubes? Also, keyboard bass note definition is improved as well. With the tonewheel set I am currently using, I have to pull the 1' drawbar out to about two (with the 1st three drawbars at 8) to match the sound of the 1st three drawbars only when using the stock "Real B3" tonewheel set. And to get an even closer match, I probably should push the 16' drawbar in to 7 or 6.

 

Old tubes and a tonewheel set that matches your taste and you will be in Organic Paradise.

[keyzzz]

Originally posted by Dave, the Rave:

Welcome to the Keyboard Corner Tony.

 

I had a MS Pro145 and a Leslie 21 system at the same time - I bought both and wanted to compare them side by side to decide which one to keep.

 

The Pro 145 is a nice small package that gigging players will appreciate. For its size, it's a remarkable box. It kicks out tons of volume. Since it has real rotating horns, it has a "real Leslie" sound. However, IMO, the amplifier and/or speakers used give it a fairly "nasal" sound (lots of middle, not so much bass and cutoff treble). Turning up the bass doesn't work - the speaker/cabinet/amp (combination of all I think) can't take it, and it sounds distorted, so you have to live with less bass than you'd like. Turning up the treble doesn't work either - for some reason, it just becomes very harsh sounding (I guess it's distortion that does that) and unpleasant to the (my) ears.

 

The ramp up/down and slow/fast speed setting pots on the Pro 145 are a bit difficult to adjust. I found I needed to keep a small screwdriver handy for this - bit of a pain really. Also, having all the controls on the front of the unit is not ergonomic IMO. I'd rather have the speaker up front with the sound output forward and put the controls on the back so I can tweak them while I'm playing.

 

The Leslie 2101/2121 system, IMO, sounds much better. Tons of clean powerful bass, gads of loverly Leslie sound in the middle and treble range, nice smooth sound overall. No distortion, nasalness, harshness etc. Just nice! The bass section uses a Leslie sim. I honestly can't tell the difference in the bass between a real rotating bass (Leslie 122A, which I also own) and the simulated Leslie out of the 2121.

 

I like the easier to use controls on the back of the Leslie 21 system also. No screwdriver needed.

 

The other nice thing about the Leslie 21 system is that it turns ON/OFF with the power switch on your Hammond Organ. In my case, I'm using a Hammond XK-3 with its standard 11-pin Leslie output, connected directly to the Leslie 21 system. It just works.

 

The Pro 145 does not have an 11-pin Leslie connector. I made up a homebrew 11-pin Leslie connector interface adapter for it. It worked fine, but is a kludge. It would be nicer if the Pro 145 had an 11-pin Leslie input right on the chassis (I guess there's a licencing issue that stops MS from doing this?).

 

If I have but one criticism of the Leslie 21 system, it's that the motor driving the horns is a bit loud (compared to my Leslie 122A). You only notice it when you're not playing though - as soon as you hit some keys, the organ drowns the motor noise (and horn swooshing!) completely.

 

In the end, I decided to sell my Pro 145 and keep the Leslie 21 system. I have not regretted that decision so far.

 

Hope this helps.

 

:DTR

This was really useful information to me!! I just have one question, does the 2101 leslie work in a independet amp, whithout bass amp 2121? 2101 have 2 bass elements, am I right?? And what those 2 other little elements do?

 

.. I'm a gigging musician in europe, and I'm searchin good leslie for gigs. I have used yamaha RA-50 and RA-100 leslies, but I'm not fully satisfied whit them...

[JMcS]

Originally posted by keyzzz:

This was really useful information to me!! I just have one question, does the 2101 leslie work in a independet amp, whithout bass amp 2121? 2101 have 2 bass elements, am I right?? And what those 2 other little elements do?

 

.. I'm a gigging musician in europe, and I'm searchin good leslie for gigs. I have used yamaha RA-50 and RA-100 leslies, but I'm not fully satisfied whit them...

The 2101 is a stand alone amp. The 5" speakers and 2" tweeters are for the simulated lower rotor and any signal provided by the stationary channels of the XK-3 or other Hammond models like the XE-1 via the 11 pin cable. Those 5" speakers put out a surprisingly strong/deep bass tone. For larger venues where very high volume is needed, the 2101 can be attached to a 2121 lower unit (or two). The 2101 can be mic'd into the second 2121 if desired. When the 2101 is connected to a 2121, the small speakers in the 2101 can be muted so that they are not damaged by the high volume. The 2101 can be attached to other amps, but the benefit of using the 2121 is that its crossover is set at 700 Hz. Pretty much everything that comes out of the 2101's Rotary Bass and Rotary channels is reproduced by the 15" speaker. Any Stationary signal will go where it needs to. If you mic the horn into the 2121, just about all of it will come out the 2121's horn. With other amps that have a higher crossover point, there may be a dip in frequency response right where the Leslie is trying to scream.

 

The user and service manuals for the 2101/ Leslie 21 System as well as other Hammond manuals can be downloaded from here:

http://www.hammondorgan.co.uk/download.htm

 

Good Luck

[jeejr]

Good forum! I have a couple of questions that I think might be relevant to this thread.

 

1) I went to the UK service manual site and they only have a manual for the 2121. I'm looking at buying a used 2101. Looks to be rather new, but when we ran 1/4" out of a Nord into the line in for the 2101 you had to put you ear next to the cabinet to hear something. No volume adjustment worked. The guys at the Guitar Center don't know anything about this box and they didn't have the manual on hand. The box is either broke, which is unlikely since they know the guy they bought it from, we're doing something wrong with the configuration or we maybe need to go into the cabinet via the 11 pin connector. I thought you could go into the box with a 1/4". Has anyone here had that problem?

 

2) Given the expense of the 2121 I'm looking to put off the purchase of that piece until a few more gigs. Has anyone used a different keyboard amp as the bottom for the 2101?

[Zeke Smith.]

Just to weigh in, I have both the 2101 and 2121, and I gig a lot with just the 2101 top unit, and I think the sound is perfectly fine for most rock gigs where you wouldn't be using a lot of the low end of the keyboard or pedals. For loud gigs, you'd need to mic it into the PA, but that's all. The sound is great, otherwise.

 

The 2121 is usable as a keyboard amp for other sources via the extra line input, but I'm not thrilled with the sound of it for that, especially for piano. It's just not as smooth in frequency response as I'd like, lots of peaks in the mid highs, and dips lower down it feels like. My Mackie SRM-450's sound way better for everything but organ. Maybe a good graphic EQ would help it.

 

Props to JMcS for all the useful information over the months! I've put a lot of it to work, including most recently replacing my XK-3 tubes with NOS GE/JAN 5751's. All of your suggestions have been to my tremendous benefit. Thanks!

[Bob Rinker]

Originally posted by jeejr:

Good forum! I have a couple of questions that I think might be relevant to this thread.

 

1) I went to the UK service manual site and they only have a manual for the 2121. I'm looking at buying a used 2101. Looks to be rather new, but when we ran 1/4" out of a Nord into the line in for the 2101 you had to put you ear next to the cabinet to hear something. No volume adjustment worked. The guys at the Guitar Center don't know anything about this box and they didn't have the manual on hand. The box is either broke, which is unlikely since they know the guy they bought it from, we're doing something wrong with the configuration or we maybe need to go into the cabinet via the 11 pin connector. I thought you could go into the box with a 1/4". Has anyone here had that problem?

 

2) Given the expense of the 2121 I'm looking to put off the purchase of that piece until a few more gigs. Has anyone used a different keyboard amp as the bottom for the 2101?

Jeejr -

 

Welcome to the forum!

 

I found a copy of the 2101 service manual online somewhere - not sure where, but PM me and I'll send it to you (about 5mB PDF). I haven't found the Owner's Manual anywhere.

 

The "Rotary Input" (1/4" line in) appears to go to the same place as the 11-pin audio in (Pin 1), so I think it should produce the same results. Actually, the Rotary Input is slightly less hot than the 11-pin audio, but shouldn't make much difference. So, I am guessing something is wrong with the unit you were trying.

 

- Bob

[Last Man Standing]

Hi, sorry to bump this thread! Im considering getting a 2101 cab and I'm wondering if it's possible to access the stationary channels it has for a second keyboard to use.

 

I play a Roland VK8 and Fantom X6, so the idea would be to have the VK8 connect via the 11-pin connector, but modify the 11-pins cable by splitting off the wires the stationary channel uses and extending these to go to the X6 via a 1/4 jack.

 

I'm a complete Newbie on Leslies, so just wondered if anyone had tried something similar or had any thoughts or comments on any issues I would get by trying this. Thanks.

[retrokeys]

If you are going to run another keyboard into the 21 system top unit, about the only way this works like a standard amp is to use your leslie controller to turn the motor off when you are using the second keyboard. The other problem is that the stationary speakers are pretty small and won't do real justice to a full range keyboard. You are better off using the top unit strictly for leslie horn and if you want to run a second keyboard, use the leslie 21 bottom unit (2121). I run an xk3 and nord 61 this way and have no complaints. Plenty of volume and the two part system is easy to transport.

[JMcS]

Originally posted by Last Man Standing:

Hi, sorry to bump this thread! Im considering getting a 2101 cab and I'm wondering if it's possible to access the stationary channels it has for a second keyboard to use.

Thanks.

Pin 2 is the left stationary in

Pin 3 is the right stationary in

Pin 4 is audio ground

 

I have read where someone added 1/4" input jacks to the back of the 2101. I think others have made small 11 pin cables with 1/4" jacks added on. Input on the stationary channels goes only to the stationary speakers and bypasses the low rotor Leslie sim. Signal input on the stationary channels is also sent out the stationary output channels.

 

Good Luck

[The Real MC]

I have tried to get the stationary outputs to work on the XK3 without success. I checked the manual, with the Leslie off it should do it. I'm missing something stoopid.

[JMcS]

If you have a 2/3 channel Leslie selected (pg. 68 #18) and the Brake and On LEDs are off, the sound should only come from the stationary channels. If you press the Brake button and cycle the brake off and on, with the On LED off, there should be a change in tone.

 

With a 1 channel Leslie selected, the tone doesn't change. You can have a 2/3 channel 122 type Leslie because in effect what is happening is you are switching from the Leslie to a separate Tone Cabinet.

[MikeT156]

Great thread guys. I use the Leslie SIM in my Motif ES8, I've experimented with different Chorus types and Speeds, as well as depth and it's not to shabby for a SIM. I get results I like better with some of the one's I set up than the factory settings, but usually Yamaha is fairly conservative on effects settings.

 

I've been eyeing a MS Pro 145 for quite awhile, I still think there's nothing better than physically moving air, but I don't have the $$ to buy anything. I've been playing music full time for a living and....it's not much of a living. But I've only been booking jobs since March and it should get better. More places are re-booking me and I got an agent that has higher paying, fun gigs. Just not enough of them.

 

If I even DO get my hands on some $$, I STILL want a DSI KB Evolver. Though a Leslie would keep me for a LONG time!

 

Thanks for all the info guys.

 

 

Mike T.

[Last Man Standing]

JMcS and retrokeys , thanks for clearing up how this works, much appreciated. I'll be getting delivery of a shiny new 2101 next week. Lookin forward to joining the Leslie owners club!

[retrokeys]

No problem. Glad to have been of help. Enjoy the 2101. It is a nice piece of gear but I warn you... you will soon crave the 2121 bottom unit. Good luck